00;00;03;08 - 00;00;04;12 Speaker 1 Welcome to the get together. 00;00;04;14 - 00;00;09;21 Speaker 2 All over the world. There are people thinking about and creating a future of live digital events and performances. 00;00;09;22 - 00;00;16;29 Speaker 1 They're disparate innovators who are artists, tech founders, non-profits and investors. And they need a place to gather and share ideas. 00;00;17;08 - 00;00;19;01 Speaker 2 That's what the get together is all about. 00;00;19;09 - 00;00;24;27 Speaker 1 I'm just a theater creator who loves bringing people together around technology, art and the Internet. 00;00;25;01 - 00;00;30;08 Speaker 2 And I'm Joe, a tech and media startup that with over ten years of experience growing and operating businesses. 00;00;30;08 - 00;00;59;14 Speaker 1 Thanks for getting together with us. Let's dig in, too. Joe had to get up on Twitter today like KC News out of Kansas City, my hometown. They've taken plan B off the shelves. It's not great. Yeah, I think. 00;00;59;22 - 00;01;03;04 Speaker 2 They can just do that. Yeah. Were you I think is there a law in Missouri? 00;01;03;04 - 00;01;08;20 Speaker 1 Were you on when you. Did you hear me? When? On Zoom. When I just went. Oh, no. 00;01;09;08 - 00;01;11;06 Speaker 2 I don't think so. Or at least I don't remember. 00;01;11;06 - 00;01;21;13 Speaker 1 It might have been right before you logged on, because I was literally reading that tweet from someone I know in Kansas City. It's a this is a health system. One of the health systems I have. 00;01;22;09 - 00;01;24;14 Speaker 2 Is it run through like a Catholic Church or something. 00;01;24;14 - 00;01;45;23 Speaker 1 Like that? Probably. Yesterday I was I was trying to figure out what to write for LinkedIn because, you know, I try to write something hopefully helpful and interesting each week that comes from our experience in our company. And I was just like I literally wrote ended up writing what happened in my head, which was I was going to I was going to repurpose an Instagram post. 00;01;45;23 - 00;02;11;18 Speaker 1 I wrote about an experience I had with my mom and reproductive health and how that informs what I'm thinking about now in the wake of Roe v Wade being retracted in terms of like what I can do and how I can better myself to help start breaking down patriarchal systems, which, you know, in my opinion, if those don't go away, we can change all the laws we want, or if they don't get better, but the laws won't save us. 00;02;12;00 - 00;02;36;09 Speaker 1 So yeah, I was writing this LinkedIn post and I was like, I was literally going to write something really smart and pithy about reproductive services and the patriarchy. But then there was racism and commercial artwork. I-the fucking terrible shit that came out this week about the bored apes and lefties and that there's 50 dead immigrants in the back of a truck in Texas. 00;02;36;20 - 00;02;49;08 Speaker 1 And so I give up and I'm just going to post a beautiful video of Paul Taylor Dance Company Dancing at the Oculus. And I hope that it makes your heart as happy as it makes mine. It's a little. 00;02;49;08 - 00;03;05;26 Speaker 2 Reprieve. Yeah, I like the idea of someone sort of scrolling through their LinkedIn feed and yeah, getting the, like, this is your friend trying to pitch you on this thing? Yeah. This is someone else you met once. That's like talking about their new venture. You should sign up. And then it's just like you think, like, here's a piece of art. 00;03;05;26 - 00;03;06;26 Speaker 2 Just you need this. Yeah. 00;03;07;13 - 00;03;17;13 Speaker 1 Heart needs art this week. Heartening art. Oh, my gosh. Whoo! But I digress. That's. I answered my own question that I usually ask you, which is, how are you doing today? 00;03;17;20 - 00;03;19;15 Speaker 2 Just Jess. How are you doing today? 00;03;20;10 - 00;03;24;03 Speaker 1 Oh, no need to ask. Good. So I. 00;03;24;03 - 00;03;24;17 Speaker 2 Made it. 00;03;24;27 - 00;03;26;05 Speaker 1 How are you doing today? 00;03;27;06 - 00;03;44;13 Speaker 2 I'm doing all right. We just left an interesting conversation with a friend who is the artistic director of original theater. And I love those conversations. They always get me happy and excited to talk creatively and to learn from other people's expertize and the different ways our brains work. 00;03;44;27 - 00;04;16;29 Speaker 1 Yeah, I actually really enjoyed. I caught myself in that meeting. Watching you and our friend talk and thinking about this is someone I've known now for a couple of decades and have collaborated with, you know, across a couple of projects, just like watching the two of you having become friendly or friends over the last couple of years. And yeah, to trade that information and knowledge and find common ground and just how unlikely it is in our world for a person like you and a person like her to end up being friends and maybe like, you know, work together on things. 00;04;16;29 - 00;04;21;01 Speaker 1 Like, I had a very happy I had a hard and happy moment also around that. 00;04;21;15 - 00;04;32;03 Speaker 2 Hard, happy. We need those. Yeah, I do. I like to. Like you were saying, it's like it's a miracle that we met, that we were able to, like, spend time together mostly digitally, 100 cent digitally. 00;04;32;04 - 00;04;32;13 Speaker 1 Yeah. 00;04;32;25 - 00;04;47;08 Speaker 2 But now we can, like, we communicate like we were talking about the same thing from our two different worlds in a way that we both understand enough. Definitely don't fully understand how her brain works. I don't think she understands fully my brain works, but we can communicate and that's always like, amazing to me. 00;04;47;10 - 00;04;56;15 Speaker 1 Yeah. Because you and she, right. Didn't you just sort of give some of your time, too, to help her with a little bit of like business? See math things. 00;04;56;29 - 00;05;12;00 Speaker 2 Business email things. Yeah. Spreadsheets specifically. Yeah. So the, the, their business manager for the, the organization left or something happened, whatever. And the spreadsheet that that person was maintaining fell into disrepair. 00;05;12;06 - 00;05;12;19 Speaker 1 And. 00;05;13;17 - 00;05;33;19 Speaker 2 There was no one left in the organization who knew how to make it work again, which for any of you who've worked in spreadsheets, you know, linking between different tabs inside of spreadsheets and things like that, if you if you break one thing and, you know, delete a formula or something like that that's pulling information from multiple places, the whole thing just crashed. 00;05;33;20 - 00;05;34;13 Speaker 1 Sad Trump. 00;05;34;14 - 00;05;35;04 Speaker 2 Shuts down. 00;05;35;10 - 00;05;36;26 Speaker 1 Way sad trumpet, right? Yeah. 00;05;36;27 - 00;05;52;14 Speaker 2 So trumpet. And if you either weren't the one who build it or there isn't some clear rubric for how to fix it, then you've just got to go clicking around and experiment and try to figure it out, which is a thing that I'm kind of good at and I enjoy doing. So I was happy to help out. 00;05;52;26 - 00;06;27;01 Speaker 1 See, this is what you get when you work with us. We'll plan your live digital strategy. We'll do the creative on a broadcast if you want us to, and we might even volunteer our time to fix your spreadsheets. Yeah, I do love that, though. I mean, that's something that I really value and appreciate about you and just generally and in life I had someone reflect back to me maybe only a year ago that what they really appreciated is I will I will always, no matter how busy I am, make time to give time if a friend needs it. 00;06;27;01 - 00;06;30;13 Speaker 1 And that's something I'm really good at, you know, like an expert. I have expertize in. 00;06;30;23 - 00;06;32;24 Speaker 2 Yeah, yeah. Your time is worth something. 00;06;32;27 - 00;06;35;10 Speaker 1 Yeah, but I care. 00;06;35;10 - 00;06;37;24 Speaker 2 I'll throw my time at it, but it actually makes your life harder. Yeah. 00;06;38;03 - 00;06;55;05 Speaker 1 Exactly. And that this feels like an instance of that, you know, like we are busy, you don't run the theater like, but you have this expertize. And I think it's really beautiful that you you were you guys have that kind of friendship developing where you're like, No, I'll stop and help you with this because I'm really good at it. 00;06;55;27 - 00;06;58;11 Speaker 2 Yeah, it makes me feel good. Yeah, it feels good all around. 00;06;58;13 - 00;07;42;20 Speaker 1 We just keep talking about happy things today on the podcast. Things that make us happy, happy, happy. Well, speaking also of working with us, I guess, honestly, I think you suggested maybe we do a little talking about some of the stuff that came up today in our meeting with our friend who's an artistic director. And I think it's really it's really interesting to break down how we think about strategy around live digital for arts organizations, which is very specific and how we found out as we were working through all of this that like it actually probably applies across a whole lot of people considering building growing community across this medium. 00;07;43;12 - 00;07;59;27 Speaker 2 Yeah, absolutely. And if you listened to our live show on Tuesday, June 28th, you probably got a little sneak peek of some of this where we were looking at a digital report that talked about the fact that theaters during the pandemic increased access to the arts digitally. 00;08;00;13 - 00;08;03;15 Speaker 1 And has slowly been cutting back, doing less. 00;08;03;24 - 00;08;34;23 Speaker 2 Carrying this, you know, not investing the money in it, not trying to create content or provide access to those audiences who had been coming digitally or could only come digitally. And one of our very smart panelists, Katie Braverman, is talking about like, well, there's no blueprint like theaters and arts organizations are pretty risk averse. We need to have pieces that we understand and know how to work with, to take the risk, to make the leap, to see some version of the future that live digital could provide. 00;08;35;07 - 00;08;46;28 Speaker 2 And I think through this conversation with our friend at that regional theater and how it just just just outlined it like blueprint is kind of what we're in the business of making. 00;08;47;09 - 00;09;05;22 Speaker 1 How convenient. How convenient. Incidentally, by the way, it's just a plug for the live show. You can go to our YouTube channel. It's on the Broadway Unlocked YouTube channel. People were in a fight mood this week. They were feisty. There were strong words thrown around. 00;09;05;22 - 00;09;11;25 Speaker 2 And I liked that. It was like kind of contagious to, like, Germain created this face for it. I can't remember the phrase he used, but I liked it. 00;09;11;26 - 00;09;14;16 Speaker 1 I choose violence. Yeah, I use violence. 00;09;15;05 - 00;09;23;14 Speaker 2 That was the theme of the show is I choose violence and then picked up on it was like, all right, if the space is there, I'm just going to keep go. And I was like, Sure, why not? 00;09;23;14 - 00;09;39;06 Speaker 1 Let's go. And by violence, we mean like. Like Germaine started off by saying he was talking words. Yeah. How silly he thought it was that people weren't investing in digital. And he was just like, No, I will say it, you are stupid. You are stupid. I choose violence today. Yeah. 00;09;40;14 - 00;09;42;12 Speaker 2 I'm not sugarcoating these words. 00;09;42;12 - 00;10;11;18 Speaker 1 No, ma'am. All right. So so let's let's do a little a little digging in. I think. So the frame up for y'all listening as we're really trying to think around. Here's here's what we said to our friend. We are not concerned about this theater and our agency's ability to make an incredibly creative, innovative, high quality broadcast. Right. We this is checked. 00;10;11;21 - 00;10;49;25 Speaker 1 This is checkmark. We all are experts at that. So when we're thinking about what is the right show to do, a live digital engagement around what is the right way to do that show? What are we doing with that live digital instead of thinking just about what is the best creative fit? We wanted to sort of start thinking about what is the best strategy that will serve the goals that we have as a company or two companies, which are fairly the same, which is let's not lose money, let's widen our reach and take step us what? 00;10;49;25 - 00;11;02;23 Speaker 1 It's a step forward to create the future of this institution. Um, and so what we're about to talk about kind of came out of all that, would you say that's fair? Fair to say, Joe. 00;11;03;18 - 00;11;18;29 Speaker 2 I think super fair. And I like the frame up and the credit given to all of us that whatever is created is going to be amazing. Now let's talk about what we're creating and why we're creating it and all the other harder, not harder, but different questions that we don't yet have answers to. 00;11;18;29 - 00;11;20;25 Speaker 1 Yeah, well, where do you want to start us? 00;11;22;12 - 00;11;29;17 Speaker 2 Well, let's start. I actually think. Can we start in the in the creative world and those things we know are going to go great? 00;11;30;16 - 00;11;36;18 Speaker 1 We just told you we're not worried about that. We're not talking about that today. But but let's talk about it because it's the best as a just a. 00;11;36;18 - 00;11;59;23 Speaker 2 Starting point as as the thing that I think a lot of listeners of this show are going to have some capacity with. And so that'll be our gateway and got it because you know, again, using this regional theater model, there's already decisions being made in conversations being had inside of out about what shows are we doing, why are we doing them, which audiences are we trying to attract by doing those shows? 00;12;00;08 - 00;12;20;01 Speaker 2 And one of the vicious cycles, it seems that that some of these cities have gotten stuck in is, okay, who's paying the bills, who's signing up for memberships, who is buying tickets? And it's usually a slightly older or slightly whiter class of people. And so the shows and those people who buy into those shows have become this sort of self-reinforcing cycle. 00;12;20;03 - 00;12;43;28 Speaker 2 It's like, what is it going to feel to them? Makes it hard to break out, makes it again, hard to take risks to appeal to, let's say, digitally savvy younger audiences. What a concept to all that's already happening. And so in our sort of worldview, we are talking about thinking about and believe and have proven that there are young people out there, young professionals, girls, celestials. 00;12;44;10 - 00;12;56;13 Speaker 2 It's not a real term millennial term, it's not Zelazny I'm as I was thinking about like the hybrid between Gen Z and, and millennials and bottom up whatever that. 00;12;56;13 - 00;12;57;01 Speaker 1 Might be a thing. 00;12;57;13 - 00;13;21;28 Speaker 2 Yeah. Like I believe that they either do care about organizations like original theater could care about an organization like a regional theater, could want to become part of that. They just haven't been presented the, the use case, the, the opportunity, the reason to do that and our belief that like digital can be that sort of open and can be that that marketplace and that marketing idea that actually creates a space for that. 00;13;21;28 - 00;13;22;12 Speaker 2 Audience. 00;13;22;12 - 00;13;59;02 Speaker 1 Yeah, and I want to put a little framing on this. That's theater specific, just so when you're listening to sort of going along and thinking about this breakdown with us, you sort of have the same frame for theater in particular. I think the reason we're even talking about this, you know, with regional theaters now and like that, they're even entertaining the idea of a live digital agency taking care of thinking about this strategy with them is partially copied because they were all forced to experiment with the form, you know, certainly, but mostly because we're about to have the biggest wealth transfer in the history of the United States. 00;13;59;02 - 00;14;04;24 Speaker 1 The boomers are dying and the boomers are the theater audience that are in that cycle you were talking about. And the boomers. 00;14;04;24 - 00;14;07;17 Speaker 2 Are they're aging out of the electorate, is the phrase I like the best. 00;14;07;17 - 00;14;32;13 Speaker 1 Yeah, that's good. I like that a lot. But like back to money, that wealth is transferring somewhere and we are not as theaters regional theaters particularly killing it at programing for those who the wealth is going to be transferred to. And those are the people who will pay the bills for the next 50 years. Right. This is like a huge event that a lot of companies have been formed around, right. 00;14;32;13 - 00;14;45;25 Speaker 1 To serve the needs of the greatest wealth transfer in the history of the United States. That is starting now. So it's a particular interesting moment for theater, arts organizations, not just theaters, but we're going to talk theater today. 00;14;46;26 - 00;15;05;24 Speaker 2 Yeah. And I do think, like you said earlier, theater is actually a great gateway to other types of businesses and organizations. But you want to transition. You know, we talked audiences and how to attract those audiences with the art that's being made. And performed. But yeah, so we selected our show. We know we want to appeal to younger people now. 00;15;05;25 - 00;15;09;16 Speaker 2 How the heck do we let them know that that we exist? 00;15;09;16 - 00;15;09;26 Speaker 1 Yeah. 00;15;10;09 - 00;15;13;26 Speaker 2 How do we get this in front of them? But what marketing kind of super powers do we have. 00;15;13;26 - 00;15;20;28 Speaker 1 And convince them that we're not just doing the same old, same old, right? Like stuff they're not really interested in. 00;15;20;28 - 00;15;22;00 Speaker 2 Hello, Dolly. 00;15;23;12 - 00;15;26;24 Speaker 1 Well, no, as music, man, we beat up on Music Man on this podcast. 00;15;27;03 - 00;15;37;05 Speaker 2 Got it. Okay, taking it back. Take to the music man again. A stupid. I've never seen either of these shows. 00;15;38;00 - 00;16;05;00 Speaker 1 So we decided in the moment this was not premeditated to start really trying to break it down into some column of things that are important in strategy and marketing land to making sure the best piece of creative hybrid property we've ever made gets seen and extends the reach. Right, like we said, takes a step forward and we broke those down. 00;16;05;00 - 00;16;12;02 Speaker 1 One, two, three, four, five, five. Right. Yeah. So we broke those down into five columns. You want to just kind of go through those? 00;16;12;28 - 00;16;33;00 Speaker 2 Yeah. So, like five pillars, five columns. We talked about the first two already show choice, you know, that is going to land mostly not in our plate, but is an important one. You know what stories are being told. And we'll come back around to that in just a second. And then how are those stories appealing to the audience that you're trying to cultivate in the are you shifting that target? 00;16;33;00 - 00;16;38;19 Speaker 2 Are you taking a risk with one of your shows to actually try and open up the space for a younger, different audience? 00;16;38;26 - 00;17;09;13 Speaker 1 Yeah, and I think just something I didn't think about when we started talking about this, but I did want to pop in is when we think about working with a regional theater on an ongoing basis, right. Our friend said something really smart and true, which is live. Digital is not right for every show, right? So this is this is a little bit of a sea change and that, you know, we're going to work with a theater to choose cherry pick a couple of really smart opportunities is to leverage the scalability and affordability of digital for our goals, right? 00;17;10;02 - 00;17;18;07 Speaker 1 And to make that smart show choice and to pick something that serves that audience target. But not everything has to be that. 00;17;18;28 - 00;17;37;26 Speaker 2 Yeah, Donny's a livestream, everything now. So yeah, when we get into that third pillar, which we are kind of capturing the concept of, of marketing, right. Okay. We've picked our show, we have our different audience now. How do we let them know that this even exists? A huge problem. A huge problem that we often like to avoid because it's so big and scary and often expensive. 00;17;38;23 - 00;17;58;04 Speaker 2 And it is another one that a you know, there is an existing marketing strategy. You're not starting from scratch here. You know, they're probably doing something digital Instagram, Facebook ads, something like that just to get it out there. But I want to quickly fixate on sort of the superpower of having a digital broadcast to be the thing that you're marketing. 00;17;58;04 - 00;18;12;25 Speaker 2 Yeah, because, you know, if we think about, you know, an in-person theater, it has a limited capacity. It's a limited number of seats for a limited number of nights. And that's it. Like you can the economics kind of stop at a certain point. That's a fixed amount. 00;18;12;25 - 00;18;13;02 Speaker 1 Yeah. 00;18;13;22 - 00;18;35;11 Speaker 2 But with digital and sort of this is at the core thesis of so many Internet based companies is that each additional stream of a live stream, each additional seat being sold, doesn't really cost any more money. The marginal cost of getting that additional customer in is kind of near zero. You know, there's probably little fees here in there, whatever. 00;18;36;05 - 00;19;03;06 Speaker 2 Don't ask me, you know, but unlike having to blow out a wall and add 100 more seats, you can just sell another ticket. Give it another ticket. Give another ticket like there's a whole bunch that can be done. If you are taking a bet on one or two different things, one or two different shows a year that you can say, Hey, let's use this as an opportunity to reach far beyond our existing audience by making as low costs as possible. 00;19;03;07 - 00;19;03;24 Speaker 2 What's your face? 00;19;04;07 - 00;19;30;10 Speaker 1 I just see you. You talking about it that way? Makes me think about how unfortunate it is. And this is, again, a specific theater thing that how unfortunate it is that live digital was really introduced through this lens of let's take a thing on stage and put it on a screen. That was the core way we were processing, adding this on because of COVID. 00;19;30;22 - 00;19;58;03 Speaker 1 Whereas like you just pointed out, like whole businesses, bazillions of businesses were built on a thesis of this sort of like marginal, you know, value and the scalability and affordability, which is like not a concept I've ever heard anyone talk about in theater, do you know what I mean? But like, it's almost like it was like a shiny thing that made us look the other way and that that framing of let's put it on a screen and get double, you know what I mean? 00;19;58;03 - 00;20;02;07 Speaker 1 People is such a red herring in all of this. Right. 00;20;02;17 - 00;20;24;12 Speaker 2 Well, I'm glad that the the idea of sort of the low marginal cost of every additional viewer like resonates with you. I hope that it resonates with everyone else listening. And there's lots of models out there that exist. That's that's how every digital company you can think of that is subscription based works. And inside of this for, you know, original theater, in this specific instance, there's cool things that you can do. 00;20;24;13 - 00;20;56;05 Speaker 2 Like very specifically, these ideas that we alluded to earlier of like, hey, if you buy a ticket to anything with that at the theater, any show, you get a free ticket to a digital stream. Right. And just it doesn't cost you really anything to do that. There's a whole conversation about cannibalizing. We're going to put that aside for just a second, because really we're talking about how are you appealing to more people outside of your, you know, the 200 people who show up every single time and so, you know, buy a ticket, gifted ticket. 00;20;56;08 - 00;21;06;01 Speaker 2 If I had a free ticket to give, I would probably like, you know, and hit up one or two people and be like, hey, I have this thing. It costs me nothing and it allows me a little bit of connection between us. 00;21;06;01 - 00;21;08;23 Speaker 1 Like a coupon, love coupon. 00;21;09;04 - 00;21;11;03 Speaker 2 Right. And that that free, gifted. 00;21;11;04 - 00;21;11;19 Speaker 1 Ticket. 00;21;11;29 - 00;21;28;16 Speaker 2 Cost basically nothing for this regional theater to offer. So leaning into the idea that taking a risk in live streaming a show that is meant to appeal to a wider, younger audience is part of your marketing strategy across the next five years? 00;21;28;16 - 00;21;28;22 Speaker 1 Yeah. 00;21;29;02 - 00;21;43;11 Speaker 2 And so that first year, like just spray and pray, get tickets everywhere, just start throwing things out there, creating partnerships, putting up livestreams, like just trying to reach as many people as possible because the cost of reaching those people is lower. 00;21;43;22 - 00;22;07;25 Speaker 1 Yeah. The way that you described it again just makes it so simple and clear and not as terrifying for someone who has made art for their living. Do you know what I mean? Like on a stage, I got that concept, spray it as far as possible because it does not cost a ton of money. Like added into my entire strategy around how I get build awareness for my theater, drive subscription sales. 00;22;09;02 - 00;22;29;07 Speaker 1 And the thing that I think is interesting about that, well, one of the many things that I think is interesting about that is that that sort of starts this engine of word of mouth credibility. Right. Which is another thing we got talking about today. And it kind of works in two ways, right? Your free ticket, your gift to ticket. 00;22;29;07 - 00;22;47;17 Speaker 1 It's a funnel to. Right. Not all of those gifted tickets are going to be redeemed. You're going to get a certain percentage of those people that are actually going to show up. But then they become, you know, the next person who can start spreading word of mouth if you engage, enable and you know, yeah, if you engage in enable them well through your marketing efforts. 00;22;48;04 - 00;23;17;05 Speaker 1 But also what's neat in this moment now I don't know if like, let's get past the next five years. I'm not sure if this will still be the case, but it is true right now. What is also neat is just doing this, just doing a play where there are cameras on stage. So your in-person audience, you're aware of the filming, let's say, and it's going digitally and you're doing this buy one, get one free digital gifting initiative gives you a reputation, right? 00;23;17;05 - 00;23;34;02 Speaker 1 Gives you a differentiator in your town. Like, Wow, this theater is doing really fucking cool things now. That's enough to even make the in-person audience or a digital audience member also start telling other people. So it's sort of like a lot killing a lot of birds with the same stone here. 00;23;34;09 - 00;23;52;02 Speaker 2 Quick aside, just because it makes me laugh today I heard recently I read recently about like trying to retire the saying that is kill two birds with one stone. Oh really? Because it's like inherently violent. I get the exact argument and it was like the other examples are like mashed potatoes with one fork or something like that. And I was like. 00;23;52;09 - 00;23;53;02 Speaker 1 That's a terrible. 00;23;53;03 - 00;23;54;05 Speaker 2 Like swap out. 00;23;54;05 - 00;23;59;26 Speaker 1 Like, I got to do better than that. So we live in New York City and pigeons are the devil, so I don't feel bad about it. 00;24;00;17 - 00;24;04;24 Speaker 2 All right. So we're mashing two for Dallas and one for now. 00;24;05;11 - 00;24;11;01 Speaker 1 He says to the woman who says, Kill your babies in reference to writing and creating things. 00;24;11;18 - 00;24;18;00 Speaker 2 Yeah, instead of killing your darlings, which was the other that the consensus formed around that version of that phrase. 00;24;18;00 - 00;24;23;22 Speaker 1 Never heard it. I like kill your babies and we're also kill those birds today. That killing machine. 00;24;25;22 - 00;24;32;24 Speaker 2 Yeah, I think that's really interesting. I feel like you were talking as well about this concept of the creative class and like how does that all play into this? 00;24;33;15 - 00;24;42;29 Speaker 1 Yeah, I got I got thinking in this inside this conversation about by the way, as an aside, I love I love movies, huh? 00;24;42;29 - 00;24;43;15 Speaker 2 Love killing. 00;24;43;15 - 00;25;08;29 Speaker 1 Babies. I love killing babies is the thing that I don't love. Maybe I'm just kidding. Oh, my God. So relevant, Roe v Wade. But, my God, no, no. Wow. Got all of that. So I really love when people bring me an idea or a thing. They notice that's an issue, right? I'm really good at making quick connections between things and sort of in a way that I even don't fully understand. 00;25;08;29 - 00;25;45;28 Speaker 1 And so I'll often, you know, run at a problem that's been brought to me and sort of do a bunch of research and try to bring those connections together as fast as possible before I lose it all. And it doesn't always turn into anything, right? Like and this the creative class business is an instance of that. So, so in the fall of 2020, I was chatting with an artistic director friend in a regional city and he was just mentioning that he felt like the creative class, which is this interesting subsection of cities that was defined as the creative class in the seventies, the artists, graphic designers, I think architects like, you know, there's a pretty 00;25;45;28 - 00;26;13;12 Speaker 1 wide group of people that fit into this. But the creative class is a main economic driver has been found to be a main economic driver in cities and for the arts community, and specifically, they're sort of treated like second class citizens in that like if you're lucky, you can, you know, stand outside the box office for a half hour before a show you want to see. 00;26;13;12 - 00;26;32;06 Speaker 1 And if they have any standing room, you can go stand for 2 hours for free and watch the show. But but this artistic directors insight sort of was like, these are the people who are our main recommendation engine. They are the tastemakers in the city. They are the people who everyone goes to to say, What should I see? 00;26;32;14 - 00;26;57;28 Speaker 1 Right. And so what we were working on way back in 2020 was how to sort of like harness that energy and those people to be to start building more sustainability for arts organizations. I think this is incredibly relevant to our conversation around my digital, except it just got a lot cheaper than having to build an app in a community from scratch to offer people tickets to things in person for free where you lose a seat, you know what I mean? 00;26;58;05 - 00;27;27;27 Speaker 1 And to your point about marginal economics, like I think we had a meeting with one of the big, you know, producing organizations in New York, and they were talking about all of the money they were investing to just make 16 more seats sellable in their theaters that the obstructed view stuff. So like that means that seat has value like a very definable value. 00;27;27;27 - 00;27;45;00 Speaker 1 And so when you think about live digital in this instance that we can leverage those tastemakers, those recommendation engines without having to lose that immense value of a seat we gave them for free in person. Then you're talking about something interesting, I think. 00;27;45;29 - 00;28;08;24 Speaker 2 Really interesting. It, it got me thinking. It got me down a path of like something I don't know how American this is, but like culture as currency and like, you know, the United States is an exporter of culture, movies, music, etc.. Like the world looks. The United States often for its celebrity stars and South Korea has become a big part of this, whatever. 00;28;10;09 - 00;28;34;08 Speaker 2 And so when we like now boiled down to this world of like the creative class and like I'll call it the professional class of like it was let's just lump in lawyers, bankers, whatever, who aren't part of the cultural class. Because as Americans like, culture is cache culture as cachet and as a lawyer, banker, whatever, like you are not part of that. 00;28;34;24 - 00;28;36;29 Speaker 2 You want to be part of the class totally. 00;28;36;29 - 00;28;37;17 Speaker 1 Oh, right. 00;28;38;03 - 00;29;00;09 Speaker 2 And like, this is the bridge between those two things. It's like, oh, I am, you know, rich lawyer person. I have the money to support and support and arts organization, but I don't know anything about the arts or these organizations or what's cool or what isn't cool. I want to be closer to that world, but I don't know how to get closer because all of my intellectual pursuits are this other direction. 00;29;00;09 - 00;29;01;04 Speaker 1 Yeah, right. 00;29;01;12 - 00;29;25;14 Speaker 2 It's a bit simple, but I don't think it's untrue that like, culture drives a lot of how we all interact and experience each other inside of the states. The whole group of people that are not professionally involved in it but want to be connected to it, it feels good. Yeah, it's cool, right? That is something kind of intangible that just exists in our culture and like that. 00;29;25;14 - 00;29;38;08 Speaker 2 These people, and that this strategy is a bridge for the money that those people have and the desire that they have to be part of the world. The cultural world like this is just a way to bridge that gap. Yeah. 00;29;38;27 - 00;29;41;15 Speaker 1 I, I love that so much. 00;29;41;26 - 00;29;47;16 Speaker 2 And yet lawyers and bankers don't at me. 00;29;47;16 - 00;29;58;28 Speaker 1 You're creative too, right? That's thing. But like you said, they just don't. Don't they are and you just don't travel and yeah, the same general circles. Mm hmm. Okay. 00;29;59;12 - 00;30;01;15 Speaker 2 Like the inevitability of cool. 00;30;01;28 - 00;30;11;12 Speaker 1 Who if I wasn't going to name this episode strategy pieces already because you hate it. I would I would name it ineffably cool because that's a great phrase. 00;30;12;27 - 00;30;13;26 Speaker 2 And it's really cool. 00;30;14;00 - 00;30;17;23 Speaker 1 Joe named all the things we're talking about today as strategy pieces. 00;30;18;17 - 00;30;20;28 Speaker 2 And I hate it. I have like a talent for coming. 00;30;20;28 - 00;30;21;02 Speaker 1 Up. 00;30;21;22 - 00;30;32;28 Speaker 2 With just like quick throw off names for things just so I have a category to put ideas into and then I usually hate them. Yeah. And Strategy Pieces is one of those things that I just really dislike. 00;30;32;28 - 00;30;54;03 Speaker 1 I honestly just want to like say I think our whole company is really good at that. Like, they're really like, Jermaine's really good at that. Baby one Never forget baby 1%. Which everyone hated and we kept. Yeah, yeah, yep, yeah. Okay. All right, so those that's some of the things we were talking about, you know, when we were discussing and sort of investigating the marketing elements. 00;30;54;03 - 00;30;56;18 Speaker 1 Right. That would be a part of our digital strategy. 00;30;57;03 - 00;31;21;09 Speaker 2 Yeah. And if you're going to invest the time, the energy, the money into putting on something digitally, you have to have to have to have to wring out every drop of marketing goodness that is in there. Again, back to those marginal economics. If you're not doing that and you're not using the fact that that digital broadcast exists to reach as many people as possible, that could potentially become supporters, subscribers, members, ticket buyers. 00;31;22;01 - 00;31;22;21 Speaker 2 Then what are you doing? 00;31;22;21 - 00;31;43;27 Speaker 1 Yep, yep, yep, yep. All right. So the next tentpole is experiential elements for us, and I think this like is interesting and of course tracks because if you think about where we came from as a company, right, the first and only way you could do live digital the way back when we started was on a social media platform, right? 00;31;44;24 - 00;32;11;17 Speaker 1 That had sort of like a flat passive for the most part, consumption, consumption element to it. And one of the reasons when the pandemic hit that we immediately started building more experiential digital is because kind of back to what you were saying, Joe, if if you're going to it, you're you're going to take a marketing strategy that involves putting content out on a social platform. 00;32;11;17 - 00;32;36;20 Speaker 1 There are much cheaper, easier ways to do it and achieve your goals than a live hybrid show. And now heard to Canva. Yeah, exactly. That does not hold true once you start creating these experiential sort of events. Right. Because like they're not appropriate for social media. They are. And they create more transformation. They more deeply engage your attendees. 00;32;36;20 - 00;33;04;28 Speaker 1 So your all of a sudden, okay, now I'm not competing against social media content. These two things are not the same. And it follows that like as we are able to come back into the world, that also means it's got its twin in the real in-person world, right? Our experiential live digital has its experiential in-person twin. When we're thinking about how to leverage this live digital, as you said, because it is so cheap to get it in front of as many eyeballs as humanly possible. 00;33;06;16 - 00;33;09;18 Speaker 2 So cheap so many eyeballs to be had and. 00;33;10;07 - 00;33;10;18 Speaker 1 With the. 00;33;10;18 - 00;33;32;14 Speaker 2 Experience part well, experience and experience experiential is like downstream. It's inside of marketing, I would say, but it's like we broke it out separately because like we think it takes a different type of thought process to break beyond just what we think of as marketing. Because, yeah, we're trying to get it in front of as many eyeballs as we can, just like you said. 00;33;32;27 - 00;33;50;07 Speaker 2 But it's a whole different approach with a feeling that we're going after and like how that connects people to the identity piece that they're seeing expressed in the shows that have been chosen. Like, do I see myself inside this show? Do I feel myself inside this show, or do I see my community? And am I part of the community that is putting on this show? 00;33;50;07 - 00;33;57;14 Speaker 2 We're inside of it represented by this show. And those feelings real hard to communicate with a static Instagram ad. 00;33;57;14 - 00;34;00;09 Speaker 1 Or something like that. 00;34;00;09 - 00;34;09;12 Speaker 2 But one of the fun ideas we were riffing around with in that with this specific regional theater, it was like, what if we just had a like public screening of it, right? 00;34;09;12 - 00;34;10;19 Speaker 1 Like Met Style, right? 00;34;10;29 - 00;34;38;29 Speaker 2 Yeah. Let's now just put it on a wall somewhere, somewhere close to a foot traffic and just show people a little bit of something that they wouldn't otherwise be able to see. Because, again, outside of the equipment cost, it doesn't really cost you anything to show what is happening and to break down that barrier, like literally see through the wall in this instance, to like let people have a little feeling, a little taste of what it is that you're selling, what it is that you're putting on. 00;34;39;02 - 00;34;39;15 Speaker 2 Yeah. 00;34;39;27 - 00;35;03;25 Speaker 1 And that gets so interesting, right? Because a, it's only possible because we were pointing cameras now at what's happening indoors. B, you've got a couple of options. It's simple enough to do it live, to stream it live on the wall. But you can also obviously stream a prerecorded like a capture of one of the live performances. And then there's this sort of like third element that, of course, my creative, no one's going to be surprised. 00;35;03;25 - 00;35;23;26 Speaker 1 This is where my brain goes to where like when you create this piece of hybrid theater, you know, build in a moment where the cameras and the actors come out of one of the doors outside and have to come around the building. Gioni means like everybody who's standing there. 00;35;24;07 - 00;35;24;24 Speaker 2 Sees. 00;35;25;08 - 00;35;45;07 Speaker 1 The apartment watching on the screen. Yeah, come to life right in front of them, like you build these. It's experiential, these ringmaster moments, right? Like. And I think you even said something like the gimmicks, the wrong word, but like these gimmicks that make it feel make you feel special that you were there when that happened, you know. 00;35;45;24 - 00;36;01;00 Speaker 2 Yeah. To justify it being live. To justify it, yeah. Being something that you can only experience in that exact moment. Yeah. And that and not just streamed on, not just watched on YouTube or. Yeah. Yeah. Scrolled pass on Facebook. It's like, no, I was there. 00;36;01;00 - 00;36;05;04 Speaker 1 This crazy thing happened and what does that do. Drives word of mouth. 00;36;05;28 - 00;36;09;27 Speaker 2 Word of mouth. We're back to being cool, creative class ineffably cool. 00;36;09;27 - 00;36;15;01 Speaker 1 Ineffably cool. That's a name of a band. Well, it's a very art rock band. But, you know. 00;36;16;07 - 00;36;20;13 Speaker 2 I like it's kind of ironic, too. Yeah. Because like a band is trying to be in. 00;36;20;13 - 00;36;21;20 Speaker 1 We have to tell everybody about it. 00;36;22;13 - 00;36;47;01 Speaker 2 Yeah, yes, we have to announce it, define it, announce it. Yeah. And then sort of inside of this got, got my brain motoring on this idea of like partnerships and content as currency as we've talked about a lot in the past and so like technically partnerships is our fourth category. But again, marketing, experiential partnerships, it's all kind of blending to one the more we talk about it. 00;36;47;01 - 00;37;05;16 Speaker 2 But as we go back to, you know, attention is like currency on the Internet and content has been strategically the best way to capture attention on the Internet. And so what does everyone does it for content? What do all of these arts organizations have a skill at creating. 00;37;05;16 - 00;37;06;11 Speaker 1 Content. 00;37;06;12 - 00;37;10;21 Speaker 2 And do far better than everyone else? Content. What an idea. 00;37;10;24 - 00;37;12;08 Speaker 1 I got an A-plus. Thank God. 00;37;12;19 - 00;37;30;28 Speaker 2 Yeah. So, like, all of a sudden now it's like, okay, well, we have content. It's essentially currency. We've broken down the barriers to accessing that content by recording it live, streaming it, putting it out digitally, who are now all of the potential partners that exist out there that are saying, hi me over here. I do a film screening. 00;37;31;02 - 00;37;36;26 Speaker 2 I do this thing at my brewery. I do a public, you know, film series, whatever. 00;37;37;06 - 00;37;37;22 Speaker 1 Nonprofit. 00;37;37;22 - 00;37;38;00 Speaker 2 Are the. 00;37;38;01 - 00;37;42;02 Speaker 1 Nonprofit, right. That wants to provide, you know. Yeah, impact but yes, yes. 00;37;42;04 - 00;37;56;04 Speaker 2 That are all now desperate for content, you know, maybe desperate and unfair word. But they're looking for content. They're looking for interesting stories being told in a visual medium. And oh, lookie. That's exactly what we have. 00;37;56;12 - 00;37;58;00 Speaker 1 How did we end up here? 00;37;58;19 - 00;38;29;10 Speaker 2 And so, yeah, starting to barter, to swap, to create those connections. And ultimately what that allows to do is to get in front of more people. Yeah. Even if there is no money being exchanged, you know, in theory this partner has the equipment set up already, so you're saving money there and then you are reaching there, hopefully different audience, you know, hopefully someone who isn't already invested in or subscribing to your season if you're original theater, but allowing you to branch outside and reach new audiences that could become part of your community. 00;38;30;03 - 00;38;58;27 Speaker 1 So when you think about years one through five for an arts organization like this, 2022 is year one, right? Where mostly post ish COVID, where rebuilding we're reinventing. We're taking a step forward. As our friend said, we've got it. We've got to build the future of our organizations. You said earlier your one pick a couple of smart digital engagements and just smear the world with them, like get as many eyeballs on them as possible. 00;38;58;27 - 00;39;21;02 Speaker 1 Give it away for free. Mm hmm. Is and let's talk maybe even about the idea of, like, a corporate partner, as a good example of this is in your mind, is then the idea you get it in front of so many eyeballs that a smaller sub section of those eyeballs, like one corporation in town, let's say, will pay you for that content in year or two. 00;39;21;02 - 00;39;45;10 Speaker 1 And you're then continuing to like do this piece of your initiative that is give it away for free. But you've started to move people towards also paying for it or becoming a digital audience member like. How do you think about that? Like what? How how does your one end basic? Like what? Where does it end? For me as an organization as trying to even conceptualize how digital revenue is going to start informing my visitor. 00;39;46;01 - 00;40;00;09 Speaker 2 Yeah, well, great question. And I do think even in year one, we are selling tickets, right? We're giving away a ton. But they're still, you know, and at the beginning, at the core, on the website, it's paid ticket to digital. 00;40;00;09 - 00;40;01;24 Speaker 1 And in person you mean digital. 00;40;01;24 - 00;40;32;07 Speaker 2 And in person, yeah. So it's like buying one, get one or whatever. Yeah, right. Show up to this park, see it for free for one night. But there's still paying tickets in there. But yeah I view, I view, I view year one as very much like get it in front of as many people as possible to test out what the heck is real and what is, and to see where those pockets of community and just audience are that maybe you haven't had the ability to tap into with just your in-person programing. 00;40;32;07 - 00;41;02;21 Speaker 2 Yeah. So, you know, universities that are nearby, you know, we talked about the fact that those people that turn over every four years, so it's really hard to invest in them because the lifetime value of them as a customer or a subscriber drops off after four years, which, you know, cuts the lifetime value by a lot. Yeah. So now that we have all of these different communities that are tapping into in theory, a low cost way, we're learning who's actually showing up, whether or not they're willing to pay. 00;41;02;22 - 00;41;23;25 Speaker 2 Did they buy a ticket or was it a free ticket? Did they end up coming to something else? Right. We're collecting information probably via an email or something like that about these pockets of community. So we're already starting to convert people in that first year. But really it's just about building the list. It's about developing, developing and getting into each of those communities to then build on top of that strategy. 00;41;23;25 - 00;41;48;20 Speaker 2 So it's like, great. We've actually figured out that there are lots of young professionals, there are actually lots of young professionals in the city that, you know, want to do a date night at the theater and that they didn't think it was for them or the content and appeal to them or, you know, those sorts of things. So we're learning more about what the content they want to see is that helps the program out years two through five. 00;41;49;14 - 00;42;19;12 Speaker 2 And we took a risk on a, uh, a show in year one that yeah. Then informs and provides proof to the fact that we can take other, maybe bigger risks or more risks on different shows because we think and we believe through data that the audience is there for that type of show. So it's it's all about like collecting information to inform future decisions and yes, so now back to like the actual money part of it. 00;42;19;17 - 00;42;40;16 Speaker 2 So our existing strategies, our subscribers, members, you know, people who are paying to be a part of that community, but then also just individual ticket buyers. And I think those are the two key ones. There's other things, you know, philanthropy, whatever. We're not talking about this right now. So across that year one and then into year two through five, it's building that pipeline. 00;42;40;16 - 00;43;03;17 Speaker 2 And where does this digital audience fit into that pipeline? In reality, we'll have theories in year one and we'll test those theories. Yeah, but in reality, how is it doing? Because we're going to continue giving tickets away again. Low marginal cost. Well, if in theory, in your two, three, four, five, we're doing more lasting productions to appeal to a younger audience that's more shows and more tickets and more ways to give things away if we want to, to cultivate those audiences. 00;43;03;17 - 00;43;19;15 Speaker 2 But we'll have a better sense at this point which communities we're going into, because we've tested in year one and we can be a little bit more targeted. We don't just have to like spray it everywhere. We can say, Hey, this is what has worked well, let's put a little bit more energy into those and continue experimenting over here and there. 00;43;21;12 - 00;43;45;08 Speaker 2 And so some percentage of those people become subscribers, some percentage of those people buy in-person tickets. Some percent of those people buy lasting tickets. Some percentage of those people don't do anything yet. But we have a bit more information to inform what years? Yeah, two, three, four, five look like and where to push and put more money to increase conversion on subscriber membership, to increase conversion on in-person ticket sales. 00;43;46;07 - 00;44;07;08 Speaker 2 Because I love that stuff that you always bring up about people engaging with digital arts content makes them, you know, three times more likely to engage, like go and experience something in-person. Yeah, right. Let's, let's prove that out with data for a specific regional theater and figure out the right words to actually get that person to show up the right email marketing campaign, to get that person to show up to an in-person show. 00;44;07;14 - 00;44;33;01 Speaker 2 So it's it's starting to fine tune all of the data we collected by spreading and praying in year one. Yeah. And getting them towards those other revenue specific goals of Yeah. Seats invites, subscribers, digital ticket sales for those additional livestream shows. But I also agree that like partnerships are a little bit more nebulous in this because like I don't know specifically what's going on with this regional theater. 00;44;33;01 - 00;44;33;08 Speaker 1 Yeah. 00;44;34;02 - 00;44;54;01 Speaker 2 But yeah. Why not have a corporate sponsor, right? Oh yeah. And you're now reaching because you have digital audiences that you've cultivated and there's just in theory more of them than your in-person subscriber base. You're just reaching more people. You've got your newsletter list, you've got your live streams that are all supported. So it's just like the scale of it all is a bit bigger. 00;44;54;19 - 00;45;15;24 Speaker 2 So can you then appeal to larger organizations who might fund your season just based on that scale and like, Oh yeah, no I want to come in and support you do original theater and I can justify this sell it up the chain because of the, the increased size of the audience that you have. 00;45;15;24 - 00;45;43;05 Speaker 1 What I really love about this as we sort of bring this episode to a close is previously in Arts in the Arts in America. That that last element that you were mentioning like collect data to inform decisions. Right. Basically boil down to here's what was possible in theater. Here's the data we collected. Mm hmm. Audience surveys, which are, you know, they are what they are, but they're certainly not the whole picture. 00;45;43;05 - 00;46;15;16 Speaker 1 It's not a ton of great usable data. Right? Yeah. And it's expensive and time consuming cultural preference. So, i.e., what a largely older white audience oftentimes has like responded to as cultural preference, like, you know, via the power of buying tickets. That's the piece of data. We, we hate that one that turns into a terrible feedback loop. And the third, like financial power, the wealthiest people sit on your board and they wield the most power. 00;46;15;16 - 00;46;33;09 Speaker 1 So they are a source of data that informs your decision making. Oh, and I forgot the fourth and most important one and the one I love with theater, which is just like magic, right? You make that magic moment in theater and people, you know, respond to it, buy tickets and all that stuff like and that is really hard. 00;46;33;11 - 00;46;58;24 Speaker 1 Like that is impossible to quantify and is the thing I love the most about theater. So we don't have a really reliable sort of like engine for the business of theater because so much of it is based on this ephemeral or the experience that you can't nail down and it's hard to collect data around and is driven by probably outsized financial empower and input and all of those things. 00;46;59;06 - 00;47;23;26 Speaker 1 So what live digital ends up starting to do if the goal of live digital is and I'm amending my statement the beginning of this episode, the goal of live digital is to grow your audiences, drive new lines of revenue and collect data that informs sound choices. This brings us back to what I've always loved about live digital in a theatrical context, which is like it makes the magic part of it more sustainable. 00;47;23;26 - 00;47;24;20 Speaker 1 Do you know what I mean? 00;47;24;20 - 00;47;26;13 Speaker 2 It is a total hit machine. 00;47;26;13 - 00;47;51;18 Speaker 1 Yeah, it does work for you that allows you to not have to be so worried about trying to make the magic, you know, having to have that magic moment or whatever. Like you get more information, you understand more you have more repeatable processes at scale that help drive, drive everything forward so that you can just do the in-person, like beautiful work that you're already doing at your theater, you know, and feel less at risk. 00;47;52;00 - 00;48;06;12 Speaker 1 At risk of everything at someone's preference, just changing all of a sudden and them not giving you the money they said they were going to give you at a show tanking that you just didn't expect a tank. Yeah, I just I love that about how you just described all of that. 00;48;06;26 - 00;48;08;27 Speaker 2 Yeah, like we're future proofing. 00;48;09;09 - 00;48;23;05 Speaker 1 Yeah, the theater. Yeah, I love that. Well, this is so exciting. I'm. I'm thrilled. And now, you know, now we have a five year product to work with theaters on, which is really fun. 00;48;23;05 - 00;48;25;21 Speaker 2 Thanks. I heard it here first. He invented it. 00;48;25;25 - 00;48;37;26 Speaker 1 And this show was really like, I really hope there's not like future competitors listening to this podcast because we're just telling them how we run our business. Worth it, totally worth it, but. 00;48;37;26 - 00;48;45;17 Speaker 2 Totally worth it. I mean, I think I said this before that like having an idea pretty easy. Yeah. Executing the idea very well. 00;48;45;21 - 00;49;04;12 Speaker 1 Yeah. And I also think about I really, I'm going to brag on us for a second. Right. But you know, this is what we're thinking about today. And like we're going to be thinking about something ten steps in the future by next week. Right? Because we have such a wealth of knowledge accumulated around this and there's such an influx of work going on in our company. 00;49;04;12 - 00;49;21;17 Speaker 1 So I feel really good about like sharing this process and this journey and our thoughts with every all of you all who listen simply because it's like it's not like we're going to stop right here and this is the only thing we are ever able to offer. And if you also offer it, we are in trouble, you know? 00;49;22;02 - 00;49;23;02 Speaker 2 Yeah, totally. 00;49;24;19 - 00;49;33;18 Speaker 1 Well, that was a super fun episode of the podcast, y'all. Quick note. We're going to take a little summer break right after this episode. 00;49;33;20 - 00;49;35;02 Speaker 2 We're going we're going into the woods. 00;49;35;03 - 00;49;38;19 Speaker 1 Jo's going to the woods. 00;49;38;19 - 00;49;41;26 Speaker 2 So, yeah, if I'm lost in the Yosemite wilderness, please come find me. 00;49;41;26 - 00;49;58;15 Speaker 1 Yeah, yeah. So we're going to take two weeks off. We'll be back. Summer camp. Yeah, hopefully you will as well. And then we'll meet you back here at the end of July. For what I anticipate it's going to be a really interesting year here at Broadway, unlocked and all together now. 00;49;58;15 - 00;49;59;08 Speaker 2 Never a dull moment. 00;49;59;11 - 00;50;00;10 Speaker 1 Never a dull moment. 00;50;00;20 - 00;50;23;24 Speaker 2 I'm Jo, and I'm just. And we'll see you back here in two weeks.