Epi 63 - Michelle Onaka [00:00:00] Ashley: Welcome to the Money Mindset Podcast, where you will find the inspiration and motivation you need to manage your money better so you can stress less and live the life you want. [00:00:16] It's Ashley with Budgets Made Easy and the Money Mindset Podcast. Today's episode we're going to talk to Michelle, who is a mom of two young children, and she's also a part-time university, academic counselor. Supporting first-generation college students and founder of Intentional Money Life. So we're actually going to have her on again, to talk about college and paying for college and taking advantage and, you know, using your resources wisely to limit the college debt for either you or your children. Uh, but today's episode is about her journey with, you know, minimizing student loan debt. She ended up graduating with just $5,000 in student loan debt for her undergraduate and none with her graduate. And she did some unique things along the way to help pay for it, and really was very intentional about the life she wanted to live. And she did the thing she needed to do to live that life and travel and see the world while going to college and minimizing her debt along the way. [00:01:25] So this interview takes some twists and turns as we talk about a lot of different things, but the overall message is really about knowing your why, and living your life with intention. Which goes toward your financial goals as well. Of course, you know, being able to live that life that you really want instead of the life that you have to live, because you're shackled with debt and bills, right. [00:01:55] So if you are ready to get started and you haven't yet grabbed your Free Budgeting Starter Kit, go to budgetsmadeeasy.com/start and that'll help you just get started with managing your money better. And so let's dive into Michelle's episode and you're in for a journey. I will say with this one. [00:02:21] Hi Michelle. I'm so happy to share your story with everyone today. [00:02:26] Michelle: Hi thank you so much for having me. [00:02:30] Ashley: Absolutely. And I was just kind of reading over the notes and the highlights of your journey to financial freedom and all the things. And I'm just amazed at your story because it is unique. Most people, you know, haven't been in the AmeriCorps and, you know, living at home through college and all the things. You know, now you're, um, a hundred thousand dollars invested and you know, you've just really traveled the journey traveled the world, literally. Um, and so I'm really excited to kind of go through your journey as much as you're willing to share with our audience, because, you know, they're busy moms, they're looking for some inspiration. They may not think that they can do it or that it's possible for them. And so I would love for you to just kind of start and tell us your background and kind of, you know, wherever you want to start your money journey. [00:03:26] Michelle: Yeah. Um, I guess I'll start with college. Um, so I went to. Uh, university in my hometown, which was the cheapest option. It allowed me to live at home and I knew that my family didn't have that much money to send me to school. And I wasn't as smart as my brother. So I didn't have the academic scholarships that they did. And so I lived at home, but I kind of hated living at home, not the like living at home part, but the living in my own town, I really, really wanted to travel. [00:03:58] I had, at this point, by the time I started college, I had flown once. And that was when my friend's family took me somewhere basically. And so I really wanted to travel the world. And so I went to college in my hometown after the very first year in college, I went and I worked in Vermont at a seasonal job at a resort. And then I just kind of that started. Process of just every summer, at least working at a seasonal job. And then sometimes in the winter is working a seasonal job. And so just while I was in college in Ohio, I actually lived in Vermont, West Virginia, Colorado. Ecuador and Texas all while I was in school in Ohio. [00:04:38] Ashley: Oh, that's really unique. So how did you, like, how did you find the seasonal jobs all over? You're just like, oh, I want to travel. Where can I, what can I do? [00:04:52] Michelle: That was so what's funny is that my mom actually worked seasonal jobs when she was in college. And back in her day, she had to go to the library and get out like a big book or a, I don't even honestly know what she did. And she got out her typewriter and wrote 10 letters to random resorts. And that's how she applied in my day. It was a lot easier. So there was a website, cool works. I don't even know if it was a .com or.org, but that's where a bunch of the seasonal jobs were listed. And so I just applied to a bunch of seasonal jobs that I was interested in and I was kinda like, well, they say I have a job. So I'm going to buy a flight to Vermont and hope someone shows up to pick me up and we'll see what happens. [00:05:33] Ashley: That's all. So most people aren't that adventurous or, you know, looking outside the box of ways to make money, especially in college. So how did you manage. Um, college and the seasonal jobs. Did you do online school or were you just working when you were out of school. [00:05:52] Michelle: It depends which one? So the very first one was a summer job. So a summer job in Vermont, that was my first experience. Then the following winter, I worked in West Virginia. And so at my university, it was a quarter system. We had a six week winter break, so I got a job. And when I was staying there for that time, and then once I started school again, I was actually just driving back and forth like every other weekend and staying on friends' couches to finish working at that seasonal job in West Virginia. [00:06:15] Then the next summer I did another seasonal job in lake Erie. Um, but I was out of school then, then I did a winter in Colorado. And that time I took online classes, all online classes for that term. And then I studied abroad in Ecuador. So that was how I got to live in Ecuador. And then I stayed in, traveled in Ecuador and Peru for the summer. And then on the way home, I was flying through Houston and I was like, Hey, that's close to Austin. Maybe I'll just live in Austin. And then I took online classes again for that term. And then I went home and graduated. [00:06:53] Ashley: That's awesome. So what advice would you have for somebody that maybe their kids are getting ready for college, or maybe they're wanting, or they're getting ready to go to school or back to school to kinda, um, take that leap and really just put yourself out there and take the life by the horns, so to speak. I don't know how else to say it, but you know what I mean? Like to really, cause that's not in my nature. Like I am an introvert to the core. I don't want to leave my house, but it sounds so fun. Like I'd like the option to go somewhere, but I don't really want to go. [00:07:30] Michelle: Yeah. [00:07:31] Ashley: So what would you like tell somebody kind of, just to kind of even just to help with the college, you know, debts and finding creative ways to help pay for. [00:07:42] Michelle: Yeah, I mean, and so actually now I work part of my part-time job is a trio SSS academic counselor. And so I work with, I work at a university. I work with first-generation and Pell-eligible college students, and I support them through their college experience. And so it's interesting being on this side because maybe even what I would always say wouldn't necessarily be, you know, the perspective changes when you're at the university now. [00:08:08] I don't know that I have anything profound to say that, except in general in life, I think getting clear about what you really care about is the thing that should kind of lead your life. Right. So if you know, what do you value? What do you care about? How do you, what do you actually enjoy? How do you want to spend your time? [00:08:28] Um, you know, thinking, Hey, when I'm 80 years old. What do I want to look back on? What do I want, what experiences do I want to have? And once you understand really what matters to you, then I think, it's only a matter of, okay, how do I figure out how to make that happen? And that could be financially. That could be, you know, where do you want to go to college or what you want to do? You know, I really actually wanted to go away to college. And so I didn't do that. But what I did was figure out how to live all over the place while I was still going to an in-state school, basically. [00:08:58] Ashley: So yea and your situation might even be a little better because you got to go to multiple places and like check out different parts of the world. That's great. [00:09:05] Michelle: And so instead of saving money to travel, I got to travel to save money in a way. Right. I got to work in the place that I was able to travel and make money. Yeah, [00:09:13] Ashley: Yea absolutely. Like I love it. So, um, once you were done with college, did you have any debt or were you able to kinda, um, pay for things as you worked or maybe a mix. [00:09:25] Michelle: I only had a small amount of debt. Um, I had lived in the residence hall for two terms at the very beginning of my college experience. And I had gone into debt for that. And then I had a little bit of debt that was kind of split between my study abroad program, as well as I actually, part of the debt that I took out was to build an emergency fund. [00:09:43] I was like, you know what? I don't have the capacity to earn enough money right now to have a solid emergency fund. And I think that that's really important and I have access to this fairly inexpensive debt. And what I did was I just, you know, put that money into a savings account. And then I kept topping off that savings account so that I always had a solid emergency fund and then was paying back the debt. So I graduated with about $5,000 of debt. [00:10:05] Ashley: That's like nothing. I mean, really. So did your parents instill in you, um, the value of an emergency fund? Because that's not usually something. Kids in college are really thinking about. [00:10:19] Michelle: That's a really good question. And I don't think so, but I don't know where I came up with it. I don't know. I don't know. [00:10:26] Ashley: Great that you were thinking about it at such a young age because that's not typical. [00:10:31] Michelle: Yeah. Yeah. I know. And when I, with my college students, I talked to them all the time. The emergency funds and all sorts of financial topics. But I truthfully do not know where I came up with the idea. I think it was probably just that I knew that I wanted to travel and I knew that to be able to afford to travel, even if it was just, you know, getting a job in Alaska, which is what I did when I graduated, I needed to be able to pay for my flight upfront. And so I think I probably just had an understanding that I wanted to travel and that the way that I was going to have to be able to travel was that I needed to have at least some money that I would be able to put forth for me to be able to do these certain experience. [00:11:06] Ashley: That's great. So you said you help, um, uh, students now with like Pell grants and, um, did you say first-generation or? Um, so yeah, I thought so. I was trying to remember exactly how you worded it. Um, what advice do you have for maybe kids going into college now with their options? Because I mean, The cost has just skyrocketed. I didn't even realize, I think it seems like it's a lot harder to get Pell grants. Now, when I first met, like my first year of college, I got Pell grant and then I think that was it. Like, that was the last time I got one. Um, and I, from what I hear, it sounds like it's harder to get them now. [00:11:46] Michelle: The EFC calculation, the expected family contribution calculation is really strange. I mean, really looking at the students that I'm working with, the ones that have the full Pell eligibility or a zero EFC, you know, their families are making like $30,000 and supporting four people on it or something it's. Yeah. Pell grants are definitely hard to get, unless you're from a very low-income family or if you have very little access to resources. And so I would say in general for going to college, It's about strategy. Um, so for some students, that strategy is going to a community college first and then transferring to a university, but they have to be very strategic in that transfer because if you don't know what university you're going to go to, if your end goal is to graduate from a university with a degree in four years, and you're trying to go to a community college first, you have to know that and you have to try to be very strategic. You have to know, honestly, you have to know a lot of things that you can't know by yourself. So you really have to rely on the people at hopefully the community college and the university to get good advice. [00:12:48] Because I work with students who transfer into my university and they're like, yeah, I've always known I wanted to study biology and yet they come in and they haven't done any of the math or science requirements that we would have had them do in their first two years. And so if you have access to an advisor at the university where you want to graduate from, and you're not going to originally start there, I would really start with that advisor if possible. [00:13:11] So where I live, we actually have a program that allows you to be a university student at my university while being a full-time student at a community college. And by being a student at our, my university, that means you have access to the advising, you have access to the resources. And so things like that, figuring out, you know, what do you need to need to do to be strategic? [00:13:30] And so I have students who are coming from say California to Oregon, to their university. And we tell them, okay, you can take online classes that will make it cheaper for you. You can take classes at the local community college that would make it cheaper for you, you know, really strategizing because you know that the final couple of years that you're in college, you're probably going to be primarily at your university, right? Because that's where the 300 and 400 level classes are. And so how can I make the first couple of years cheaper, or maybe you want to become an RA so that you live in the residence halls and you don't have to pay for your housing or. Reaching out to the people at your university or in your situation that can help you understand how you can be strategic is really important. [00:14:10] Ashley: Yeah. I love that. I didn't realize that you could do the community college with some universities kind of at the same time now here. And I don't know if it's the same where you live. Um, they have some programs where you can take the community college classes in high school. And so you can actually grab. High school with an associates degree. Um, but I know a lot of people worry about the credits not transferring and things like that. So I think that goes back to what you said about being strategic and knowing what you need and, you know, knowing what the university will take for your credits and all that kind of stuff. [00:14:43] Michelle: Yeah. I would be really careful taking a lot of credits without knowing what you're going towards, because if you really want to be an engineer, especially something like engineering, that is really, you need a full four years, maybe longer to be taking those classes. And if you get all of the you know, the things, just kind of the random classes out of the way, you're going to get down to like, wait a second. So I'm supposed to shove four years of engineering classes into two years somehow, and that's not really going to be manageable. And so, yeah, really getting an idea. It's okay to take. And I did, I actually took some university courses when I was in college and it can be a great strategy, but if you don't know what you want to do, or if you know that you wanna do something like engineering and you aren't able to take, get started with engineering courses right away, I would be very careful taking too many credits in that kind of situation. [00:15:32] Ashley: Yeah. That's smart. Like I hadn't thought about that. So I'm glad that we're talking about that. Even though that wasn't our intention of today's episode. It was horses. We've talked more about you, but I've just loved the information because this is not my wheelhouse. And so when I get somebody, we start talking about college and how to make it easier for people. So maybe we need to have you back to talk about college strategies because it is a problem like in people don't, you don't know what you don't know. And I know so many parents that they didn't realize that they would be responsible for some of the student loans until their kids started applying and they did the FASFA and then they're surprised that they got to take out parent plus loans, which are just the highest interest rate and the worst student loan. You know, they just assume that the kid would take all the student loans. And so, yeah. [00:16:21] Michelle: It's and the student thinks like, oh, I can just become independent. My parents don't support me. And it's like, well, how old are you? Are you married? Do you have kids? Like, there are very specific ways you can be independent and that's not most students. [00:16:33] Ashley: Exactly. It's not. And it's frustrating. And you know, I know people that were estrange from their family, their parents like his abusive childhood, and they're trying to go to school and better themselves and they can't even fill out the FASFA because they don't have their parents' information. And it's just, it's a hassle. [00:16:51] Michelle: Yeah. Yeah. And if, and if there is a situation that's like that, especially if they don't have any contact, if it's not a safe situation, often you can work with your university to be considered an independent student, but it's not just like, my parents don't want to pay money or they don't have money to pay for me. It's it's more than that. It's like a very specific type of situation to become an independent student. [00:17:11] Ashley: Yeah, I know. And it's hard. So yes, we will have to have you back and talk about that, but, all right, so you graduated college, you didn't have a whole lot of debt, but you've traveled the world. So tell me about the, I don't even know if I'm saying it right, because that's, my brain just doesn't work that right. But, um, the AmeriCorps volunteer. Tell me about that. Like, how did that work? I've always been interested in. [00:17:36] Michelle: Yeah. Yeah. So, so first, once I graduated, I kept kind of working seasonally for a while. I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do when I decided on a, on a major in college, I honestly had no idea what I wanted to do. And so I was still in that process of trying to figure things out. And so once I started landing on a realm that I thought I wanted to work in, I was applying to try to get some sort of experience in that realm. And so I actually applied to several AmeriCorps Programs and I ended up being a College Access Coach maybe. [00:18:07] And so I worked with high school seniors and it was the same population that I work with now, Pell eligible students, first generation students, students of color, undocumented students, things like that. And I was just helping them get ready for college and AmeriCorps. So it's a year of service. It's kind of like the Peace Corps, except for it's in the US you apply and get, get, um, you, it's not like a match system, like the Peace Corps, you actually apply directly to the program that you want to work for rice, and it's only a one-year contract or 11 months or something. [00:18:40] Um, and you get paid. So I think I made like $12,000 for a year. So it's not a lot of money, but most of the people that do it are on snap. And you also get, if you complete your term of service, you get a 5,000 ish, 5,500 something like that education award. And so I was able to live on the 12,000 and so it was fine. [00:19:06] It supported us enough. We did get snap. Really helpful. And then to go to graduate school, which is what I did the year after I was in AmeriCorps. I was able to request that money and I requested it out over three tax years so that it wasn't a huge tax implication for me. And then I just, that 5,000 or whatever, it was just extra money that I, I got to live on and I had an assistantship in graduate school. [00:19:26] So I actually wasn't paying for graduate school either. And so I didn't have to get any student debt for graduate school either, which was fine. [00:19:34] Ashley: You are just rocking it. I just love hearing these stories because a lot of people don't think that you can go to college so cheaply, or are finding ways to save money, to go to college. So knockout grad school. Um, so tell us about your financial journey now, because it doesn't sound like you had a lot of debt, but you have been able to really invest and, you know, help other people with their college and finding ways to pay for it. So tell us a little bit about that. [00:20:05] Michelle: Yeah. So I graduated from my master's program in 2015. I probably would have been, I don't know, 28 ish, I'm guessing. And at that point I got my first full-time year-round benefits eligible job before that all I had done was working seasonally and working in tourism and things like that. And so this was like, I have access to a 403B and I get vacation leave. I had never had vacation leave in my life. So that was amazing. And so actually, when I got that job, I got that job right after I had gotten married. And so my partner and I had actually met in 2009 in Alaska, my very first summer after I graduated from college. And we had been traveling around together for the those years. [00:20:48] And. So we got married in December. I got my first full-time job in April of 2015. And so we actually, I think it was so around that time we combined our income. Okay. So we were, once I started my job, we combined our income and we lived on my income and we saved all of his to buy a house. [00:21:10] Ashley: Wow. [00:21:10] Michelle: We also in the wedding, we did not spend a lot of money on a wedding. It was like, there were 16 people there including us, and we did not have a registry. So we did not have, there was nothing that people could, could send us or anything. And so if people wanted to give us anything, they gave us money to buy and that was to put towards a home purchase. And so in between saving his money, as well as any gifts we got from the wedding, we were able to save about $40,000 to use as a down payment for our house. And so, yeah, we bought a house in May of 2016. So one year after I started that job, we were able to buy a house. And we did not put 20% down. That was 11%. We were able to put down, but we got into the house and realized after we got into it, that it was in far worse quality than we thought. So we then spent the next year ish just redoing, like redoing the drywall. Moving the bathroom, like pretty extensive renovation. [00:22:11] Ashley: Uh, let's get our major there. So were you able to, it sounds like you're just kind of naturally frugal. Is your husband kind of the same way? Are you on the same page with that stuff? [00:22:22] Michelle: Yes, we are both naturally frugal. We are both willing to spend money when it matters. And so for him, sometimes that's like, I will spend money to get this nice phone and then I will keep this nice phone for a very long time. And then for me, that gas often been travel or experiences. And so, yeah, we're very on the same page with money. We're both ready to, you know, be frugal and, you know, we don't want to spend a lot of money that we won't need to spend. And at the same time we want to spend money when it matters. And so, yeah, so we spent that year remodeling the house and otherwise not spending a lot of money. I was also pregnant, I think. I don't even know. Yeah. I guess I got pregnant at the beginning of 2017. So we had been in the house for maybe eight months or something when I got pregnant. And so we were remodeling the house up until the day before my baby was born. So we actually remodeled our master bedroom and we moved it back into the master bedroom at night and the next morning I woke up in labor, [00:23:22] Ashley: At least you got it done before, right? [00:23:24] Michelle: Yeah. Yeah. So that was very lucky. And so, yeah, so that whole time, I feel like most of our spending was most, mostly just in the house, but we were doing the work ourselves and so we hardly had to pay anyone to do it. Um, my husband's very, hands-on kind of person he's very good at, you know, he was very good at the dry wall and stuff like that. So yeah. Then we had a baby and then I was like, oh, I don't want to work full time. So I had planned to, you know, use my leave and extend it. So I only went back at halftime when I first went back, but then I, it came time to go back to full-time and I was like, ah, I can't do this. [00:24:00] Ashley: I can't do it. [00:24:01] Michelle: And so without even talking to my partner about it, I went to my boss and was it. I would like to work part time. And I was really lucky that my boss said I could, and that my partner was supportive with that, but he works. He works 50 hour weeks as a welder and a machinist. And so he's very physical and hands-on and working a lot. And I feel like I should have thought about this ahead of time, but I didn't, but that everything was going to fall to me and the labor of. You know, being a parent and being the person that drops people off places and picks them up and the logistics and figuring things out, all of that was really gonna fall to me. And so I'm really glad that I was able to step back and I hadn't planned for that financial. And so we were just lucky that he does not work in higher education and actually gets raises. And so his income had actually gone up in those like eight or whatever years that he had worked at his job. And he, yeah, his money is able to support us and my income is for investing. [00:25:01] So all the money that I earned just go straight into investing. [00:25:05] Ashley: So what advice would you have for somebody that is kind of trying to figure out what their priorities are, and maybe they do want to travel a lot like you, but they have too much debt. They feel like they, they're not ever going to be able to and things like that. So what would you, um, what kind of advice would you give somebody?? [00:25:27] Michelle: Um, so actually my very first Instagram post ever was a priorities list. And so I think just going through and saying, okay, where am I on this list? And what do I need to be doing? And so if anyone wants to go to my Instagram, You can find that. And so it's, you know, building some amount of emergency fund first and then getting your employers full match. If you have an employer that offers a 401k and a match, kind of things like that to really get started. And then I think if you just start working through those, then you start adding in some of your own priorities. And so as much as you might want to travel, if you have a lot of credit card debt, probably not the time for you to travel. But you can really use that to motivate you to attack that credit card debt very quickly, because you know that, you know, once this $500 that I'm putting towards the credit card, once I pay off these credit cards, I can move that money and I can put it into something else. And so it's a little bit of a balancing act between kind of what do you need to do and then getting to, okay, what do you want to do? What can you do? And so in my priorities list, I have so step seven, which is and it, and I think for everyone, it can be different. It can be, maybe you have, if you have a lot of debt, that's at 7%, maybe you might do it differently. But for me, I say after you've paid off all of that debt over 7%, then you move on to focusing on your short and long-term goals, your short and long-term goals. [00:26:54] And so if those goals involve a lot of travel, then definitely get, get to that, you know, figure out what do you need to do? Uh, and I do actually have a I have a course called Money Goals Clarity, and it's, it's like, what, what matters to you? How can you, in the short term, how can you create your life a little bit more like what, what actually matters to you? And so some of that is. Just thinking through, it might not be financially. It might be that you're just not going on hikes enough and you really want to do that. And then some of that would be okay, let me set a short-term goal. What will motivate me? And so even truthfully, even though I'm saying, Hey, really focused on the credit card debt, maybe you say, okay, out of every a hundred dollars, $10 will go towards my travel fund and $90, like this is it's personal finances personal, right? [00:27:43] And so this is a guideline to use, but if you know that you're going to be a lot more motivated about the travel than anything else than fine. No, one's here to tell you, you have to do it any certain way. Um, so yeah, I would say, just get really clear on what you really care about and look at your financial situation and kind of create a plan of attack for that. [00:28:03] Ashley: I love that you mentioned the $10, you know, pay a hundred dollars and put $10 aside because. You know, some people like to say you can't spend any extra money to owe your debt is paid off. Like nothing. You can't go out to eat. You can't do anything, but that's really not the best motivator for long term success. So I love that you mentioned that because I think you do need those little rewards and those little nuggets of motivation to really be successful over time instead of just the short term gains. So, uh, do you have any last words of wind stem or anything that you want people to walk away from with this episode, I feel like you've given us a lot to think about, so I don't know if you have anything else to give us. [00:28:51] Michelle: Um, I would say it's been a lot and it's been very random, but we do take a journey. [00:28:59] One of the things that we didn't really talk about that I just want to mention in this is another, I have a visual about this on Instagram is no, you heard. I didn't. I, so I maybe did. I didn't mention it. I didn't really start investing actually until more like 2016 actually. And so it's only been six years or so since I started investing at all and my partner and I were still in the 12% tax bracket, so we're not making a whole lot of money and, at the same time I now have maybe I don't right now because of the stock market, but I have a hundred thousand dollars invested in my personal accounts. [00:29:33] Ashley: Wow. And that's amazing [00:29:35] Michelle: yeah, that's pretty amazing. Especially because like I said, we don't make that much money and I didn't start for a long time. And the sooner you start the easier it is for it to grow. Right. So I wish that I had started a whole lot earlier than that, but it can definitely be possible, especially once you have, once you've taken care of that emergency fund, that you've taken the care of the credit card debt, you've taken care of some of those things and that, you know, especially when there's something like a pandemic. And so you're not actually going and traveling to see in-laws like you plan to whatever. But yeah. So whoever you are, whatever you're doing, take those steps. And maybe it is maybe the steps for you are paying off the debt first, but take those steps. Get started investing, learn about investing because you can actually grow money and you don't even have to have that much of it to start growing it. But just starting is really important. [00:30:28] Ashley: Yes, absolutely. So where can people find more about you and I'll link to the free course that you mentioned as well? Um, but where can people, where are you at the most? [00:30:40] Michelle: That's a good question. Apparently new business. And I haven't decided exactly where I am. I would say Instagram probably is good, or I have a Facebook group, and that is intentional money, life, personal finance for a life you love. I think that would be a really good space because I think that there's so much value in just being in a community and listening to people and asking questions and getting genuine responses. And I'm in several financial Facebook groups. Really, really small because this one's new. And so, you know that you can actually get to know these people and you're going to get responses from me. You know, it's not a big, scary, like, okay, there's 80,000 people and they're always posting a bunch of things. And so that would be a good place to go as well. And then I do have uh, launching at the beginning of June, I will have a course and that's to help people walk through, you know, what is my situation? What do I care about? What are my goals? How does compound interest worse work? And then also like, how do I get started investing? What are all the things that I need to know to be able to figure out how to create a life that I love. And so that would be a good program to join. It includes kind of the support and the one-on-one accountability and all of that from me as well, which is kind of what I do in my university job as well, you know, working with people one-on-one to help them get to a place and get their answers that they need and accountability and all that. [00:32:03] Ashley: And I love that you focus on, you know, what is important to you and the overall big picture. Because a lot of times we get so focused on the budget or, you know, paying off debt, but not looking at the overall picture and why you want to do those things and really dig deep because that's where your long-term motivation and progress is going to come from. You can make short-term progress with all the tips and tricks and hacks and all the things, but to really be like, Successful. You've got to figure out your big overall vision for your life. [00:32:37] Michelle: So where are you going and why? And if you don't know those things and you're not really going anywhere, probably at least not very fast. [00:32:43] Ashley: Yeah, exactly. You just kind of wander through life. So I love that you are focusing on that. So thank you so much for sharing all this kind of random journey with us today. We really did go on a journey there, but it was great. You gave us lots of good information. So we'll have to have you back to talk about this, uh, college and student loans and all that kind of stuff at another date, because I know you have probably a lot more, you can talk about on that subject. [00:33:12] Michelle: Yeah. I'd be happy to do that. [00:33:14] Ashley: Thanks so much for being with us today. [00:33:16] Michelle: Thank you. [00:33:18] Ashley: Well, that was a journey of different topics, but you get the overall idea of really living an intentional life and focusing on your big, why, so that you can really be successful in the long run. And if you are just getting started, don't forget to go grab your Budget Starter Kit at budgetsmadeeasy.com/start. [00:33:42] And if you loved this episode, we would love it if you would leave us. Five star review and let us know what you loved about this episode. I love reading the reviews and you know, I just love this weekly journey with you. And so I will talk to you next week.