137_Helen MacMillan
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Monica: Welcome to the Revelation Project Podcast. I'm Monica Rogers, and this podcast is intended to disrupt the chance of unworthiness and to guide women, to remember and reveal the truth of who we are. We say that life is a revelation project, and what gets revealed gets healed.

Hello everyone. And welcome to another episode of The Revelation Project podcast. Today I'm with Helen McMillan. Helen McMillan is an author, a life coach, healer and wise woman who facilitates the personal growth and healing that is integral to achieving. Your greatest potential in living your most joyful and fulfilling life through her one-on-one coaching programs, workshops, and retreats.

She equips her clients with the mindset, skillset, and healing that allows them to powerfully. And authentically create success from the inside out using their deepest truth and wisdom as their guide. She combines her strong, intuitive gifts with the practical expertise and wisdom gained from building three successful businesses being married.

Twice raising three boys while maintaining her sanity to help her clients create a life they love with ease and grace originally from Jamaica. Helen now resides in the USA with her husband, Gary and their dog. Sadie. Today, we're talking about her new gift, her new today. We're talking about her new book, the gift of pain.

Hi, Helen. 

Helen: Hi, thank you so much for having me 

Monica: Monica oh, thank you for being here. Ugh. The gift of pain. Mm. What a title? 

Helen: Mm, it's, it's almost counterintuitive, right? A lot of people go what . Yeah. The gift of pain, pain doesn't feel like a gift. 

Monica: I remember, you know, one of the healers I came across along my own journey, suggesting that, and I really remember feeling this deep anger come up in me because at that time in my life, I felt so victimized by it. I felt so acutely aware of my own suffering and for somebody to suggest that it was a gift made me deeply pissed off. 

Helen: I get that completely I've felt that way, myself 

Monica: And yet, you know, what I've come to understand is that it's happening for us. Whatever is causing the pain is the invitation to come closer, come closer, listen to what I have to teach you. 

Helen: Yes. Yes. And it's a. It's it's, it's a act of love. Mm it's. Act of love. And that's why it was so important for me to write the book and to, to talk about it and share about it. Because when we have the misunderstanding that most of us have that pain is bad and pain is a punishment.

Um, we react to it very differently and we feel like a victim. And who on earth wants to feel like a victim that doesn't feel good at all? And it's when we can shift that we can change everything and we can receive the transformation that's available in it in every painful circumstance. 

Monica: It's so true.

And of course, , this brings us to our personal stories, right. Because I think that we all have a very. Personal personal and intimate relationship with pain and suffering. And while I would love to say Helen, that I don't think pain and suffering is always necessary. Correct. I have yet to be proven otherwise, do you know what I mean? Like yes. 

Helen: Yeah. 

Monica: It, it just seems to be the consummate teacher, the ideal teacher, the it's, the it's kind of like the, mm. I would call it like the, the mirror, you know, life's mirror kind of that checks us and. into remembering that we are all connected. Mm-hmm but I'd love to hear your personal story, your intimate mm-hmm story.

Uh, your intimate relationship with pain and what, what led you to discover it as a gift. 

Helen: Mm. Yeah. So it's, it's interesting. I, I, I, I was literally born into pain. My mother got pregnant with me when my sister was only five months old and sh my mother was a nurse. Right. So, you know, you're supposed to know better and things were rough, cuz I was a third child and you.

And the shame that she felt she was so ashamed that she didn't tell anyone she was pregnant with me until she was, uh, started to show at about seven months. And so I literally absorbed a lot of that shame in the womb. So for me as a child, I wanted it, it it's interesting. We can come in with, with trapped emotions in our bodies.

And so one of the major trapped emotions I came in with was shame and emotions are energy, like everything else. And they have frequencies, right? So here I was vibrating and very much, and we attract what we vibrate. So there was a lot of it just called in a lot of experiences that would create more shame for me, unknowingly.

I would come to find out how that would serve me later in life. But as a child, I was also very intuitive and growing up in a house of secrets, my dad was gay and not out the closet so I lived in a house, uh, as a very perceptive being and surrounded by people who were in pain and not talking about it and, uh, seeing things other people didn't see.

And I thought I was crazy. so. I, I felt very alone and I felt different. I knew I was different because I was seeing, and hearing things that other people didn't was very intuitive and, and is what some people might call psychic. And I would hear spirits walking up and down in our house and have experiences.

And when I'd talk about it, people would look at me like I. Should be admitted to the insane asylum cuz they didn't understand. So I was depressed, but didn't know it for a lot of my childhood and I was angry. I was very angry and a lot of things just didn't make sense to me. To me, the world was a lot of people doing one thing and saying another pretending wearing masks.

So I learned, but what it did was honed the gift for me of. Learning to read people's energy. I can feel energy shift in an email because I couldn't trust. The people around me, I couldn't trust my environment. I also, you know, when you are in that state and you're vulnerable, you also tend to attract. So I was, uh, sexually abused by my favorite uncle and that I repressed, you know, because we, we repress things so that we can cope and we can survive.

One thing I am is a survivor. And so I repressed that and that didn't surface until I was 50 years old. Mm. I always, always was connected for, even with depression, even with I, I was always guided by something, something deeply internal, but the pain came to a head and it, it, this lack of self acceptance that I learned, right.

This, I felt like I didn't matter. I felt like I was alone. I felt disconnected. And. I learned to pretend really, really well. I learned to wear those masks. So I, you know, if you talk to somebody who went to high school with me, I, as I did the, uh, about 10 years ago, I ran into this girl and we reconnected and we were talking about what was true finally.

Right? Not what was. What we were pretending. And she said to me, you were one of the happiest people. I know mm-hmm . And I said, I was the most depressed person you ever could have met. I thought about killing myself every day. Mm-hmm until I actually did. My sister died in a car accident. We were only 14 months apart.

Monica: Mm. 

Helen: We did everything together. Our parents dressed us alike, et cetera. And she died in a car accident when I was 19 and she was 20. I was away at college. You know, that was an awakening for me, that began an awakening because I actually had a good reason. To express my pain finally. Mm. Yeah, because the world wants reasons.

Right? Worlds wants reasons. You ever, if you're sad people, the first thing people say is why are you sad? 

Monica: Yeah. It's like, it has to be justified. 

Helen: It has to be justified. So we learn to justify, rationalize, explain everything and you know, and if we can't, we took it away. Yeah. It was the culmination of all of that was I never learned to love and accept myself.

For who I was. I learned to pretend to be somebody else. I learned to hide who I was and it resulted in depression and that even that I would hide and. I actually went in and became a healer because I believe that we're always seeking our own healers, our own healing. I believe healers are seeking first and foremost, our own healing.

And then luckily we share what we learned with the world. , you know, and we're able to help others. 

Monica: Yes, 

Helen: The real turnaround for me, I think the ultimate breaking point I got married. I did, you know, I did well in school cuz we were always looking for acceptance. Right. So I was 

Monica: mm-hmm

Helen: smart. And I did well and I got the accolades and I did everything that the world said.

Should happen for me to be happy and successful mm-hmm . And so, by the time I was, uh, 24, I was married. I was had two children. I had a business, I started a, a business. It grew very quickly. I studied physical therapy, had a practice and then. My marriage broke up, I thought, okay, great. I need to, I need to find my joy somewhere else.

And I dated and dated and eventually found love again. And it was interesting because every I would, we're always looking for, well, we're taught to look outside of ourselves, right? For. The problem. We, we blame, you know, we, we project and I, so I that's what I'd learned. So that's what I did. I looked, I said, you know, when the, when I wasn't, didn't find happiness in one thing, I'd, I'd look in another, I, if I didn't find it in my work, then I found it in my relationships.

And then when I didn't find it in my relationships, I tried in my children and then in my friends and then in the places where I lived. And so I lived and I moved and the recurring decimal was. Mm, when was said and done, and it took actually a near death experience. I actually had gastroenteritis, it had flown through my household.

You know, children bring stuff home, everybody had weathered it and it landed me in the hospital and almost killed me. And I literally woke up in the hospital alone in the room and I started to cry. and I said, God, I've tried everything. I know. I have no idea how to fix this. I need help. Mm-hmm and my spirit did what it always does.

It leads me and it guides me in the perfect when student is ready, the teachers pair and through book and through seminars and through programs, I began to learn and recognize that what I needed to do was learn. To love myself to heal myself and to unlearn. One of my favorite quotes is from a book called future shock.

And it says the illiterate of the 21st century will not be those who cannot read or write. It will be those who refuse to unlearn and rele. So I went on a journey and that I, that continues to this day of exploring that inner exploration that stripping away that re-engaging, that falling in love with myself and understanding my worth and my value and how precious I am and learning to treat myself and speak to myself differently and choose for myself differently, which is a reconnection with the power.

That is in it and lies within each of us. And that is what I spend my time doing. And that's what I help others to do. 

Monica: There's so much in what you said. I wanna go back to the searching, you know, that mm. It's like the searching or the fixating on others. And if they would just fix this then, right. It's there's like always this, or if I were just had more money then, or if mm-hmm , if my circumstance weren't this way, then.

Yes. It's like the answer to all of these issues is hiding so close under our nose. That it's, we it's the last place that we think to look. And it's the moment that we start doing our revelation project and stop doing everyone. Else's mm-hmm you know, it's. And you said three things, but I caught two, which were mm-hmm to reengage with myself.

I started to, I think, I think I'm remembering what it was to speak differently to myself. Uhhuh think differently about myself mm-hmm and choose differently for myself. Correct. Those were the three things, right? Yes, yes. Yes. And until we really notice. The thoughts that we're thinking, the words that we're speaking to ourselves and the choices that we're making for ourselves.

Helen: Yes .

Monica: What we start to notice is actually, we're not making choices for ourselves. We're typically making choices to appear better to others. 

Helen: Mm-hmm 

Monica: Or we feel obligated to choose a certain way in order to belong or in order to be loved. And of course, we know that every time we do that, we are abandoning the truth, which is our true expression, which is our true self.

And it's the same way that we tend to speak to ourselves is in this very unconscious, but abusive way that over time erodes our sense. Of happiness, our sense of peace, our sense of mm-hmm intimacy or connectedness to others because there it's such a disassociated voice. 

Helen: Yes.

Monica: That is sometimes not even ours. Oftentimes it's the voice we picked up from all of the critics around us. Yes. And we internalized those voices and then we speak to ourselves with those voices. And as if it didn't hurt, The first time enough, right? That, that first time we heard that voice. 

Helen: Well, it's interesting, right? It goes back to that, you know, something that we've all heard, right.

Children live what they learn. Right. So we learn these patterns and sometimes we. Or just emulating, as you said, what's what we've seen somebody else do or what has been spoken to us? That's what we've learned. So for me, my mother was the most fiercely loving human being. She was a, a mother bear and she was one of my biggest abuser.

Mm-hmm . Right because she was living what she learned and hurt people, hurt people. And it, so it was it's it can be very confusing. So the, the, and the thing is that, that we, I see so often I I've experienced it myself and I see it so often. Um, And my clients is that we put ourselves down, you know, if there's so to find fault between two people, we take the blame first, right?

Mm-hmm we don't give ourselves grace we don't learn to give ourselves grace and we learn to blame. Uh, there are five freedom principles that I teach, you know, no shame, no blame. No judgment, no excuses, 100% responsibility. Mm-hmm because that's where you begin to take back your power. When you say it doesn't matter where I learned it doesn't matter why I'm doing this.

What is important is that I acknowledge this is what I'm doing. This is the impact it's having. And I don't like that. I want to change that. And that's where you take back your power, then you can do something about it. 

Monica: Yeah. I love what you said, cuz the, the fifth one, right. Which is 100% responsibility.

That's another one that really pisses people off, right? 

Helen: Oh, 

Monica: right. Because again, we're conditioned to blame and there's the way that the, the victim mentality. Can continue to be a very. sneaky force. Yes. You know, that continues to now I can hear the victim from miles away, but for the longest time, I didn't understand that I continued to make myself the victim.

And when you're the victim. Yeah. Everybody else is to blame for. What you yourself created with your choices, with the way that you speak to yourself and with the way that you think your thoughts, because that is, those are our manifestation tools. And so we've created something and then it's 100% our responsibility to uncreate it.

Mm-hmm. Uh, huh. And that is really, really a hard pill for people to swallow because they want it's as if by taking 100% responsibility. That I'm somehow saying no one else is to blame for creating this. And that's not what we're saying. Correct. What we're so it's like both of these things get to stand side by side.

It's like I'm taking full responsibility for what I've created and that's not mine. Yes. Right. It's like the, and becomes the thing where we can stand fully in our power and take responsibility for what we've created and see what we've created and understand how others have played a part in that creation.

But who's gonna get me out of it. Nobody's gonna save me, but me. 

Helen: Yeah. And I think importantly too, right. You're taking responsibility for what you've created, but most importantly, you're taking responsibility for creating something different, something that you prefer yes. For creating something better, something different.

That's the power, right. That's what we wanna focus on. You know, not where we've been. Now, you know, not even where we live. Yes. We want to take responsibility and acknowledge where we are now. And in that space open up. What do I want instead? What do I prefer? Yeah, it is such a P empowering place to live and.

One of the things that I've also discovered is that we fear, I love Marion Williamson's, uh, quote, you know, it's not, it's not our, the darkness that scares it's our light that we are afraid of. Mm-hmm we are afraid of being really powerful. Because with a lot of people have a lot, um, negative attachments to power and responsibility.

Yeah. And one of the things we hear is with great power comes great responsibility. And for a lot of people, responsibility feels heavy and it feels like obligation instead of choice and freedom and power, which is what it can. Which is what it can be responsibility. I always teach people to reframe it as the ability to respond and you get to choose.

How you will respond. Most of us are not at choice. Most of us are reacting. We are not responding. 

Monica: The reaction is not in itself. Kind of reveals that we're not at choice. 

Helen: Exactly. Exactly. 

Monica: Yeah, because it's, the reaction actually comes from the wound. It comes from the, yes, it comes from the kind of raw wounded place.

we haven't had a chance to kind of intimately sit with mm-hmm and hear it's request. Yes. Yes. Which is what's deeper inside of that pain. Is that there's a, a request. 

Helen: Yes. It's the invitation as I call it, you know, that's the subject, the tagline of the book, right? It's a, it's, it's an invitation, the gift of pain, an invitation.

To shift your perspective, reclaim your power and transform your life. That's what's possible when we learn to respond to it differently and embrace it, embrace it. 

Monica: That's right. I wanted to go back to something that you told us about with your story be I think it's remarkable that at age 50 Uhhuh, you.

We're able to reckon with sexual abuse that happened at the hands of your favorite uncle mm-hmm . And the reason that I think it's remarkable is because. It's there's this like, part of me that hears more there in first of all, wants to acknowledge that there's probably so many women listening. Mm-hmm who have had an experience with sexual abuse and they have just not allowed themselves to go there yet.

Mm-hmm mm-hmm and, and the other thing I hear is that. Just because you hadn't reckoned with that piece yet. It didn't mean it was gonna hold you back from all of these other growing opportunities. So what I'm hearing yes is that you were growing and thriving and choosing and speaking to yourself differently, but eventually you kind of came across one of these boulders that kind of is stuck in our flow and.

And usually it's like a past trauma or a pain that, you know, it's like, the onion hasn't required us to go there yet. You know, mm-hmm , as we kind of peel back the layers, but eventually you kind of peel a layer back and there it is. And you might say like, okay, you stay here in this layer and I'm gonna keep going.

Right. Like, I know we can work around these things, but I also know that there's something deeper available when we finally allow ourselves to. just brutally honest. And so I wondered if you could talk more about that, cuz I, I have this feeling that that's really important for women who are listening.

Helen: Yeah. You know, it's interesting. I truly have come to, I. Believe and trust that just as I said earlier, when the student is ready, the teacher appears when we there's an innate intelligence within all of us that is in charge. No matter how outta control your life feels that is guiding and protecting. And assuring you through this journey called life.

I believe there's a, a beautiful perfection to life, and that's hard to hear when you're sitting in the middle of a shit storm. Excuse my French. And so for me, I, I realized that there's a wisdom. And when you have the support, the wisdom, the resources, financial time wise, all of it. There's certain things that come together to create the perfect storm.

The perfect opportunity when something is ready. To be revealed to be healed, to be worked through our job is to recognize the nudges, the, the, the, if we can recognize it as a nudge, we don't have to get the two before I've had many, two befores upside my head yes. Okay. We can all raise our hands. Right.

And so, as we learn to listen to the whispers, Which is why we invite people to lean into the pain is that you find a safe space. You find the support, you set yourself up for success. And so for me, and the reason I preface it is that. It seems often counterintuitive like how it shows up is very often not the way the mind would expect it doesn't always make logical sense.

So I was actually in a mastermind working with a coach. With a business coach working on growing my business and making more money . And that month I had made more money I had ever made in my life. And it was ironic because at the beginning of the month, I actually had a thought for a moment. I don't even know if I can pay myself this month.

And I, and it was a fleeting thought, cuz I immediately said no Helen, cuz I practiced what I preached. One of my principles I teach is pay yourself first, what physically, emotionally, financially. And so I wrote myself the check at the end of that month, I was literally like, how on earth? I didn't have a special event.

I had nothing I could tie logically why I had had such an increase in income. That month? Well, of course, clearly clients were coming, but there wasn't a special event which would normally give that kind of an influx. So the following month I was about mid month, I was talking with my coach and she said, um, I said, you know, I'm really curious.

I just kind of lost my drive. I've lost my, I don't know. I. I don't know why I feel like this. I thought I would feel different. She said, I said, I've made all this money. This is what I've worked so hard for, for such a long time. How I, I thought I would feel different. And she said, how do you feel? And I paused and I really dropped in and I said, I feel terrified.

Mm. And she. When was the last, when did you, when have you felt that way before? Mm-hmm and boom, it was there just like that. I had a memory, I dropped into a memory that I had completely repressed. I was a young, under 10, maybe about six or seven, I guess, at my aunt and uncle's house. It was the middle of the night and I was up and I was screaming and I was crying and I was saying, take me home, take me home, take me home.

I wanna go home. Now. I need to go home now. And my. Was saying, don't be silly. It's the middle of the night everybody's sleeping. We'll take you home. First thing in the morning, just relax. You know, you be, you know, and I remember she was there, but I noticed my uncle wasn't there and she was comforting me.

And, and then I remembered sitting by the window. Waiting for Dawn waiting for the night to be over terrified. And I felt in the moment as the memory came, it was like I was there physically, emotionally. I was weeping. I related the story to my coach and yeah, so it was interesting. I actually, that woke up something in me.

And so it seems illogical that making more money. Then any, you know, would tie in for a while. My brain was kinda like, how did that unearth a sexual abuse? And I didn't know what happened in that moment, but I know something had happened. It would take. A couple of years and I went and did the hypnotherapy.

So it awoke something in me. I actually, ironically, this is an important part of the story. I was coaching a cousin of mine at the time as she had doing some life coaching with her, she had been laid off from a job. And we actually had a call that afternoon after my call with my coach. And my spirit said, share the story with her.

Mm-hmm . And I, after our session was over, I said, by the way, I need to just share something personal with you. And I told her what happened. And she said to me, you're not crazy. Oh my goodness. She said, you're not crazy. I know there at least three others that he's whatever she said that there, it's not me to tell you their story, but you can talk to.

Monica: And Helen was just, just to kind of, so, so it was like you were the age that you were, and you had the memory of sitting in the window and waiting. Yes. And he wasn't there, but he had been there earlier in the night is what I 

Helen: just, there was just unknowing at that point in time, there was just unknowing and it was so funny.

I said it to my cousin. I said, I don't need anybody to validate this. Right. I don't need any, I don't know what happened. But I know something happened and I know something happened with him. Yeah. That's all I knew in that moment, but there was such a fierce knowing. There was no question in my spirit about it.

And actually I went and did hypnotherapy 18 months later to retrieve the memories because over the course of the 18 months, I start a little self doubt started to creep in because I didn't have the memories mm-hmm and I, and I didn't wanna lose that trust in myself. And eventually, you know, it was, it was, it was a process of seven years.

On and off, I would do a certain amount of work. Take a break, let that integrate, but it, it was very, it led. Very very deep work and opening over time. But yeah, the triggers, the triggers can 

Monica: be the triggers and back to kind of the gift of pain. Right. Mm-hmm because what I'm hearing, because mm-hmm, again, like just to be really clear for the listeners.

Here's like, no, the abuse is not a gift. Right, right. Like we understand correct that, you know, we don't wanna, we. Gratitude on that at all. Right. That's not the point here. The point is there was a way in your process of healing that you had to trust yourself yes. That you had to trust yourself that like your body actually held a wisdom.

Yes. That your mind was trying to reckon with, you had to trust your body's response. And it was actually the terror. That connected the dots, the terror that was showing up in your body held the memory. Yes. And it was somehow associated with, and I always look at money as the symbol of. Value or worth. Yes, because we can tend to equate.

Right. We can tend to look at money at, in, in a symbolic way, in this case. And so it brought up the feeling of not being able to pay yourself. Mm-hmm . If we were to replace that with the terror of not being able to value yourself. Correct. 

Helen: Yes. And it's interesting. Over the years, I've really come to see where that our money is tied to our self love, our ability to receive period.

Period money, love, you know, attention, compliments, whatever it is very much. Yeah. And so it's always tied to our bottom line. 

Monica: yes, it really is. And it is the bottom line. Isn't it? Exactly. Well, I really appreciate you going more deeply into that story, Helen. I really honor your share and I thank you for your generosity in sharing that with.

Mm-hmm I also, one thing that you say is that pain is a gift that we must not it's like, let me re rephrase this. That pain is a gift, but we must learn. To live with it or not live with it. What do you say? Not to live with it? Not to live with it, 

Helen: especially from a background in physical therapy. Right? We, we are pain management specialists, really a lot, right?

Yes. With injuries and healing injuries and stuff. People come to us in pain and. Many times when someone has chronic pain that's been going on and you know, they haven't found relief here. There, the medical system has tried to help them, blah, blah, blah. Not so much now, but certainly, you know, decades ago they would, some doctors would literally tell the patients, you have to just learn to live with it.

Monica: Okay. Yeah. It's like, it's like, it's in the same realm of it's just the cross. I bear. Exactly. It's like, oh my God, please don't say that ever again. Yes, yes. 

Helen: Yeah. And because the minute what we do, it's, it's, it's like when we, well, one of the things we teach people is to learn to live in the question, right?

Yeah. Because when you are, when you're asking question, your mind is, and your consciousness is open to solutions, it's searching naturally. It's trying to find a solution. If you are in a conclusion when you absolutely, uh, quantify something, it says, I know. You've slammed the door short on any other possibilities now.

So there's a way to be in your know. It's the yes. And yes. And not the either or yes. And yes, this is what I know right now. And what I've learned at this point in my life is there's still so much. I am yet to be aware of that's right. So that way we can leave the door open for this or something better.

Yes that rather than closing ourselves and limiting ourselves, because we can only create from the level of awareness and consciousness we have now. 

Monica: Yeah. Like resignation is not your friend. 

Helen: No, it's not. And yet, and yet. It can open doors. There are times when we resign and we surrender and we quote unquote, give up.

And what we've done is we go, you know, F it and we let go trying to control. We surrender. And then the universe can kind of take the boat, turn it around and head us downstream as Abraham would say, but it is so everything has its limitations and everything has possibilities. So we don't wanna play in limitation.

We wanna play in possibilities. And so, so that's why we don't wanna close that door by saying I'm gonna learn to live with this pain. I, that then we're not engaging with it anymore. We're not engaging with it. We're not curious about it. We're not, um, dialoging with it. We're not in conversation with it in relationship with.

Yeah, I 

Monica: think it's really hard for a lot of people to believe that their birthright is to be filled with joy and to live a pain free life. Like that is heaven on earth is to, and that is part of the unlearning. And so what I hear you saying is that if we're still in pain again, watching your language with yourself.

Mm-hmm because if we're still in pain, are you gonna finish that sentence with, because I deserve to be, or are you gonna finish that sentence be and say I'm still in pain because I haven't discovered yet. Or I, but there's, but there's definitely, there's more to be revealed is the point here there's more to be revealed.

And so if you are still in pain, there's more to be revealed. And that is your invitation. 

Helen: Yes. Yes. To stay open to it. And it's okay to acknowledge when you feel frustrated and tired and even feel hopeless. because you've been struggling with your pain for a long time. Mm-hmm and you've tried many different things, but I've had people who've come to me and said, I've tried everything.

And I said, yes, you've tried everything that you know, that you know, and maybe there's something that you don't yet know that you haven't yet tried. And that's why you're here. Yes. And inevitably, I just had the conversation with someone the other day and I was like, have you tried this? Have you tried that?

Have you tried this? Have you? No, no, no, no. And that, that just the conversation gave her so much hope. Yeah, because it opened up possibilities of new things for her to try. So that brought hope. 

Monica: Yes. I love that. And there's, there's that part about the surrender? What I've come to discover is that there's also stages to surrender.

Helen: Oh yes. Because 

Monica: We think we've surrendered. Right. And then we're like, oh, there's like 10 layers of surrender here. You know what I mean? And it's like surrendering to asking for help, surrendering to. The floor surrendering to, right. Like all of the, so yes. For those of you that have cried in your shower and Nel in surrender, that is one stage, right?

Yes. Yes. I'm just gonna say that because people will be like I've surrendered and it's like, there's. There's more, there's more layers of surrender here. Yeah. 

Helen: It's like the universe goes, but wait, there's more 

Monica: But wait, there's more. And this is the part that I love about the card that we chose, because here's where we chose the sacred fool from the sacred rebels guidebook and the sacred fool I'm getting the chills is all about continuing to.

Believe, continuing to know, continuing to approach the world and yourself with curiosity and faith. It's like, think about the world is burning down in some areas. And this fool is walking around whistling, like looking at the sky, you know, like that's what the fool is all about. The sacred fool. Really about the desire to operate more radically, the desire of life to operate more radically through you so that you become the conduit through which miracles and wild synchronicity can occur.

Yeah. It's like, that is what the sacred fool is all about. And. That can sometimes like our pain can lead us to these places that we never, ever, ever thought it was possible for us to then come into the space of miracles. But in fact, that's where it was leading us all along. 

Helen: Huge, you know, last year I lost my, my cousin when my sister died in that car accident, 41 years ago, my older cousin.

Became like my sister and she died last year of, of stomach cancer. And it, I, it sent me into, I was very I've, you know, I'm very much a death doer. I, as well as a life coach I've I am have the honor and privilege of being with many, many, and are sharing them, you know, being with them as they transitioned.

And I. I never expected to respond the, the, or react, react, respond to go through what I did, uh, afterwards. And it sent me into the void, which is where I just, my spirit calls me to let go of everything and go deep within. And I literally spent six months in the void. And it was such a deep letting go and letting go and letting go and letting go of things that I didn't even know I was holding onto that's right.

And that pain opened. It took me into places of deep self care and counseling and event. I've never done that. And it opened so much that you cannot see, you cannot see at the doorway. And this is where we have to get that self awareness and that connection with self and building that self trust is so.

Vital to the deeper journeys that will bring greater expansion and joy. On the other side, it's always an invitation to something better. And it means that's right. Not, you can't imagine what it will look like. Mm-hmm , you cannot. And so it's easier sometimes with support and I, if for those of you listening, know that this level of trust.

is built. It's built, you know, the level of trust I have. I didn't start out with this kind of trust in myself. Mm-hmm so wherever you are today, That's okay. It's a great starting point. accept yourself wherever 

Monica: you are. Right. Actually it's so it's so true, which brings me to our next question, which is about how is pain showing up in your life currently and how is it serving you?

Right. But before we go into that question, I wanna point out something that you said, because for my listeners, what else Helen was just kind of pointing to, was what? I also call a dissent. It she's, she's talked about going into the void, right. And it's the place where. we go in and down. Mm-hmm , it's like we go within and we go down into the mass of it.

We go down into the deepest dark of it. We go down, down, down where we, where we think like, we'll never come up again. Yes. And that is the shedding place. This, this can also be looked at as an, an initiation. And as the, I think it's the Japanese that say down. Up eight, you know, you kind of come up a little bit higher and there's that gift.

There's that treasure that you found at the bottom that you come up with, that there's this beauty in the shadow that there's this gift inside of it. That unless you go to the very depths of it, you will not necessarily come back with that treasure and it will keep calling. Down down, down until you're willing to go.

And this is also, I wanna also come to. Next question by answering it, which is kind of where Helen was headed with you. Don't, you know, this faith and this trust, it's not an overnight thing. And so I wanted to liken it to where I am right now, which is that over the course of the last. Few years. I had a frozen shoulder and so frozen shoulder has kind of like reorganized my whole body.

And I'm continually kind of in this skeletal pain as a, as my body is kind of readjusting now that it's thawing out and I'm finding that like every other day I have like neck pain or low back pain or like, or hip pain, because everything is trying to REI. and what's also been true, is that with the frozen shoulder, I wasn't able to work out the way I normally did.

Mm-hmm and it was the pandemic and I wasn't able to go and see anybody to help me with a different way to work out. So I'm thinking about what you're saying and it's literally, for me, it was like starting back at three pound weights mm-hmm and exercising those muscles again, and like trusting. My body is going to get stronger.

And this is the same thing that we wanna do with the three things that we were talking about, which is our thoughts, the way that we speak to each other, the thoughts that we think, and also the choices that we're making it, these little tiny, it might not seem like a lot, like let's say, I know this is a silly example, but let's say like, you know that you're gonna get inflamed.

If you eat the gluten and the choice there. Is to not eat the gluten, but the more you make that choice, the less inflamed you are. And the more you exercise that choice of loving yourself, because there's a way that we think we're loving ourself when we choose the gluten cuz it's what we want. Mm-hmm but it's also kind of like the, the easy way that erodes us later.

Uh, huh. And so there's always kind of the unintended impact as well of a choice and starting to think through or intercept or. Sometimes when I was doing this work in the very beginning, I would literally, and I do this with my kids all the time. I would literally say rewind, let me, I let me hit the cancel button and let me speak that again.

Right. Because I'd speak to myself in a kinder way. My son came home a couple weeks ago and he came in and he slammed and I go, Hey, how was your day? And. Fine. And he slammed down his book bag and I said, SHA, why don't you try that again? And so he literally picked up his book bag, put his shoes back on, went out the door and came back in again.

And of course he was doing it for my entertainment. Yes. But it was such a great, it was also like, Hey mom, how are you? You know, like, yes, he. Came came into the house in such a different way. And that's, and I wasn't asking him to spiritually bypass. I was act actually asking him to be aware of his impact.

Yes. 

Helen: And, and make a different choice, practice a different 

Monica: choice. Yeah. Yes. And then we could talk about, Hey, what's really going on. Mm-hmm mm-hmm so, anyway, it's just like these little things that make such a difference. So yeah. So pain is showing up in my life right now. And how it's serving me. Yes, yes.

Is it making me remember? That I can start with these tiny little choices and movements and smaller weights and build my strength back up. It's like, it's serving me. The pain is serving me and remembering like, this is how we begin again. Yeah. 

Helen: And also, you know, when you're you say, for example, you know, you reach for something in that shoulder.

How gives you a pain it's saying right now that movement in that direction is either impinging something or what there's a pro I don't want you to do that right now. right. For whatever reason, ISS a protective thing, but also it's, there's so many layers of invitations, right? Like, how am I even feeling about that?

Is it it's sometimes that pain. Is is forcing you if it's your right arm or start, it might force you to ask for help and support. Could you hand me that? Could you get that bottle of milk outta the fridge? Because I can't lift it with cause it's eight pounds. Right. And it hurts my shoulder. Honey, could you help me to get my shirt on?

Could you zip up my, like so many ways that it can serve us there? So many infinite possibilities. And so for each person, the thing is to be curious to ask the question, not make the assumption. Yes. Ask the question. And it's never, usually just one cuz you know. Source is abundant, right? Life is abundant.

So it might be a myriad of ways it wants to serve you. Yes. And so we, we be open to be open to all the possibilities. 

Monica: I love that. And, and how about you, Helen? How is pain showing up in your life currently and how is it. Serving you. 

Helen: Yeah, well, you know, I, I just, um, I just wrote a book on the gift of painless I'm putting into the world on July 12th. So 

Monica: That was painful, right? or was that a total pleasure? or am I just projecting? Just kidding. Oh, no, 

Helen: That it was. That book was eight years in progress and, and it was finished and then not finished and then had many iterations. And last year I became the damn book 

Monica: Yes. Oh my gosh. Write the damn book. Yes. Oh my gosh. 

Helen: And then it felt like it was something stuck in the, my birth canal, you know, mm-hmm and literally, and then anyway, so we found Bina and world publishers and they have beautiful.

Been my B the doulas that have helped to birth the book. However, what I know, because I, I, I'm a teacher and a, and, and a leader, and I know that we are, I, let me speak for myself, have always been called to go deeper on any subject matter that I'm about to teach mm-hmm and or that I'm declaring myself to the world to be somewhat of an expert in that, of course, spirit just laughs you know, expert.

Yeah. So, but so my pain. I just lost my mother, um, in on the 22nd of April. And she was 92 years old and I am the gift, the deep gift of that pain. Well, first of all, she was healthy. We celebrated my 60th birthday. I had a big party at the end of March and we had big weekend celebrations in Jamaica where I'm from and she was there and it was lovely.

And then three weeks later she was dead. Wow. And we had no. and she had no clue. Well, she might have had a clue in her spirit, but she wasn't sick. Right? Yeah. She was then became sick the week afterwards was sick two weeks and she was gone. And so here's the gift in this pain. My mother, as I mentioned, was the source of a lot of my pain earlier in my life and my mother and at her 90th birthday, I was giving a speech and I said, mom, you and I have been to.

And back, and we are landed squarely in heaven. Mm-hmm I wanted a relationship with my mother, a certain relationship with my mother, my whole life that I didn't have, that I saw other friends having. And that's the power of desire and intention. And I did whatever I was committed. I did whatever it took and it was painful.

We went to some painful places, including me, not speaking to her or not taking her calls for three months when she was 85, she could have dropped it at any moment. I didn't, but I was committed. And we had for the last 10, 15 years, we've had the most amazing relationship. Wow. And three years ago, she said to me, I feel so safe with you in my.

Oh, and so I grieve and I love that I'm grieving deeply because we loved deeply and we created a relationship that is bringing pain to let go of . Yeah. And it speaks, it sounds counterintuitive, 

right? 

Monica: Yeah. No, I so get it. 

Helen: Yes, yes, yes. And the same thing with my, you know, life just brings everything. Right.

So here it is, my mother. I was, I was in Jamaica. We buried her and. And then I get a call that our dog is in the pet. ER, our beautiful Sadie had to rush home because she is also terminally ill now. And we are enjoying every day we have with her. And you know, when she shows us that she's. Done and we don't want her to suffer then we'll love, thankfully have the option of putting her to sleep.

Monica: Yes. 

Helen: But, um, yeah, so I'm squarely in the midst of pain and, and the pain of letting go a life that was and embracing and opening to what this new. This new reality will be without these two really important, important people in my life. Yeah. 

Monica: Yes. Oh my goodness. yeah, well it, it is. It's there. You know, it makes me think about the way that we can sometimes see beauty in pain.

Right. It's like, it's a, I think it's the reason people call it exquisite, right? Yes. There's like, there's like an exquisite pain sometimes. Yes. And that's, that's that kind of a pain. That's like what I'm really hearing as it relates to your mother is there's no regret there. Like you, yeah. You went there and it wasn't about the outcome.

It was about being true to yourself. Mm-hmm and your needs and wanting to feel seen and heard mm-hmm and to reckon with what was true for you in an effort to reveal, feel and heal what you could. Yes. And sometimes we have people meet us there. Yes. And sometimes we don't. Yes. But you were the point is you were willing to stand there.

You were willing to take a stand for what was possible. 

Helen: Yes. And she did not meet me there initially. She firmly refused. 

Monica: You were like, yeah, I be standing over here. 

Helen: Yeah. I'll be standing over here, you know, and happy to, you know, so yeah. I wanna be really clear about that. She was not, and I had to accept that that was okay because she had a choice.

I had a choice, but so did she, and I, it's not, it's not about forcing and one of the most magical miraculous things that we get to experience when we do the inner work. Is the way that when you are true to yourself, when you work on you. That the world magically begins to mirror that back to you. Yes. And it seems like the world has changed, but it's really just you, that has changed.

Monica: That's right. and the world reorients to exactly right. It's like we train the world how to be in relationship with us. And so yes, yes. The retraining, you know, can be very interesting and it can take time for things to realign. Yes. You know, Yes, but it, it, but when it does, it is divine. So beautiful.

Beautiful. Well, I have loved this conversation with you and I wanna offer you my sincere congratulations on your book, which I know is a gift to the world, and that is the gift of pain. So thank you, Helen, for your work. Thank in the world. Yes. And is there any place that you would like to lead our audience to learn more about.

Helen: Sure they go to, they can find us on social media under, um, Instagram, our sovereign minds. Uh, Facebook is sovereign minds, LLC. And, uh, my website is it is sovereign minds, llc.com it Helen mcmillan.com will get you there. Sovereign mines.com will get you there. We made it really easy for people to find us.

S O V M I N D S. Dot com is probably the easiest to remember. 

Monica: Awesome. Okay, great. We're on all the social media as well. Yeah. Okay, perfect. Perfect. Well, we'll look forward to following you more there and for my listeners, I'll be sure to put all of Helen's. Links in the show notes. And until next time more to be revealed, we hope you enjoyed this episode.

For more information, please visit us@jointherevelation.com and be sure to download our free gift, subscribe to our mailing list or leave us a review on iTunes. We thank you for your generous listening and as always more to be revealed.