TGT 040722
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[00:00:00] Joe White: Welcome to the get together all over the world. There are people thinking about and creating a future of live digital events and performances. 

[00:00:09] Jess Ryan: They're disparate innovators who are artists, tech, founders on profits and investors, and they need a place to gather and share ideas. That's what the guest 

[00:00:18] Joe White: gather 

[00:00:18] Jess Ryan: is all about.

[00:00:19] Jess Ryan: Now. I'm just a theater creator who loves bringing people together around technology art and 

[00:00:24] Joe White: the inner, and I'm Joe, a tech and media startup bet with over 10 years of experience growing and 

[00:00:29] Jess Ryan: operating businesses. Thanks for getting together with us. Let's dig in

[00:00:43] Jess Ryan: how are you doing today, Joseph? 

[00:00:46] Joe White: You know, alive? Yeah. Although I'm not half as busy as, as you and a few of our other teammates. Um, yeah, it's, it's a fun busy week. We've got a lot of shows coming up. Sure. Do, how are you feeling? [00:01:00] I'm pretty sure you're supposed to be editing something right now. What are you doing?

[00:01:02] Joe White: And you're a 

[00:01:03] Jess Ryan: hundred percent. That's correct. You want to know the truth of how I'm doing? Let's talk about the truth. I I'm having a really great time. Um, yeah, we're getting ready to tell some really important, amazing stories, especially for amplify on Monday night, I'm having a really good time. Uh, by the time you hear this, the event will be over, but we have this concert called amplify on Monday night and it's with an incredible group of collaborators, just like dream humans.

[00:01:29] Jess Ryan: I was thinking about this the other day at home. I was like, oh my God, I'm getting paid to do the thing I've been wanting. Well, I have been doing, you know, for the last 10 years. And that's just incredible. Like, it's so incredible, but I'm also like struggling with like trying to not get run over. There must be a startup term for this, not get run over by the, just like snowballing feeling that like things aren't working or aren't going to work.

[00:01:55] Jess Ryan: And it's just a product of like, if you're listening, like, Hey, y'all, we are, I'm [00:02:00] assuming a lot of you are founders as well. And even if you're a founder, if you're an actor, you're a founder. If you run a business and be like, I had friends who died in a tornado and. You know, we're trying to like break into a new business model for our company and it's unclear exactly how that's all gonna play out and just stuff's tight right now.

[00:02:21] Jess Ryan: And it's like that. I'm just like, I'm just like having one of those times where I'm like, oh, well it's struggling a little bit to just keep feeling like it's all past. 

[00:02:30] Joe White: I feel like there is a term for this. Right. But honestly, before we go there, I'm sorry. You're feeling that way. It's a heavy, heavy mix of weeks and days.

[00:02:41] Joe White: Um, there certainly is. And there's definitely an idea of like a sophomore slump in the oh, interesting in the sort of startup world where it's like all of that energy that you brought into sort of that first year in that first fundraise and that first product, eventually all that, those first becomes seconds and thirds and you like, [00:03:00] look at it and you're like, what the fuck was I thinking?

[00:03:01] Joe White: Like, you know, that, that dream pitch deck that you had or that vision and that story you've been telling to other people, and then all of a sudden you're kind of telling it to yourself and I'm like, wait, what's real anymore. And uh, at some point it kinda like comes crashing back down to reality. It's like we do live here.

[00:03:17] Joe White: Yeah. Yeah. And it's it's I it's it's yeah. It's definitely a thing to sort of hit back in that reality and be like, what the hell am I doing? Like it can't is this even possible? Like, you know, cause you're, you're no longer feeding yourself that vision. You're just trying to actually make that vision come true.

[00:03:36] Joe White: And it's like the reality of all the hardship. And I think it's a place to, to come back to a term that I, I have taken an adopted from you and that the theater community of the cognitive dissonance it's like, we like kind of have to compartmentalize a little bit and let both of those things be true at the same time, the grand vision that you believe that you can reach and the reality that you weren't.

[00:03:59] Jess Ryan: quickly or [00:04:00] in a plannable manner. And 

[00:04:02] Joe White: I mean, it's just the reality that it sucks. Yeah. 

[00:04:04] Jess Ryan: Yeah. I mean, that's how, I mean, I definitely feel, that's why I kind of wanted to bring it up actually was exactly for that reason. It's like, I know it's the cognitive dissonance. I know it's a season. It's just a, which I just love to call things seasons.

[00:04:16] Jess Ryan: Even if that season is one week long, right. What a season? Um, it's a season and it is a product of just like a lot of circumstances coming together that won't last forever, right? Yeah. I do obviously believe we can do this and are doing this. It's not, nothing is like dire at all, you know, but, and I think it's healthy to, to be working.

[00:04:38] Jess Ryan: Uh, on the occasion. So that's all to say. That's why I wanted to bring it up because like, I don't think there's any shame or weird, not, you're not implying this, but shame or weirdness and saying like, I'm just like struggling. This is a season where I am struggling to believe, like we can make all of this happen, you know?

[00:04:52] Jess Ryan: Cause it happened like that is a 

[00:04:53] Joe White: thing that I haven't shit is so real shit is so 

[00:04:57] Jess Ryan: real. And it re I feel like I've told this story before, [00:05:00] but it reminds me just now I realized it reminds me the moment that I'm having a hard time with reminds me of my, my first weighting job in New York city, which was at Joe Allen, which is a famous theater restaurant.

[00:05:13] Jess Ryan: And so this restaurant has a really weird schedule, right? Because everybody fills the restaurant at 5 45. There's basically a seating at 6, 6, 15 and six 30. And then everybody's gotta be gone by seven 30. Most people want to be gone, you know, except the real new Yorkers who like, you know, lumber out five minutes before their show.

[00:05:32] Jess Ryan: Um, And I would 

[00:05:33] Joe White: stress me out. Just thinking about it's like, no, I gotta be in that theater in my seat. What if I have to pee? Do I want to drink? I probably want to, I should get a drink. 

[00:05:41] Jess Ryan: Oh, $30 sippy cup of a wine. Hey, if I'm going 

[00:05:44] Joe White: out on the town right. Experience. 

[00:05:47] Jess Ryan: Um, and I was panicking, you know, like I'm wired to want to do a good job.

[00:05:52] Jess Ryan: And you're in the middle of that high stress night after night where you're just like, I literally don't know how I'm going to get everybody out of here. And my friend, Jimmy [00:06:00] Harley said sister, every night, everyone goes to the show. It happens every single night. We will get it done. You'll you will get it.

[00:06:08] Jess Ryan: It will actually get done. I don't need to, don't need to stress so much about it. And that is actually exactly what I feel like in this moment of like the, you just described the moving out of just like the big vision part of the, the work and into the sustainability of that big vision and the driving forward of it every day currently has felt like that panic of how am I going to get everybody fed paid, whereas the next, you know, customer kind of come from all of that stuff.

[00:06:43] Jess Ryan: And it's a little harder than the restaurant to really like. Confident that the next thing's going to happen and you're going to keep building the building blocks. Cause a little bit of it's out of our 

[00:06:52] Joe White: control. Yeah. It's like that theater show. We're not putting on that theater show while you're currently serving this 

[00:06:57] Jess Ryan: and they are not committed to doing something at eight [00:07:00] o'clock.

[00:07:00] Jess Ryan: Yeah. 

[00:07:01] Joe White: But, but I feel you, and I do think like maybe in, in whatever, this, uh, Jokey startup paradigm. It's like, you know, stage one. Great idea. Super high stage shoe, sophomore slump, stage three, something else better. I'm sure this exists. 

[00:07:17] Jess Ryan: Yeah, no like you need to get, you need to workshop that and come back and give me something better.

[00:07:22] Jess Ryan: Yeah. I believe in, 

[00:07:24] Joe White: I swear something better. My theory happened before we all die. I don't know. What's that one in economics. This is the one. I actually like an economics, which is a, in the long run. We're all dead. Yeah, that's good. I like it. Cause you know, economists love to talk about the long run. It's like, well, you know, across the long run X, Y, and Z is going to happen.

[00:07:43] Joe White: It's like, I can't fucking wait for the long run. I got 

[00:07:46] Jess Ryan: rent to bed. It's so true. Yeah. It's like a weird, I also found myself just thinking, carrying the unit. I feel like we talk about this a lot when you're a theater person. Your job is like your life. Like it's the thing you care [00:08:00] the most, you know, it's, it's the, it's our reason for being here right.

[00:08:03] Jess Ryan: Is to make art. And so your work colleagues are also your friends and your family and the work that you do, doesn't contain between nine to five, which largely is because you really like it. And a startup is, is in some ways, at least for me, quite like that, right? Like this is, I've taken that sort of ethos into building something that like, I want to exist in the world.

[00:08:26] Jess Ryan: And that feels like. Everything which exacerbates these seasons of like being very, very, uh, worried that it's not going to work. 

[00:08:37] Joe White: Yeah. All the eggs in that one 

[00:08:39] Jess Ryan: basket, which is not true also to cognitive dissonance. 

[00:08:43] Joe White: Isn't true. Not true at all. It's not true. Yeah. I went through a phase of that in like 2017 where I had a little bit of a breakdown.

[00:08:49] Joe White: No, don't tell me that. It was just like, I can't have my identity be so wrapped up in work because it's not healthy for 

[00:08:56] Jess Ryan: me, for me in that moment. Um, 

[00:08:59] Joe White: and that was [00:09:00] like, I think I wasn't a founder at that time. And so it did feel a bit more like a broken contract between, you know, the world that I was promised by this startup culture nonsense.

[00:09:08] Joe White: Um, fun fact startup culture is nonsense. It's good nonsense. It's bad nonsense. It's nonsense. Um, so it does feel a bit different and a bit better to be in the founder role and to have a bit more control, a little bit more skin in the game because. You can't ask the same founder mentality of people who are not founders.

[00:09:29] Joe White: No, they don't have the same skin. They don't have the same financial upside. It's not the same. Yeah. So, um, go, uh, go take your startup founder mentality and shove it. 

[00:09:41] Jess Ryan: Well, I think that's an awesome segue into our guests today because they are two people that make me feel confident again and make me remember.

[00:09:49] Jess Ryan: We're part of an ensemble in some ways, right? Of a lot of other people working in similar fields and uncertain and similar visions as us. 

[00:09:58] Joe White: They are wonderful. And, uh, [00:10:00] I am really excited that we got to talk to them today and that you all get to hear this conversation. So there 

[00:10:03] Jess Ryan: are a duo today. Carlin Connolly is a former, a startup co-founder and, um, she wrote in her bio for us, but I can also confirm from personal experience.

[00:10:15] Jess Ryan: This is true. And amateur dinner party host. She does it very well. She does crush a dinner party, correct crusher that she's the cheeseboard of dreams. Uh, and, uh, she is one. Of a cool company called marquee digital with Joe Chism, who is her co-founder and he is also an actor and an entrepreneur based in New York city.

[00:10:36] Jess Ryan: Um, he's got a really cool history. He had founded a web design company about 10 years ago. So that's been like his side gig, which, uh, has helped, uh, immensely, I imagine in the founding of marquee digital. 

[00:10:48] Joe White: Yeah. And Marquis digital they're amazing company, um, which we're going to talk all about across this episode is a interactive digital programs for audiences.

[00:10:57] Joe White: So they're stepping into and disrupting a [00:11:00] space that hasn't changed for a hundred years longer than that. And, and with it, they, they bring a focus on accessibility on sustainability and, and there's a lot of like really, really nice sentiment underneath why this company should exist just beyond disrupting the market, which I think is really, really important in this era of 

[00:11:19] Jess Ryan: new companies.

[00:11:20] Jess Ryan: Also, we're incredibly biased. We've used the Marquis digital for a couple of shows and think it's a really, really important component to successful live digital. So, sorry, not 

[00:11:29] Joe White: sorry, supervised showing our hand, but now that we've said it loud, it doesn't count. 

[00:11:34] Jess Ryan: We hope you enjoy getting together with Joe and Carlin of marquee digital.

[00:11:44] Jess Ryan: Hey Carlin. Hey Joe. Thanks for joining us on the 

[00:11:47] Carlyn Connolly: podcast. Thanks for having a 

[00:11:50] Joe Chisholm: happy, happy to be here. 

[00:11:51] Jess Ryan: Happy Tuesday, or where are you all coming in 

[00:11:54] Joe Chisholm: from, from. Um, Hamilton Heights, New York at my [00:12:00] desk 

[00:12:00] Carlyn Connolly: and Hamilton Heights, New York in my closet. 

[00:12:05] Joe White: Oh gosh. The Hamilton Heights like helps to elevate it and the closet brings back down to reality.

[00:12:12] Jess Ryan: Um, for those of you, maybe we'll just take a screenshot only for subscribers or something. Cause you should really subscribers only likely we'll start our Patrion just off the basis of this screenshot. Perfect Lord. All right. So we have been dying to have you all on because I'm sure as you know, we talk about live digital here at the get together.

[00:12:36] Jess Ryan: Theater and accessibility and technology and all those good topics. And, uh, you friends are, are some of our biggest inspirations in this space. And so we've just been, been waiting for the day to get to talk to you. Um, and so maybe we should kick it off with a little bit about yourselves in case folks are not familiar with the, the myth, the legends that are Joe and Carlin and marketing digital.[00:13:00] 

[00:13:00] Carlyn Connolly: Well, let me start off by saying that, you know, the feeling is so mutual you too, and what you do inspires us deeply. And we feel so lucky. I was thinking about, um, the way we were introduced and it was sort of by chance that a little article was published about us and Emily McGill saw that and she shared it with you, I think.

[00:13:19] Carlyn Connolly: And then all of a sudden a beautiful friendship was launched and, um, we feel so, so lucky and so inspired by you. Um, believe it or not, we are coming up on our one year anniversary of inception here. March 31st will be the day that the idea he digital was 

[00:13:39] Joe Chisholm: born can't believe it's already been a year. It feels like 

[00:13:43] Joe White: so much longer, 

[00:13:45] Joe Chisholm: so much.

[00:13:46] Joe Chisholm: And yet, and yet you had still so much still 

[00:13:49] Joe White: to do. 

[00:13:51] Carlyn Connolly: Yeah. It's sort of like that weird pandemic year syndrome where, you know, it's like a full lifetime and also no time at all. But, [00:14:00] um, yeah, Marquis digital was born on, um, March 31st of last year. Uh, Joe and I are roommates. Um, and we were sitting out on the stoop or I was, he came back from a run and had this, this thought, uh, Jim thought run, thought, I don't know what you called it.

[00:14:18] Carlyn Connolly: Um, but yeah, he said, you know, at the time all the restaurants were reopening, we were seeing a lot of QR code, um, Based menus, uh, all around New York city. And he said, you know, it's so odd. Why, why is no one doing this for theater? Why are people not doing QR code programs and digital programs? Um, and I said, well, surely someone's doing it.

[00:14:40] Carlyn Connolly: And, uh, you know, we went away and did our research and no one was doing it the way we wanted to see it done. And we happened to be super lucky that Joe is an incredible web designer and has run a web design business for the past 10 years on top of also being an incredible actor and performer. Um, [00:15:00] And so we just sort of dove right in and, uh, Joe, you can take over here, but I think what did we spend two weeks working on the full idea and the product demo, and then we were, we hit the ground running, I think.

[00:15:14] Joe Chisholm: Yeah. I mean, I, Lord I need to have her introduce me all the time. Um, um, uh, uh, yeah, it was, uh, it was kind of a crazy, crazy couple of weeks because as soon as we realized that, you know, there were a couple of places companies out there that were creating essentially, you know, glorified PDFs, like, um, taking, uh, taking truly just like a paper native thing and just putting it into the digital sphere.

[00:15:46] Joe Chisholm: Um, and that was not what we really, what we wanted to do because we realized that, you know, if you're going to ask someone to take the leap of faith in the digital world forward, um, you know, what they need to have in their hands needs to be. [00:16:00] Digitally native. It needs to be focused, um, and modern and new and engaging and accessible.

[00:16:05] Joe Chisholm: All of the things that a printed playbill, um, uh, is not. And you know what I mean, PR I mean, not, I mean that I meant playbill lower P not playbill capital P trademark. Um, but, but, you know, I mean, the way we've been using printed programs hasn't changed since the late 18 hundreds, we set that we set that template and it's kind of remained the same and right.

[00:16:32] Joe Chisholm: I mean, you know, like when we, when we were first thinking of. Uh, as we started our Instagram prior to launch and, and, you know, dropping this little kind of cute ideas and things like that, like we were using gas lamps in theaters when, when the iterate, like the version of programs that we know today still were first introduced, you know, like, and I mean, granted, there's a whole lot of the theater world that still needs to modernize in many, many [00:17:00] ways.

[00:17:00] Joe Chisholm: And that's a long, long, long, long 

[00:17:02] Joe White: conversation. How long did y'all spend researching the history of the, the lower case P playbill? Like this is a history lesson right now is how much of that first two weeks was dedicated to the research on the plane. 

[00:17:13] Joe Chisholm: I mean, ironically lower, lower, lower, lower case P history is essentially very much related to upper case P sitting history, um, in terms of playbills.

[00:17:25] Joe Chisholm: So it's kind of all like tactics together. Cause they, you know, they kind of run the ship for a while. Um, they have. Yeah. And so we wanted to change the game, uh, and we knew that there were so many ways that, um, you know, you could translate, uh, from my world of web design and web development, you know, translate the accessibility factor and, and introducing every other aspect of, um, you know, modern, digital magic, um, into, uh, a modern digital program that [00:18:00] really, you know, it extends, um, connectivity between, uh, um, audience and theater and writers and artists and audience and local business.

[00:18:11] Joe Chisholm: And they just spiders out in like exponentially. As soon as you, you know, you harness technology for all of the good that it can. But yeah, that was a whole long rambling thing about, I think the Genesis of our, so usually Carlin's right next to me, whenever we have business meetings and this is about the time that she'll either elbow me or like, it can be in the knee saying that I smoke too much.

[00:18:33] Joe Chisholm: Um, 

[00:18:33] Carlyn Connolly: it's much less violent than that. It's normally like a gentle nudge 

[00:18:39] Joe White: Facebook poke. Exactly, 

[00:18:41] Joe Chisholm: exactly, exactly. 

[00:18:43] Carlyn Connolly: But yeah, I think, I mean, that kind of sums it up how, how we began, um, and you know, over the course of that first two weeks, we started to see that what presented initially as like an opportunity to create, um, you know, uh, problem solve for, for a COVID issue, which is [00:19:00] like eliminating touch points.

[00:19:01] Carlyn Connolly: Um, actually was the answer to many, many. Larger questions that we didn't even think to ask. So, like Joe said, you know, we suddenly thought, oh wow, there's actually a huge accessibility thing we can do here. Um, and that led to Joe working in, you know, uh, uh, a widget for ADA compliance. And so we have screen reader and dyslexia, friendly font and all of these wonderful things that are again, not available in a paper program.

[00:19:30] Carlyn Connolly: Um, we also were able to offer to theaters the opportunity to, to share a program with their, their people that were present in the space. And then the people that were at home watching digitally, which, you know, to marry those two, uh, two experiences together into one shared experience was really exciting for us.

[00:19:50] Carlyn Connolly: And, um, you know, social media engagement, all of that, wrapping everything up into one. Package, um, and being able to share it [00:20:00] as a, as a digital native experience for the theater goer, we just thought was so powerful. Um, and we've, we've had opportunities working with you to, to use, you know, live polling and, and data collection, you know, with the audience in the venue.

[00:20:14] Carlyn Connolly: Um, and it's just, it's been an incredible tool for connectivity, um, which is what it is really at the heart of the product itself, connecting, you know, every disparate facet of, uh, the arts and technology, um, and being able to share that as one community 

[00:20:31] Jess Ryan: roses and thorns, what's your very, like, what are you most proud of, or was the most exciting moment of your last year, this past year?

[00:20:41] Joe Chisholm: Um, uh, uh, I would have to say the most exciting moment was actually towards the end of the. Uh, this last calendar year, seeing that, um, you know, being a fledgling startup, we, we [00:21:00] surpassed seventy-five thousand, uh, marquees opened, um, on like across the world. Um, and I mean, and then the other, the other added thing to that, which is just recently happened, uh, was when we, when we threw together the initial demo, um, we created a completely fake musical, which should be created into a real musical.

[00:21:20] Joe Chisholm: We can do that later down the road dramaturgy 

[00:21:22] Carlyn Connolly: that I did on this musical that 

[00:21:24] Joe Chisholm: does not exist very, very deep. Uh, but you know, we, we invited all of our friends who are willing to be a part of it as like the actors and the creative, so we can show. All the uses of it. And so we had to create, uh, a bio for Marquis cause we were in the creative section.

[00:21:42] Joe Chisholm: Uh, and so we threw together a very kind of aspirational, um, fake ish bio cause our company hadn't fully launched yet and like 

[00:21:51] Carlyn Connolly: zero clients, 

[00:21:52] Joe Chisholm: nothing didn't exist at all. Uh, and the very last sentence of the bio was, and mark, he is thrilled to be making its [00:22:00] premiere in the west end market in spring of 2022, you know, and completely like, just like completely just saying this stuff, realizing that this is a completely fake musical and a fake musical program.

[00:22:11] Joe Chisholm: Uh, and then. Fast forward to a month ago. Um, we made our London premiere priests pre spring. Um, and, um, I might have another one coming up, um, in actual spring. So would be, it's a really kind of strange manifestation, um, which has just been a series of, you know, serendipitous meetings like us meeting you and, and, you know, these couple of people that have come into our lives, they've just sprouted conversations with the other more people.

[00:22:42] Joe Chisholm: And just like, it's, it's all just kind of happened in this beautiful way, but that was definitely like the fact that we were able. Look at that and be like, oh wow. We actually, we made that actually happen. Um, was exciting. That is 

[00:22:56] Joe White: so incredible. Congrats. Thank you. Thanks. It's funny. It [00:23:00] reminds me of like a, there's a startup trope.

[00:23:02] Joe White: It's like, I feel like it's like, uh, someone wrote a book sometime in the past 20 years. I was like, you know what everyone should do at a startup. They should do visualization exercises. Everyone should get fricking construction, paper and markers and write down like absurd goals for the future. Um, and you know, the, the whole idea of like, um, you know, if you're, what does that say?

[00:23:21] Joe White: If you aim for the moon, you end up in the stars or something like that. I don't know, whatever 

[00:23:25] Carlyn Connolly: the moon. You'll land among the stars. Yes. That was,

[00:23:33] Joe Chisholm: giving you a free taste of that. 

[00:23:37] Joe White: And like, there's obviously some truth in that. Like if you don't have big goals and you're never going to reach for them, but I like that y'all, didn't go through like the, the trite version of, of like creating these goals in some superficial way. There was like a really like genuine connection to that as a goal that manifested itself through the creation of this description inside of this sort of beta version, I [00:24:00] love just like how true it is, but it also sort of, um, ties into that, that startup trope.

[00:24:04] Joe White: Cause you know, at the end of the day, you all are a startup. W 

[00:24:06] Jess Ryan: I have a question, actually, this was something we had talked, Joe and I talked about back in the pandemic that w I found particularly challenging. So I'm really curious how you all dealt with it. A friend of mine, you know, says like big ideas need big space.

[00:24:19] Jess Ryan: Right. And that was hard to come by, at least in my experience in the past. Um, like we ended up solving for it by instituting a walking meeting on Fridays, just to like get out of the apartment and not have to be in the weeds and just talk. Did you all run into that as a challenge with a startup starting a startup during a pandemic?

[00:24:40] Carlyn Connolly: I think interestingly, I feel like I've sort of grappled with the, the opposite experience because I think that the pandemic actually created space for me in a way that I didn't have it before. Wow. And so, I mean, you know, I'm not exaggerating when I say that our product almost, almost [00:25:00] exactly how it is.

[00:25:00] Carlyn Connolly: It's, it's undergone some, you know, recent design upgrades and actually like, go check it out because what Joe did is really beautiful. Um, but our. Pretty much like fully came to fruition in two weeks. And the amount of concentrated thinking, talking question, asking and answering and conversations that had to happen in that period.

[00:25:22] Carlyn Connolly: I mean, I, I can't imagine being able to problem solve the way that we did right now, because right now I feel like I'm three times as busy as I was back then. Um, so yeah, I know, um, it's, it's ironic that you, you say that about the walking meeting, because Joe was just saying to me the other day, you know, we were, we were having these discussions thinking about the future of what we want to do with the company.

[00:25:46] Carlyn Connolly: And, um, you know, he was saying, I wouldn't have any of these thoughts if I weren't like out at the gym or walking the dog or whatever. And the very idea that sparked Marquis came from a run. He was out on a run. So, um, yeah, I [00:26:00] definitely, I, I definitely feel what you're talking about, but it, for me wasn't pandemic related.

[00:26:05] Carlyn Connolly: It was, um, something, yeah, something different altogether has to do with like the. Busy-ness that I'm absorbed in, in my life, I think. 

[00:26:12] Joe Chisholm: And I think that, yeah, I think we kind of, it benefited it in both of those ways. Like we had, I mean, it helps that we are roommates and best friends. Uh, and so, you know, every morning we sat at the coffee table behind me and we had our meetings over coffee and, you know, chatted things out and we still do that every, every morning.

[00:26:31] Joe Chisholm: Um, but. But, you know, we know we normally wouldn't have that time available to us, um, before the pandemic time for us to really carve out the time to be together and focus on that. Uh, and then, yeah, and then for me, my running, like that is my it's my therapy, it's my everything. It's like my, the time where my brain slows down enough to actually like, be able to think through things.

[00:26:53] Joe Chisholm: So on the daily, especially right now, as we're kind of moving towards phase two and beyond of Marquis, um, if I, if [00:27:00] I'm out, I'm on a run or if I'm walking the dog or if I'm coming back from the gym, I'll like immediately go and knock on Carlin's store. I'm like Jim thought and then like spew out a whole bunch of complete, like a random word vomit, and then like try and pick nuggets of something from it.

[00:27:16] Joe Chisholm: And then we like circle back and try to see if it was worth anything and half the time it isn't. But, um, but not true, but yeah. Oh, that was 

[00:27:26] Joe White: civilized. It sounds to work for your company. So we have a coffee around the table, you know, walk the dog and then I come back and we get to work 

[00:27:36] Joe Chisholm: that's because we have a common enemy, which is the dog, that's the chaos.

[00:27:41] Joe Chisholm: And so we have to balance out the chaos as much as possible. 

[00:27:46] Jess Ryan: I just want to validate your gym thoughts. I leave him, my Joe weekend stuff, thread in a slack. Cause so often that's like when I'm out to dinner or seeing a show or just working at home and thinking about stuff. And so [00:28:00] I've started, I leave him a thread of those.

[00:28:02] Jess Ryan: Exactly what you said. So just thought, so we should probably see if there's something in there. Maybe there's not, maybe it's just for reference and 

[00:28:09] Joe Chisholm: legacy. I I've thought of like, you know, taking out my phone and jotting down notes and then coming back. And the one time I did that, it all, I like looked back on it and I know if you've ever like written notes down and like looked back and it's completely.

[00:28:22] Joe Chisholm: Chicken scratch. And it makes no sense it's English language, but it's jarbled so I'd say immediately I like sprint home and I immediately just like throw it all out though. Cause I know that the minute it's like waking up from a dream five seconds later, it just kind of like disappears and you're like, no, no, I solved world hunger in that jury, we had flying cars and I know how to achieve it, but it's gone now.

[00:28:45] Joe White: I quite like voice memos for that sort of a thing. And I love Jessica sent me a voicemail, but every once in a while with a thing kind of like this, the weekend thoughts or the gym thoughts and they're, they're usually like, I think I understand what she's saying. We're going to have to connect on it. But at least we have, this [00:29:00] is digital representation of this idea.

[00:29:01] Joe White: So we have something to come back to because what you're just describing feels like anytime I have like tripped and I'm like, ah, at the most brilliant ideas in the world or, you know, I write them down then, like I come back the next time. Oh, I was tripping like quite literally. Oh yes. Yes. Not tripping and falling and 

[00:29:18] Jess Ryan: physicals you trip and fall.

[00:29:22] Joe White: But rather when I'm doing psychedelic drugs, 

[00:29:28] Jess Ryan: I was so confused. 

[00:29:30] Carlyn Connolly: Sam, 

[00:29:33] Joe White: clearly we're all figuring out which crowds.

[00:29:41] Joe White: I'm the, I'm the microdosing startup, bro. This group.

[00:29:49] Carlyn Connolly: We're the coffee table. Dog-walking 

[00:29:50] Jess Ryan: people. Oh shit. Um, I also want to ask you guys, as we all know, we're starting a company and trying to sell your product. You talk to 1 million [00:30:00] people. Um, what are the conversations in your sphere with the customers you're talking to around. Accessibility and like w why they are expressing interest in the version of the program, your building versus just doing a PDF for themselves.

[00:30:19] Jess Ryan: Like what, what is that conversation looking like over in program land? 

[00:30:23] Carlyn Connolly: Yeah, I think this is going to sound a little bit pessimistic, but, um, I think the accessibility features have been so important to us. Um, and to a lot of the colleagues that we've spoken to, but in the actual conversations with, um, you know, clients or potential clients, it seems like a bit of, um, you know, just sort of like a, oh, that's really nice.

[00:30:47] Carlyn Connolly: We didn't really think about that, you know, and it's interesting that people actually, um, the question they're asking before accessibility is actually like, what am I going to do about my patrons who need. [00:31:00] And we, you know, we've come up with a couple of solutions for that. Um, I don't want to take us too far off this topic, but, um, we offer like a one sheet that the theater can print in house that, you know, is still cutting down on paper, um, which is huge part of our initiative.

[00:31:16] Carlyn Connolly: Um, and then we've also, you know, we've really encouraged theaters to incentivize season ticket membership with like, you'll get a printed program if you're a season ticket member, because you know, the people who tend to be season ticket holders tend to be older and you know, more traditional and so on and so forth.

[00:31:34] Carlyn Connolly: So, uh, we've also said, you know, sell programs, whatever, you know, boost your sales, save your money, boost your sales, produce more theater, so on and so forth. But. Yeah, I think we, uh, Joe and I did a, uh, a program for, uh, a concert at green room 42 recently with a young creator. Who's got, you know, quite a Tik TOK following.

[00:31:58] Carlyn Connolly: And she's really, I mean, [00:32:00] incredible. I'm thinking about producing and, and, um, live experiences in a really interesting way. And we it's on our list to get us all together in a room. Um, but you know, I think she was asking us, you know, who, who is your audience and who are you talking to when you're like posting things and so on.

[00:32:18] Carlyn Connolly: And, um, you know, we said, right now, we're talking to a lot of folks that we have to convert a little bit. Um, but I think ideally we would love to be talking to those young arts professionals, the young arts administrators who are looking to change things up who have different priorities. Like, you know, like we do priorities like saving paper and being, becoming more accessible and, um, you know, creating.

[00:32:43] Carlyn Connolly: Experiences that are live and digital and available to more people and getting, you know, our whole agenda to a, just a wider demographic of people. I think, um, you know, those are the people we're really excited about talking to. And, um, that's a big part of like [00:33:00] this sort of forthcoming initiative of how we're looking to expand the product.

[00:33:04] Carlyn Connolly: Um, yeah, Joe, Joe, I don't know if you want to add some more on. 

[00:33:07] Joe Chisholm: Yeah. I mean, I think, um, the people that we have heard, we have heard feedback on in terms of the accessibility features that we've kind of implemented into the marquee. Um, you know, it's not, it's not, yeah. You know, the first level of client is obviously most often the theater that, that hires us.

[00:33:26] Joe Chisholm: Um, and they, they sometimes think it's cool. I want to take advantage of it, but it's actually, when we hear back from them, it's their audience members who have utilized it and thought, I mean, cause we, we worked with, um, an accessibility consultant very early on, um, as we, because we really wanted to make sure that we were checking as many boxes as possible and, and um, she brought up this brilliant idea.

[00:33:49] Joe Chisholm: You know, offering the opportunity for the artistic director or the writer of the show, or even the artists themselves to record their own bios and implementing an [00:34:00] audio, um, player of that with the written bio. So you're not, it's better than that. Very generic clawing screen reader, voice. Um, and you actually get to hear the artists themselves speak.

[00:34:13] Joe Chisholm: And then, you know, when it's, when it's the, when it's the writer, um, you know, it's really cool to be able to hear that in their own words. Wanting to implement that, um, for even further with our cause we've done a couple of art fairs and that kind of market that we're kind of dipping into, you know, letting the artists have the physical art, you're looking at, speak to it.

[00:34:32] Joe Chisholm: And, you know, it's just that, that kind of immediate connection. That's what we hear. Um, people, people hook into that, they feel like they are then a part of it that they are closer to the piece to the people doing the piece to the community writ large. Um, so it's funny to see, to see these features, the positive effect that they have, um, on the audience.

[00:34:53] Joe Chisholm: Uh, you know, you would think that these theaters. Would immediately want that, but they don't really know [00:35:00] at this point in time that those options are really out there. It's only through use that they get to see the benefit of focusing on accessibility, focusing on connectivity. Um, and so, I mean, we've said from the very beginning, we try to be kind of a turnkey solution for theaters, but, um, you know, until they know that this option is out there, they don't really know what they're missing out on.

[00:35:21] Joe Chisholm: They're living, they're living in the black and white world, and we're trying to give them full on post post twister, wizard of Oz, 

[00:35:30] Joe White: no. Or use the term universal design at all in your conversations with, with your clients. It's one that Jess and I talk about often that I love and I'll speak for Jesse loves it too.

[00:35:40] Joe White: I do. Um, it's, it's the idea that, that. Ideas or features or functionality that is born out of an accessible, like focus or an accessible world of like, hi, we are recording, um, you know, these actor bios so that people who cannot like see them and read them on the screen can hear them, but that it's such a [00:36:00] good feature.

[00:36:00] Joe White: It's such a good design that it actually impacts and improves everyone else's experience as well. So it's like, I was thinking just as you were describing, you know, the actors recording their Bibles, I was like, yeah, I want that. I want to listen to that versus reading it. That sounds amazing. And like, I don't, I don't need that feature.

[00:36:14] Joe White: I can physically read the thing, but that feature sounds so much better than being, reading the thing. I would much prefer that. Um, and, and I love things like that because it does act as that bridge for the person who is like, oh, I'm either not thinking about it. Or I'm like a jerk and I'm consciously like ignoring accessible peoples and accessible features.

[00:36:33] Joe White: Um, and it gives them that tether that they can relate to because, um, you know, that's just so often what we need for that, just to get the door open and, and get people thinking in a more broad fashion. Um, so that they start looking back and seeing more and seeing more people and seeing more people's needs through the lens of something that they actually have a personal or emotional connection to.

[00:36:52] Joe Chisholm: Yeah. I mean, I think a lot of people have the, you know, the immediate thoughts that, oh, something that's more specialized for, um, [00:37:00] for an accessibility needed audience member is, is, uh, you know, it's a limited because of just the nature of the need of that person. When in reality, most of these features, they open the umbrella.

[00:37:11] Joe Chisholm: Uh, they, they, they enhance every experience for everyone. And so the idea of being accessible is not just, you know, it's not letting all group. And well, it is, but it's really just, it's, it's, it's raising everyone up to a higher level of that. Even those who don't necessarily need to benefit from accessibility features, you know, they're like you said, their experience is heightened.

[00:37:33] Joe Chisholm: It's enhanced. It's it's everything levels up. So everyone benefits. Yeah. 

[00:37:39] Jess Ryan: I like, I find myself thinking of the Joe and Jess, a school of bullying people into using the services and the investing in the things we think are important. Uh, which is to say that, you know, like we started by just deciding to incorporate interpretation, ESL services.

[00:37:57] Jess Ryan: Like if you work with us, if we consult for you and we [00:38:00] build a live digital show, you're, you're, you're getting it's in the thing, it's kind of not negotiable. Right. And we were real nervous about that. Cause it's another cost. And as you all know, trying to find that balance of how much you cost so hard, but like.

[00:38:13] Jess Ryan: No one really bad at an eye. And so we did that. And just recently in the LA news, do you two, in the last couple months, we've started putting into our decks, like two more things, which are the marquee and then, uh, Nico booth, which are, or like, you know, virtual red carpet, because we think both of those things are really important.

[00:38:32] Jess Ryan: And I agree with what both of you are, what both of you are saying is to me, why Marquis, why a digital program in the way you have envisioned it together is so important is not about its ability to deliver you information or even just alone. The accessibility component it for, to me, what I immediately thought when I saw it was that it is the mechanism by which something I have thought since [00:39:00] 2013, um, needs to happen can happen, which is if you are, have a direct connection to the creators inside the show, And you become connected to them across time.

[00:39:10] Jess Ryan: I E can I connect with your voice? Can I connect with your social media? I am more likely to invest in you and get to know you and then come see the show or go to the theater, because I know all these incredible creators that I see at that theater. And for me, this is like, that's the tool you're right.

[00:39:27] Jess Ryan: The marquee is the tool to get that done. And we S you know, we saw that even with a little bit that we did on Waldorf. 

[00:39:33] Joe Chisholm: Yeah. I mean, we, we, you know, we initially envisioned ourselves as like that bridge from COVID time to normal time, you know, being a fixed to contact lists, all that kind of needs, but very, very quickly, um, we realized that actually know the heart of Marquis it's it's that it's community building it's, it's, it's connectivity between all people.

[00:39:54] Joe Chisholm: And I think everyone kind of thinks that, oh, yeah, You know, they're little regional theater or large regional [00:40:00] theater or their arts organization, you know, they are their own little community and they totally are, but we don't what we're trying to go above that. We're trying to zoom out at a macro level and build communities, um, not only amongst these smaller circles, but the artists that dump that, that dip their toes in for brief time or the businesses around them.

[00:40:18] Joe Chisholm: And then, then that just spiders out and then spiders out and then spiders out and, you know, just kind of building this large overarching community is kind of, I think the, the end goal of, of any kind of. Um, you know, digitally native company, especially it kind of what we're trying to achieve. Um, 

[00:40:35] Jess Ryan: something you were saying earlier about the gal at green room 42, I feel like a real gift of the kind of work that we all are doing.

[00:40:44] Jess Ryan: And this time, which is the beginning of times for many, many, many particularly arts organizations, but, but a lot of people would just, anything that has to do with live digital, uh, is that there's like two sides of the coin to work. There's the, the [00:41:00] side you all were talking about a second ago, which is teach the people, get it in their hands, make them understand what is even possible.

[00:41:07] Jess Ryan: And then there's this other side of creators and folks that are already digitally native and are thinking about like stuff that the, the other, the other, you know, group of folks don't even know exists. Right? Like all the things that we talk about all the time, and I think. I find it challenging, but I also find it deeply fulfilling to be able to work both sides of those things.

[00:41:30] Jess Ryan: And I'm not sure that's ever happened in my career, in my wanderings across, across time that you get to flex both sides of those muscles, you know? 

[00:41:40] Carlyn Connolly: Yeah. We've had. The opportunity to connect with a lot of, you know, folks like us, but from disparate areas of the arts and or technology, um, and startups to, you know, and I think what's been really cool for us is to be able to get into those rooms, share [00:42:00] our experience, our knowledge, um, and you know, and where we want to go connect with connect with these folks and to see them come around to thinking about things in a way that they never did before.

[00:42:12] Carlyn Connolly: And I'm talking about people, you know, people our age, not, these are not, you know, people who have been in arts administration for their entire career. These are like young people who consider themselves Changemakers and young producers and to sit down and go, you know, have you ever thought about how this would work and to see how quickly, um, these folks are, you know, opening their mind to the possibilities?

[00:42:37] Carlyn Connolly: I think in a lot of circumstances, the technology. Especially, you know, web three, like it's so new that like a lot of folks in, in the theater space, especially you don't don't really know anything about it and don't even understand, like they haven't yet scratched the surface on the possibilities. And so to see [00:43:00] all of that coming to fruition, as we're having these conversations and seeing people's brains start to compute this information in new and exciting ways is really thrilling and gives, I think both of us, you know, a lot of hope for what the next five to 10 years will hold 

[00:43:16] Joe Chisholm: in those spaces.

[00:43:17] Joe Chisholm: And I think, you know, We, uh, I, you know, it might be the same for you guys. This, this period of time of the past two years has for all of the awfulness it's brought into the world. What it has also done is made humanity writ large, more malleable and more adaptable to change and technology. And the, you say, especially in the theater world, I think people are more willing to be, um, you know, flexible in terms of trying new things, something, cause there was no other option available at the time.

[00:43:50] Joe Chisholm: The old way was not, um, you know, it was not something they could do. And so, um, you know, everyone was adaptable. Everyone was more willing had we tried to launch Marquis [00:44:00] two years, three years ago or four years ago, it never would have happened. It would have been, we would have been specific just like pushing that rock up the hill and Mandy Patinkin as this 

[00:44:10] Jess Ryan: offense 

[00:44:13] Joe White: leads to Google.

[00:44:16] Joe White: Mandy Patinkin is stupid, 

[00:44:22] Joe Chisholm: but a. But, yeah, I mean, I think we w now we're going to see as, as we're going back a little bit more towards a normal time, if that flexibility starts to become more rigid again. And, um, my hope is that we had enough time, uh, to really kind of plant these seeds, hopefully. Um, but I mean, that's all saying, like, we are standing on the shoulders of companies like you that have been doing this for years and years and years, even when there was a time, like that's long before people, you know, uh, we're willing to be as flexible as they are now.

[00:44:52] Joe Chisholm: And then by flexible, I mean, they're not doing backflips. Like, they're just like, they're doing, they're doing toe touches right now. Um, [00:45:00] but, but I mean, it's just, it's, it's amazing what you guys have managed to do. Um, especially, you know, before, before the community. Really had to be willing to change. So like it's it's.

[00:45:13] Joe Chisholm: Yeah. W I mean, so I'm thankful for your friendship and B for the knowledge that you guys have given us over this friendship, but also see, because you guys have opened the door for a lot of other tech minded theater folk to be able to, um, try to, you know, make a difference. I 

[00:45:30] Carlyn Connolly: think, I mean, I think it goes right back to what we were talking about, you know, just a few minutes ago, it's this creating these circumstances that at the time were not necessary, but opened people's minds and opened the doors to show what is possible, you know, um, just because we didn't have to do virtual programming 10 years ago, doesn't mean it didn't add to the experience and the fact that, you know, you two have been pioneering in this space since long before it was a necessity since it, you know, and now [00:46:00] in the time when it was a necessity, we suddenly see like, Are adaptable to it.

[00:46:04] Carlyn Connolly: They're amenable to it. They're going, oh, Hey, this is not so bad, you know? Um, which is great. And I think we've benefited from that same kind of mindset as well. 

[00:46:13] Joe White: I keep feeling like, oh, it takes a village now, but I love the both of you so much for the words that you just shared. They're really sweet, but they're also like the exact reason that like this podcast specifically exists is for like this community of people that we want to help foster, but more so just be part of, cause like the two of us alone in this office, like it, it kind of, it can only go so far.

[00:46:37] Joe White: It goes so far. It can only grow so big. We need the, the, the, the Marquis digitals and the U2 of the world in order for this things actually become a reality. So thank 

[00:46:47] Jess Ryan: you. The what's possible. It gets bigger, right? Like that's what I always feel when we have these conversations, like, are what's possible is big but limited.

[00:46:55] Jess Ryan: It's finite. Like there is an end point and all of a sudden, when you start talking to folks [00:47:00] who have, you know, adjacent sort of hopes, dreams, ambitions, and values, um, yeah, the what's possible just get so much bigger, which also helps you keep going when it's real hard. Yeah. Maybe we'll actually all do this.

[00:47:16] Carlyn Connolly: Yeah. It's sort of like extending the reach of one circle to a Venn diagram that then extends into another and another and another until, you know, you've covered so much more surface area than you could have alone. Um, and you know, we definitely feel like the places where we overlap. You know, are so exciting with, you know, between Broadway unlocked and, and digital, but then, you know, we're also strengthened by those places where you have expertise and we don't, which is by the way, like a lot,

[00:47:48] Jess Ryan: I don't know about that. 

[00:47:49] Joe White: That sounds like a perfect transition to, to web three. And Dow's right. Yeah. 

[00:47:55] Jess Ryan: Joe, just side slack, me PO app. 

[00:47:59] Joe White: That was as [00:48:00] much a note to myself as a slide. Uh, but I, I did want to, to ask y'all specifically, cause cause Carlin, you did mention web three, so this is your fault. I did 

[00:48:11] Carlyn Connolly: it.

[00:48:11] Carlyn Connolly: Is it fault or is it purposeful? 

[00:48:15] Jess Ryan: Look out cause we're on a tear this week, outing people as like crypto grows. 

[00:48:21] Joe White: Um, but just if you are, if you are. Thinking about that space. Um, cause there feels like there are a lot of parallels to what you're already doing. Um, the PO app that, that Justin mentioned is proof of attendance protocol for anyone who's listening and has no idea what we're talking about, which is, you know, happens.

[00:48:38] Joe White: Um, but the idea that, you know, there would be little sort of not chotchkies, but like digital, digital sort of memorabilia is also a word. I hate that I'm stuck on right now and I can't get past, so someone can jump in and save me right now. Um, 

[00:48:53] Carlyn Connolly: I feel like every, uh, every digital creator is a little bit stuck on memorabilia when we need to be, you know, [00:49:00] creating whatever the future version of that is to be.

[00:49:03] Carlyn Connolly: We haven't quite come down to a word for it. I feel. Um, but we are moving in that direction. I think. Joe, and I both are so excited about the possibilities for Marquis as things start moving toward web three. I mean, you know, we, we were definitely born as a web 2.0 company. Um, but we see so many, um, incredible applications of blockchain technology as we start to move, um, into the future.

[00:49:34] Carlyn Connolly: And I mean, you know, we've been talking with, with U2 about NFTs and what that would look like, how that could be incorporated into the ultimate, you know, platform that we eventually see, um, see ourselves building. And we, we are actually in the process of, um, getting the software iteration of marquee up and running.

[00:49:54] Carlyn Connolly: So that's really exciting. Yeah. Yeah. And that sort of puts us one step [00:50:00] closer to the kind of web three agenda that we, um, you know, the roadmap. Um, but yeah, I mean, I think we definitely are, you know, interested in having this conversation with U2, especially because, uh, the possibilities are just infinite and we're so excited about the way that, um, we think we'll be able to use this technology to really build the community and engage with the community, um, in new and really exciting ways.

[00:50:30] Carlyn Connolly: Yeah. 

[00:50:31] Joe Chisholm: Uh, she just nailed it all again. I don't know why I'm even starting to speak. 

[00:50:36] Joe White: I love you. Just like, I'm just calling attention to the fact that I, I have nothing else. 

[00:50:40] Joe Chisholm: There's nothing of value to add. Um, no, I mean, yeah, we w the. Our morning meetings now, um, basically, you know, we now have a workflow for the current iteration of Marchesa.

[00:50:54] Joe Chisholm: That's kind of a nice, the oiled wheel that just kind of turns, um, and then, uh, this [00:51:00] new, this new phase, which is the software development and, um, you know, capital raising like that kind of era that we're in right now takes up about 50% of our coffee meetings. And the other 50% is web three. Um, and it's application to the theater industry, um, and its application to, you know, Marquis and the future version of marquee that we are planning out.

[00:51:21] Joe Chisholm: Um, and it really is. It's exciting. It's terrifying because you know, none of us know. Anything really there's even the people, even the people that are the crypto bros that are carrying the board apes and everything like that. Like none of them, no one knows what five years from now, what web three is going to be.

[00:51:39] Joe Chisholm: We're in, we're in the true dialogue phase of web three, which is so exciting, but also terrifying. Um, but just the, just, you know, the infrastructure that's already in place and in terms of how it's going to be able to apply to the theater industry too. Um, you know, I think to digital programs and that kind of connectivity and community building, um, [00:52:00] there is, yeah, no, there's a lot of fun stuff that we are talking about and thinking about, and we're just kind of waiting for, you know, we're waiting for the infrastructure to catch up with the ideas.

[00:52:10] Joe Chisholm: Um, and so, yeah, there's a lot, there's a lot of. That I think is exciting. Um, and, but, you know, it's, it's something where we're waiting for the general public to really understand and buy into, because it's not going to, you know, the theater industry already is very, um, stubborn to change, um, that, you know, it's going to take a large wave of public adoption before we can really utilize the tool sets that are going to be available to us.

[00:52:40] Joe Chisholm: So, um, and then hopefully your 

[00:52:42] Joe White: resistance, like the resistant to the digital program, you're like, hi, we got actually something new where you got something right already. You got 

[00:52:49] Joe Chisholm: a wallet and get an NFT. Yeah, no, it's going to be, it's going to be again, it's going to be another specific moment, but the possibilities, just like, oh man.

[00:52:59] Joe Chisholm: It's [00:53:00] exciting. I nerd out over it constantly. 

[00:53:02] Carlyn Connolly: I think that's something that, you know, we're kind of excited about that. We've, we've already done the, sort of the, the small uphill battle of like that getting the digital programs out there and getting people to adopt them and getting them just to, you know, just to try it, just try it for a year and see, and, um, yeah.

[00:53:18] Carlyn Connolly: Now it's like, okay, we're getting into the hands of people, the young people who will eventually be, you know, really engaging with this new technology, they've already, they're already comfortable with the digital programs, right? So now we're already in their hands and then what can we do with that community?

[00:53:34] Carlyn Connolly: Um, and, and, you know, how can we kind of put a little bug in their ear to see the possibilities of the future? Um, and Joe White, I'm very, very interested to know more about like, what is going on in your world of web three studies because Joe and I listened to, I think it was the most recent, um, episode of this podcast where you mentioned your, your recent studies.

[00:53:58] Carlyn Connolly: We were both like, [00:54:00] 

[00:54:00] Joe White: yeah, I do. I have been playing in this space for a number of years now. Kind of. Just found things that I was interested in. Um, the one that I, that I cite often, which is still my fav is a network called helium. And this company was like, oh, we want to basically create like a. Wifi network to just kind of like, you know, blanket the planet.

[00:54:22] Joe White: And they were like, how the heck can we do this is going to be really expensive. We want to do them. And then they, they leaned into blockchain technology and the idea of a decentralized network. So I, as a member of this community own this little, just little hotspot minor that takes my, my personal wifi or my personal internet that I, you know, purchase through spectrum or whatever.

[00:54:42] Joe White: And it propagates it out through the helium network and it connects with all the other helium spot hotspots that happened to exist, you know, with the. This metropolitan area and they're kind of all over the place now, there's, there's thousands of them across the country. And that creates this mesh network for, you know, not for like our internet or video streaming or anything like that, but like bird [00:55:00] scooters so that they can connect up to the internet and like downloading firmware or, uh, you know, electronic dog collars so that you can have a tracking chip on a dog colors, which 

[00:55:08] Jess Ryan: everyone could see judges in space right now.

[00:55:10] Jess Ryan: It's amazing. 

[00:55:12] Joe White: And it's really cool. So by like being part of this community, I earn helium tokens that are worth money. Um, and it helps generate this, this mesh wifi network. And I bought into it cause I was like, this is cool. I think this should exist at the time. I had no idea how really the blockchain worked or how I would play a role in it or how decision-making happens and how proposals get sort of outlined.

[00:55:33] Joe White: And now I'm like deep in that world, but it like happened because I just was like, this is a cool idea. I wanna, I wanna play with this. I wanna like, you know, just be part of this. And it's given me like a nice foundation, which I'm very, very grateful for now. So when people are talking about. Decentralized finance and all that nonsense.

[00:55:47] Joe White: I'm like, okay. I think I understand what you're talking about. Like there's a token on a token, on a token. Got it. Cool. Bye. Um, and I, I'm now like sort of dabbing dabbling a bit more in sort of like the [00:56:00] Dow is world and I, myself am trying to learn solidity, which is the language that smart contracts are built on top of, um, it's exceptionally difficult and, uh, well, if 

[00:56:10] Carlyn Connolly: anyone can do it, it's you.

[00:56:13] Joe White: Um, but, but yeah, I'm just like, I'm still definitely, I feel so strongly that idea that we've all said, which is like, it's so early, it's still so freaking early and it's still so exciting. Like things are not yet invented, you know, they're, they haven't been adopted. They haven't been pioneered. They haven't been.

[00:56:30] Joe White: Taken over by Amazon or Facebook or some other company that's going to try. Right. Um, which just makes it fun and exciting. And I'm very much not trying to get rich, although that would be a nice accident for sure. Always, but I like, I still, like, I feel like it's still like a really exciting time to get in and I want to like continue to encourage anyone who's listening and anyone who hears me talking about this to be like, just go dabble.

[00:56:52] Joe White: Like, don't worry about the fact that you probably missed the boat on this board, ape nonsense. Cause it's nonsense. It's rich, rich people foolishness, which we [00:57:00] like to talk about a lot on this podcast. Right. Anna curly. Um, and it's just still so exciting and like there's so much space and so much time for people to just jump in and dabble and to mess around and maybe accidentally.

[00:57:12] Carlyn Connolly: You never know, 

[00:57:13] Joe White: you 

[00:57:14] Joe Chisholm: never know. See 

[00:57:15] Jess Ryan: on the BA back on the, uh, Jess and Joe school of bullying people into doing things, we, we were, uh, we, we were signing to do a live digital show that we're going to do in a month and a half with a really big property that has a huge young fan base. And I turned to Joe and.

[00:57:33] Jess Ryan: I'm calling friends who are involved in, uh, you know, web three theater based company. I think we should make a PO app for this. I don't care if it's not worth anything right now, we will see just put it in everybody's hands that attends the virtual version of this. And someday it could be worth a ton of money.

[00:57:53] Jess Ryan: It could also not, but like, there's nothing to lose right now because it's so early. 

[00:57:58] Joe Chisholm: Even, even when you were just [00:58:00] talking about, even, even if you said you put that in the hands and it had worked out and, you know, even if it's not worth anything and me Larry now, what it is worth infant, like so much is, is that entire audience group had they never had anything to do with the web three space before we're just giving something, uh, you know, an, a NFC or somebody like essentially for free, even though there was no like inherent value in that itself.

[00:58:22] Joe Chisholm: We, we have now. Brought them into that community. And that just makes public adoption now much easier if you can figure it out. And that's something we talk about is how what's the easiest way to introduce theater audiences or to not just introduce the idea, but to almost, you know, trick them, like get them, get them to buy into it without realizing what they're doing and make it, make it the transition into it.

[00:58:46] Joe Chisholm: It's easy. And again, it's engaging and it's both, those are the things that we asked ourselves about the digital program as well. It's like how we, if we're asking someone to make the leap from a printed program to a digital program, it can't just be [00:59:00] enough, right? It has to be engaging. It has to hook them.

[00:59:03] Joe Chisholm: It has, there has to be incentives are asked to be something to heighten and enhance their experience. And it's going to be the same way this time around, you know, we have to present the theater web three space in a way that. That has, um, you know, an enhancement value to their daily life. Um, you know, whether or not that's money or, or, or some other value is, but we have to figure out, but, you know, that's how we're going to get people to adopt it and accept it.

[00:59:30] Joe Chisholm: And then once everyone does it, that's when like the fun stuff gets to 

[00:59:33] Jess Ryan: have. That's what Joe asked the other day on. I don't know if you heard this episode, he was asking me what I thought the currency would be for digital audiences. Like, you know, what are we trading? What is what's going to set aside a successful live digital and therefore digital audience.

[00:59:46] Jess Ryan: Um, oh, I'm smart. 

[00:59:48] Joe White: Yeah, you were, yeah. Do not remember asking. Oh really? 

[00:59:52] Jess Ryan: Yeah, totally. And I said

[00:59:58] Jess Ryan: but I said connection. And [01:00:00] that's what that poem means to me. It's not really the web three stuff, although I, of course I too am excited and also grumpy, but like more excited than grumpy about all of this stuff. Um, But at the end of the day, the PO app gives, says there's value to being a part of a digital audience, right?

[01:00:16] Jess Ryan: A digital audience doesn't work. If it's just people at home by themselves, in their living room, digital audience works. When you feel connected and you've found an identity inside of that group of people who are sharing an experience together, and that popup lends value to that. Right. Even if it's not worth money, like you said, Joe, it's just like a token, right?

[01:00:34] Jess Ryan: Like a talisman, almost of being a digital audience. 

[01:00:36] Joe Chisholm: Right. Well, I mean, and that's, I mean, as much as you know, there, there's plenty to grumble and roll eyes about, you know, the border, you know, the, the crypto bro communities, but the whole concept of, you know, those, those NFT collections, when they like what their initial value, when they, when that one was first released, they weren't expecting it to be multi, multi, multi, hundreds of millions of dollars of profits.

[01:00:59] Joe Chisholm: That [01:01:00] happened because they didn't raise any money through VC or anything like that. That happened because there was a sense of community that, that was fostered by the owners of these NFTs. So the owners of those tokens and it's that, that's what it is that that's the most powerful part to me of the web three world is that it is this, it is free essentially a free means of building a community, um, like a widespread community that then, you know, it could be me here in Hamilton Heights watching, uh, Broadway and long to production.

[01:01:29] Joe Chisholm: And then someone in. You know, um, Bangladesh watching it and each of us receiving a token, and now you're a part of the Broadway unlocked community because we all hold that. Like you said, that talisman it's that it's it's, we are part of the club in a way, and, and community is incredibly powerful. And oftentimes I think that's worth more and more valuable than, you know, having a monetary value just slapped onto it because you know, um, someone can sell for money, but you don't [01:02:00] often back away from the community once you're like rooted into it.

[01:02:05] Carlyn Connolly: And then on top of that, I think, you know, community. Is everything to Marquis. It's a huge component of web three and, and you know how that will all play out. But it's also ultimately like the whole web three economy is so much about creators and, and artists, and we are, you know, super excited to see what that means.

[01:02:27] Carlyn Connolly: Um, especially when it comes to like, you know, we're talking about NFTs talking about secondary market and resale, what does that mean? Like actually seeing a kickback to the artist in perpetuity as these things get sold and resold and, um, you know, that. That's amazing. And yes, our coffee conversations often include, you know, Hey, what about, what about this part of the industry?

[01:02:51] Carlyn Connolly: You know, how could it play into music, not music sales, but sheet music, sales, a brilliant idea that Joe had, you know, um, anything that [01:03:00] requires licensing. We are like, this is obviously like an obvious, um, sort of, uh, what's the word I'm looking for? Um, modulation, you know, from, from this, uh, sort of two dimensional world that we live in, um, into this web three space, it's like, it's just, I dunno, it's very inspiring.

[01:03:21] Carlyn Connolly: It's very exciting. And, um, I think, you know, for a young company like us, that's all about. Art technology and community. It's like what a playground. 

[01:03:35] Joe White: I appreciate that so much. You just like expanded my mind, or I think that I've been thinking about where, like I talk about web two or sorry, web three is a chance to solve all of the problems of web two and it's not going to solve all of them, but I think it's a helpful paradigm for getting people interested in it.

[01:03:50] Joe White: And you were just like, yeah, it's like maybe a helpful solution for everything in the world. We're like, oh yeah. Contracting is really complicated. Licensing is [01:04:00] exceptionally complicated. Can it help solve those problems too? Like you're thinking even bigger and even broader, which I like, because I do think part of the 

[01:04:06] Joe Chisholm: adoption, the use cases and the use cases that are going to be applicable, like none of us have.

[01:04:12] Joe Chisholm: Drempt or like, uh, the, the, a fraction of a thought of yet, like that's what the next 10 years are. That's super exciting. But I mean, I do think like what's interesting is that I, you know, I, I cautioned to use the word pendulum because usually I'm using it to like, to represent the pit and the pendulum like swing of, to that's over my head, like to push our company forward before, before someone else gets there first.

[01:04:35] Joe Chisholm: Like I constantly have that feeling, but I mean, I think web three really is a pendulum swinging back for a lot of aspects, at least in the artist industry. The, the sudden spread of the digital world and web two didn't often benefit artists and creators because that's when we moved to streaming, we moved to things where people like we moved away from actual ownership and more [01:05:00] towards streaming values, um, that, and the people that lost out were the critic creators.

[01:05:05] Joe Chisholm: And now we're swinging back to a world where, you know, there is now digital ownership of assets, um, of parts of assets where now we're swinging back where the creators are able to actually still, you know, sell. It's not, you're not selling like a, an LP album anymore, but what you are selling is a truly digital, non fungible asset that you then benefit from in perpetuity.

[01:05:28] Joe Chisholm: Should that be sold or traded? And then traded it and traded. And I think it's, uh, it's, it's answering a lot of, like you said, problems that the web two world created and it's going to create a whole slew of problems that, you know, web 4.0, and then 150 years from now, we'll, uh, we'll have to solve it.

[01:05:45] Joe Chisholm: We'll be robots by then. So I want 

[01:05:47] Jess Ryan: to make a jingle that interrupts our podcast when we get on crypto, so that it's like theater people talk in blockchain, you know, or something like that. So, cause it happens every episode 

[01:05:59] Carlyn Connolly: assigned me [01:06:00] a vocal part,

[01:06:04] Jess Ryan: but people should, I'm excited. Right. Because like, I know, I know there's one company kind of treading around this area. One like. Back to the company. And I know there's a handful of web three sort of NFT focused companies trying to look at the theater, but I hope that people will listen to this, especially people from outside the theater, because I think we have an extraordinary perspective in a really IP centric, um, ownership, heavy and problematically, like financially distributed, uh, industry, like where there's a lot of ideas here.

[01:06:38] Jess Ryan: Like you were saying, Joe and Carlin, 

[01:06:40] Joe Chisholm: we can share all of them over a bottle or three of them.

[01:06:48] Joe Chisholm: But yeah, no, I mean, I think, you know, more and more and more as we read the briefing, the Broadway briefing every morning during our coffee, uh, meeting scrums, uh, you know, web three is [01:07:00] poking up. More less and less infrequently. Um, we're still waiting. Like I'm excited to see, you know, there are a lot of like nuts to crack in terms of really harnessing the possibilities of the web three world for the theater industry.

[01:07:17] Joe Chisholm: Um, rather than just trying to like shoe horn would be recognized now into a digital landscape and then call that the future, which it isn't. Um, and you know, I think there's a lot of conversations to innovation to be found there. Um, and, uh, Marquis is hoping to be a. At one of the people at the forefront of that.

[01:07:38] Joe Chisholm: And that's part of our like phase two and phase three. Um, but, but yeah, it's, it's going to be an exciting couple of years and also hopefully, you know, um, the whole concept of like a decentralized, anything just means we're taking power away from the white dinosaurs that. You know, keep, keep the industry from modernizing.[01:08:00] 

[01:08:00] Jess Ryan: Well, that seems like a really good segue as we are at our hour to just quickly telling everyone where people can find you and how they can talk to you. If they're interested in a marquee. 

[01:08:08] Carlyn Connolly: Yeah. They can visit our website, which is marquis.digital. Um, uh, all of our, all of our stuff is there. Our contact is there.

[01:08:19] Carlyn Connolly: You can also email info@marquee.digital. Um, and we are on all the social media platforms also as variations on marquee dot underscore dash, whatever it is, digital, um, just try them. You'll find 

[01:08:33] Jess Ryan: amazing. Well, thank you guys so much for coming and chatting with us today. I'm sure this is only part one of many future conversations on this podcast.

[01:08:41] Jess Ryan: Uh, but it's a good, a good starter. Well, 

[01:08:44] Carlyn Connolly: we love getting together with you. So thank you for having. Yeah, 

[01:08:47] Joe Chisholm: it was a pleasure. I love you guys.[01:09:00] 

[01:09:02] Jess Ryan: That conversation made me feel good. 

[01:09:07] Joe White: Uplifting, heartfelt. Yeah. I just feel better. I know we're in that bit of a sophomore slump right now, slump 

[01:09:16] Jess Ryan: season, even if it's just in our heads, I don't even know. I don't think we're literally busier than we've ever been. So I guess I'm just making up problems for 

[01:09:24] Joe White: us.

[01:09:26] Joe White: They are real. If you're feeling it it's real on some level, it may not be a fact, but you're feeling it. Um, and it was yeah. A nice conversation to get a bit of a repeat from that feeling and remember that bigger vision. Remember the bigger world that we play in. Remember the great people that we were getting together on this show to talk about that world that we want to 

[01:09:43] Jess Ryan: create.

[01:09:43] Jess Ryan: Yeah. I feel very privileged that we have. As Carlin was talking about it early in this episode, gotten to watch them build their company just nearly from day one, which has been really wild and neat and listening to them sort of like benchmark what [01:10:00] they did when they did it and how they're looking at their second year with them just a year.

[01:10:05] Jess Ryan: I know she talks a lot about us having done this for 10 years, but like, let's call it two in the serious mode, you know? And I mean, so we're really only a year. Yeah, exactly. This season. Yeah. This is the opposite. It's gonna be called the season. Uh, it was just, I feel extraordinarily privileged and so excited that this.

[01:10:24] Jess Ryan: It made it out a year one and I can't wait to see what they do next. And I mean that, I'm not just saying 

[01:10:30] Joe White: that. Yeah. Unlike many of our other guests, we really liked these 

[01:10:34] Jess Ryan: two it's 

[01:10:36] Joe White: so rude whose is, is even Kate Baldwin. I don't even know who that. Oh Lord. 

[01:10:41] Jess Ryan: Well, as you can tell, we had a lot of fun today. So thank you for listening and being part of the, 

[01:10:46] Joe White: the goal of this podcast is to bring people together and have these really important conversations.

[01:10:50] Joe White: So share this episode with someone who cares about accessibility, who cares about disrupting systems that no shaken up and who might want a 

[01:10:59] Carlyn Connolly: [01:11:00] marquee for their, 

[01:11:00] Jess Ryan: a theater or 

[01:11:01] Joe White: arts organization and hit them up. marquee.digital I'm Jess and I'm Joe. And we'll see you back 

[01:11:07] Jess Ryan: here next week. .