Postcast Christian Jantzen

Intro
Remo Kyburz: [00:00:00] Hello everyone. Welcome to another episode of the leap takers podcast, the podcast for the curious, where I'm interviewing daring European entrepreneurs, investors and shapers from various fields to learn how they got started on the journey and to discover insights, tips, tricks, and advice that they gathered so that you too can take the leap.
I'm very excited to present to you the newest episode. With Christian Jantzen. He is the founder of Futuristic VC. Futuristic is a micro venture capital fund that invests in European Nordic pre-seed companies. So in the very early stages of a company's life and Christian, he actually made his first investment at the age of 14 when he bought shares in his favorite football club.
He will tell us a little bit more about that story later in the podcast. He then started his first company when he was at university in 2011 and then he grew it also while studying at university. Following his master's degree in finance from Aarhus University, he co-founded another startup called REUNITED e-sports, which was a player owned e-sports organization with teams competing in Overwatch and Rocket League.
After that. He started Futuristic VC, which is the main topic of today's podcast. I came across Christian by reading some of his blog posts on Medium, where he writes about his experience as a young and up-and-coming venture capitalists in Europe. He also has some great posts, including his investment memos that he wrote about some companies he invested in.
Then he also had an amazing post about what traits he looks for in founders. Or also one about the state of the European startup ecosystem. If you're interested in starting your own company, you know, while you're studying or after graduation. Or if you're just general interested in the whole world of micro VCs, I'm sure you will find this episode very interesting and valuable. 
As always, before we get started, I'd like to share one of my favorite quotes with you. So here it goes:
"He who jumps into the void owes no explanation to those who stand and watch. "
This is a quote by Jean-Luc Godard , and I really like this one because it credits the people who actually go out and try to do something and change the world.
So having said that, let's get started with today's episode. 
Start Interview
Hi Christian. Welcome to the Leap Takers podcast. I'm very excited to have you on the show and thank you so much for taking the time.
Christian Jantzen: [00:02:39] Of course. No, really a big pleasure to be on the show and I'm very excited for this.
Remo Kyburz: [00:02:43] So, to get started, I would like you to quickly introduce yourself to the audience that might be not that familiar with you. And if you could just tell them briefly, what you've been up to and what you're building or working on right now.
Christian Jantzen: [00:02:57] Yeah. So I'm originally from Denmark, but I now reside in London. So currently I'm building a small VC funds, um, which is mainly focused on the very earliest stages of Nordic investing. So I try to cover, still quite related to me, the five Nordic countries, which is Scandinavia plus Finland Yeah. So, so I think my story is one, and maybe we can get a bit more into this, but my story is really one of, of, uh, also failing on a few startups beforehand. So it's been , I would say, sort of a murky way into VC, but, uh, have been doing this now for roughly three years and then build a portfolio of 23 companies today. So, yeah, sort of very briefly.
Remo Kyburz: [00:03:46] For me, and also for the audience, it's very interesting to learn about, kind of the beginnings and how you became interested in this whole startup and VC space, and I was reading on your website. of your fund that you did your first investments quite young. I think you bought shares in your favorite football club. Could you retell the story of how you got interested into startup or company investing?
Christian Jantzen: [00:04:11] Yes. So,  I'm not sure how well this translates to other countries, but in Denmark, I think most places do you do, uh, these confirmations when you're around 13 or 14 years old. And then in Denmark, it's very customed for, kids  at that age to get a quite significant sums of money. I mean, I think w. But when I guess the average, but I would, I would assume somewhere around 1,000 to 1,500 euros, like most, , young teenagers. I think,  most of that money goes to. , expensive clothes, let's or know, no tech gadgets or, uh, well maybe then like a little bit of two beers. , but in my case, , I've, uh, I've always been quite interested in, , the stock markets and an already back then we had actually a tech company that, that was like very much Internet 1.0.
Uh, and basically there was this portal where you could check stocks. And see how the Danish companies were doing and how it was they were trading happened. I'd always been quite interested in that. Um, and it, it sort of happened to be that roughly around the same time, , that, , I,  got to confirm, I guess you said, um, my favorite football club, was also doing a new emission for shares, so they were raising more money to expand, and become, you know, one of this props of Denmark. And then I thought, Oh, this is perfect. Right? It's like, it, it's a way for me to invest, uh, into something I really care about. , and also it's a way for me to support my club. 
, so I actually took . I would say, well, why am I, my friends were out spending the money  on set, expensive clothes and, uh, mobile phones, whatever you bought at the time.
I took a, actually, most of my, , my confirmation savings invested in this emission and  I think to date I still owe, I believe it's 150 shares  in my club, which I still very loyaly support, uh, albeit today from a distance. But, uh, yeah. So, yeah, it's a, it was a fun story. And, and, and I think since then, it's actually propelled me to , get a more organic interest in the stock markets right. And then, I mean, I remember that when I had saved money, I would casually start investing. And then I got some friends who were also really into this. And so it's, it's always been, I think it's always been a very organic interest for me.
 Remo Kyburz: [00:06:40] which football club was it by the way? Would I know it?
Christian Jantzen: [00:06:45] Ah, ah, well, you know, things football. Uh, so it's, it's a Danish club called FC Mitchell, and they're sort of, uh, uh, they're the, they're the Rangers to Denmark Celtic or the Dortmund to Germany's Bayern. The, . You can contend those for the title, but, but you know, the campus with more money, but, but they have their own ways.
There's a reasonably successful, I would say, in, depending on how deep into support you are.
Remo Kyburz: [00:07:18] Yeah. I don't think I know it, but I also, to be honest, don't follow the Danish League that much, but it's a very interesting story, , after that, like, . How did you kind of step then into the startup space? You mentioned in the intro that you also, you started, , some companies on your own. . Could you retell that story , how this happened?
Christian Jantzen: [00:07:46] Yeah. So, uh, so, so during university I was part of, um, starting ACE of. Classical, old family business, , and went through business school at the time thinking that, you know, the further ahead, uh, I went into this sort of business school. I, I was hoping that I would discover my passion. And I think that as I sort of slowly, I started my master's degree, , I, I think this sort of. Uh, the sense of panic started creeping into me because I realized that it worked. Most of my friends and what most of my appeared to do, a sort of very, very far from where I want it to do. So I always tell people that I was sort of, I was in the classical tracks become evil. Either I management consultant or as an investment banker, but.
Towards the end of my master's degree in the last year, I started sort of lightly panicking and then, uh, and figured out that I'd had a lot of fun starting this company, , and, and really enjoyed working on, on my own. The company gone quite well, so, so I feel like that entrepreneurial drive was always there.
But I think at the time I, and I think a lot of people have this perception that, uh, my idea was that I would go work for. A large corporate for five years and then sort of spin out. And I had enough experience to start a company. Mmm. But I had a really hard time finding a starting point. And, uh, and like I said, that's so light, sense of panic is of threaten and kept growing.
. So I applied to go to Stanford university. Uh, luckily they, they took me in and they have an exchange program that runs over the summers. it's been spent some time in, in, in Palo Alto and, and, uh, I think for the first time realize that, , that's a whole ecosystem around starting companies. And . If you are to start something today and you really want to make it big, technology was probably not the worst place to be.
So, , I think from there, my interest in tech and entrepreneurship just accelerated. yeah, so naturally when I was done with my studies, I, uh, I took the, the, the first big leap and started that sort of classical startup with a friend of mine.
Remo Kyburz: [00:10:01] What was your first company, but what did you do?
Christian Jantzen: [00:10:05] Yeah. So we were doing real estate investing and development.  So this is 2011, like I said, it was a family business. It's rarely something you do with . Mmm. But, uh, we saw in the market back then that, um.
2011 was an interesting time to start a real estate company because you had this asset class that is almost , universally linked to be like the safest and most likely long term, the best place to get long term view, uh, yet because society was so leveraged, sort of post financial crisis, it actually meant that large portfolios were being sold off.
And yeah, I think at the time, everyone was busy paying off that debt, so, so the, the deals you could make in that market were great. and, , yeah, so we, we, we got at the same time, I mean, I think you had this once in a hundred year occurrence where you had,  you know, incredibly low interest rates, , together with, incredibly low prices. I think that's something, I would say, at least in main cities, it's hot for those two things. Not, not to fluctuate.
 so we, we started the company.  I was sort of tasked with running it, uh, for the first couple of years. , which was a good experience.
I wouldn't call it. I mean, I think the difference between that kind of thing, how many and a startup is not to be underestimated, that I think it's quite vast. Um, but, but I think we were incredibly lucky with timing, , and somewhat smarts in, in, in the properties we bought and, and you sort of. Pretty aggressive expansion plan we had, especially in the first couple of years before the markets were, became more saturated. , so yeah, I mean, I stepped off the company operationally couple of years in it. It sort of grew beyond, , what I was capable of managing when the side of my studies. But it was a fun experience.
Remo Kyburz: [00:12:01] Yeah, and it's, I mean, it sounds like you really had a good sense of the opportunity. As you said, it was like a, I guess a rare occurrence of low interest rates and low prices and to then spot an opportunity and then also act on it. I think it seems like a, yeah, not a, not a lot of people. Can execute them both.
So I think that's really interesting. to go one step further. So I saw that one of your, I think now maybe more of the startups or that you found that, I think one was called  reunited e-sports. , so I was interested because I kind of followed e-sports space myself. So, , I don't want to go too deep, but what did you do with this company? And, , are you still, and you know, tracking that space all the way for your own funds?
Christian Jantzen: [00:12:46] so this was a startup. I founded out of the university. Uh, so, so I founded this company with a friend of mine. Um, we, we had this idea to build a novel E-Sports brand. So we actually ran our own team.  And the thesis of our company back then was, that we essentially wanted to pick up these,  rapidly developing titles, and, uh, could take more risk on, on bidding on them earlier than most of the team's would.
Um, so we established a presence in two games. Uh, the main one was sort of Overwatch. Uh, which was really taking off, uh, when you, uh, so this was back in 2016 from this day. And, uh, we knew from, from couple of insiders that at least the publisher, that they're already going to bid heavily on, on this title.
so yeah, we teamed up with,  with a pretty good team, and we Rose up through the ranks. . Around halfway into our company. Repeat, repeat that sort of numb. Well, number one, uh, which was quite fun. We went to all these events. , we went to two months to South Korea. We played big tournaments in the U S and competed for hundreds of thousands of dollars in prize money.
So I think it was a. For someone who, up until then was sort of, I always had like a background as a fan. I mean, I've been a fan for quite a few years and, and uh, this was quite surreal in many ways because all of a sudden you were  you were an active part of this. Uh, it's ecosystem.  and yeah, and we raced, we raised a bit of funding for this from the angels.
So, so also the limited exposure to the, the funding scene,  back then, but unfortunately, after a year. Um, we, we had to shut down, um, for which there are many reasons. I mean, I think we were also quite immature and that we were both newly graduated and then probably made significant mistakes along the way.
But, and at the end of the day, if the publisher wanted different things with their game, so, so. The opportunity that we found when we were starting the company, or ultimately also became a downfall, uh, which is, uh, I think it's the story of our startup.
 Remo Kyburz: [00:15:03] Just out of curiosity, like how did you approach this to actually find a team and then to collaborate with them? . I, I'm, I'm kind of curious because I maybe just to give it bit of a short background. So I followed personally, , Dota two quite a lot, and I would find it very hard to read, you know, kind of spot the great team.
And then, I mean, I never did it, but then to kind of pitch, to collaborate with them. So I'm curious, how did you approach this now for Overwatch?
Christian Jantzen: [00:15:31] Yeah. So, so we were quite lucky, , or rather, I was quite lucky because my co founder is still a very good friend of mine. Uh. He has background in this as a professional player. So he used to play,  older titles, but he still had  really deep connections within the industry. And he knew one of the teams, that had been playing another title and actually now wanted to transition.
Uh, they were at the time playing with a, probably the largest organization in Europe called Fnatic. yeah, we also got a few insights from them that they were not necessarily a, that happy with life at fnatics. So, um, we managed to convince them to jump ship and essentially, , start this company with us from the scratch.
And then I think we all have this idea that. We wanted to build an Overwatch-first brand , that was betting big on Overwatch through to becoming the next big title. Similar to a Dota, town kind of strengthened big names.
Remo Kyburz: [00:16:28] And you were then mainly managing the brand, like building up a brand and giving visibility and managing the team or, yeah. What was your. As a company, what was your value proposition?
Christian Jantzen: [00:16:42] Yeah. So I think like any, any sports team, you, you have a business model that roughly works the same way, right? I mean, I think that that's a, that's an owner slash director of a company like that. Your main goal is to bring in like commission revenue. That's typically from sponsorships. , it can be from price money, it can be from like all the sources, but I think in esports is still predominantly sponsorships.
Uh, starting to see a few TV deals come through, but it's  still quite a young industry there. Um, then of course, you manage, , somewhat the players. , although, , in our case, the players typically have their own, , coach, sort of, they're on the ground with them. And yeah, you're ultimately responsible for building sort of a sports organization from scratch, whether that's hiring content creators, setting the strategy and like with any founder in any company, I think at the beginning you do everything. 
Remo Kyburz: [00:17:36] Okay. Yeah, that definitely makes sense. And, , I think it sounds like a fascinating job through to build up a, a sports or any sports team, , especially because it's relatively new and probably figuring out everything for the first time. So it sounds very exciting. . So to switch gears a little bit.
,I'm really interested now in your fund, so Futuristic VC and I read, or like you're probably one of the youngest VCs in Europe. So how did you make this decision  to start a VC fund and what is the origin story of futuristic?
Christian Jantzen: [00:18:13] . Yeah. So, so when we, when we shut down the company starting 2017 I felt like, as, as esports is certainly adjacent to. Let's call it sort of more standard tech. There is still quite a gap and I think as you just mentioned, that it's a very young industry and,  it seemed to me that's sort of old fire of, of classical sort of software based technology sort of happens completely. That's an itch that needed to be scratched there, I would say. 
But I also knew at the time that I wasn't ready to start another company. , so I think as with most people, their foreay into VC, it's quite random. , and certainly in my case, , that was also the case. 
, what I learned during my time with reunited.  , was really that the funding scene. So we were, we were based out of Copenhagen and Denmark, and then, and, and I think what we saw back then was that the funding scene was incredibly mature

and that most of the investors we had met, uh, where not tech  people, uh, they typically have backgrounds from large corporates or, , I mean, maybe they want from the soap a company, but it was typically not within tech, and they had a very hard time relating to tech. I think that, you know,  I always say that.  I think their, their view, and probably rightly so at the time, was that low. They wouldn't invest in stuff they didn't understand.
Mmm. Which I think for the record is a great investment strategy. Um, but the problem was that I looked at my own ecosystem, Copenhagen, and I thought, well, if Copenhagen is, if what gets funded and comes out of Copenhagen is to be defined by. What non tech people understand. Well then I believe that has a chance to fund the other stuff that if you do have that, that, that tech background or, or if you have that understanding of technology, you could certainly find companies that the market would see the missing or, uh, for whom that sort of breed of investors were not that attractive.
. So I slowly started out, , investing. So I took a bit of the proceeds I had made from my first venture and started investing on an angel levels, small checks into a, into companies. , and, , yeah, I think things accelerated from there. I mean, the, the fund sort of came together as more of a, you know, family, friends, and, people. who also wanted exposure to this asset class. 
 I mean, I was obviously investing a lot of my own capital, so I think they felt like a, this was a, this was a decent bet to be making. and that became really futuristic. . . Yeah, I would say it's probably sort of the, the origin story, which obviously unfolded over six to 12 months .
Remo Kyburz: [00:21:13] so it sounds like  you kind of shifted from doing your own angel investments then that people were like . Getting interested in that and then allocating some of their own capital , to you. , if I understood this right, so. Did you actually like go out to fundraise from LPs or was it more really like, yeah, like you've got families and friends and that together to raise this fund?
Christian Jantzen: [00:21:40] No, I was obviously in a very privileged position, , one because I, I have made some money on my own, , which makes starting out a lot easier. and of course also already had, a network of people and a family. Of course.  we're supportive of this, so I never went out. I think, to be honest, at the time, thinking about racing from external little piece, I call them external, let's call them. Anything that's not the people you  sort of have that working relationship with. , was, completely unrealistic. I mean, I was 25 years old. I had at the time zero track record, , and spent one year out of university. Uh, I think it was hard for a lot of LPs to see why this wouldn't be anything worth investing in.
And I think at the time my strategy was not very set in stone either. I think I had some ideas, , but I think that that really started to fall 12 months into, investing.
So I, I would, I don't think it would've been a very, uh, attractive prospect for other LPs.
Remo Kyburz: [00:22:48] So, yeah, I , fully understand that. And I think it is very hard in the VC space to really built that track record. It's a bit of a chicken egg problem because it takes such a long time to build up a track record because the feedback loops are that long. But then, . At one point, you, you have to start. , also, I guess for the emerging fund managers, it's kind of difficult to show that they have the capabilities, but you have not really anything to show yet for it. ,  it's a bit of a challenge 
Christian Jantzen: [00:23:19] Yeah. I think fundamentally we built VC funds very differently to how we build companies.. look when you're starting a company, right? You're not getting, no one is giving you 80 million to start with, right? I mean,
people are seeding you, they're giving you something to sort of prove out the basics. And I think that mechanism still doesn't really exist in VC.  mainly because, you know, the models haven't really been re-thought. A lot of larger LPs are sort of still quite conservative with this. Um, so the, the people who are sophisticated,  you know, are not doing this because deploying such small amounts of capital sort of rarely attractive. And then I think the fundamental thing is, this is why I think this is sort of, an and industry that's quite barred from a lot of people, right? 
one of the advice I always got from when I was thinking about raising from larger LPs was that , just go raise from your network.
Like, you know, I mean, I go raise from the people you know, and  the people you work with. I always said, well, yeah, I'm in my twenties. Right? That that amount of people is quite limited. So I think that a lot of the advice you get is sort of very well-meaning, but as a young managers, very hard to break.
And, I certainly could not have done it without, coming from the position I did. Mmm. Which is a shame.
Remo Kyburz: [00:24:46] Thanks for sharing that. . as a next step, can you briefly tell the audience, , about futuristic VC? Just that they get an idea about  the fund, where you invest in and what type of companies you're looking for?
Christian Jantzen: [00:25:01] Yeah, yeah. So today, futuristic, it's a $4 million fund. , we.  I say we, that's a me. I invest mostly in, , the Nordics. So like I said, Danish. Bye. Uh. By nationality. And, uh, I think going back to the previous story, I quickly realized that this problem of, lack of, solid understanding within the angel community was not a Danish problem.
It was more of a Noridc problem at the same time, I think as a limited amount of companies coming out of these quite small cities and ecosystems. So for me to really feel like. I was getting the exposure in a strong enough portfolio. Uh, I needed to invest outside of just, uh, Copenhagen in Denmark. Um, so yeah, like I said, an intro, I've been building this fund over the last three years, roughly,  with a portfolio of 23 companies.
My focus has at least historically been pre-seed. , which means I. Uh, gone as early as possible. , I've always felt like, , if I wanted to learn properly, I had to try to almost play in an asset class where it could be dominant, , and not just get invited into occasional deals through Goodwill. And so it's been tough.
I mean, that's certainly made my mistakes, but, , I think that's. You also get a lot more of a credit when you're not investing alongside big established names, but rather going out to, to source these companies from the moment they are founded . And then, um, which has been an incredibly rewarding journey, 
Yeah. . And I always felt like that was where. There was really a gap. Uh, you know, I think like, like any solid investor who will always tell you that there's a gap for exactly what they do. Uh, but, but I actually think that that was what that was, what the region needed at the time. Uh, because it wasn't that there was a lack of wealthy people willing to invest their own money into companies. It was that there was a lack of. People doing that while also simultaneously understanding the ecosystem, helping found those, creating value for them by no getting them in front of follow on investors and then all these types of things. Right. So you had a lot of people were, I think at the end, at the time, right?
As it is today, money was becoming commoditized. So, so building that position, , by being willing to work harder and, run faster than, most of the people, uh. That's great. And I think that's the good thing when you're competing against, uh, competing is sort of  in "citations".  , but, , when you're up against the angel investors, you know, it's typically a breed of people that at least for a large part of them are semi-retired, which meant that, uh, with my age and my willingness to run and fly and do all the things that they didn't want to do with it, that built me something.
Remo Kyburz: [00:28:05] And how would you find the companies? Was it really that because there was this gap that. They actually approached you already or,  how did you build up your deal flow? I think this is really, I imagine one of the key challenges as a new fund to build up the deal flow and also that you then get into the rounds with, with the value adds that you can bring.
. So what, what are your thoughts on that and how did you tackle these problems?
Christian Jantzen: [00:28:32] Yes. I think when you look at pre-seed  like as a, as a sort of stage of investing, , where you really build your deal flow is through networks. , I think that there are some new attempts to try to sort of Moneyball it. Uh, but it's, it's, it's incredibly hard. Yeah. Yeah. So, to me it was a lot of, it was a lot of meetings.
It was a lot of traveling. Mmm. And just talking to people, I think that you're trying to not only convince the founders that you'd be great for them in a specific deal. You're also trying to convince other investors that, you know, inviting you into a deal. Makes sense. and frankly, I think that I did a lot of the things that all the others didn't want to do. Right. So I made the trips to London, to Berlin to really connect with the follow on scene for funding, which goes all of a sudden built me huge leverage with other more sort of grounded angels that then, you know, I think for them, they realize that, you know.
Having me involved was a good idea because all of a sudden you had, you had this person running around in these bigger ecosystems and really, you know, promoting the companies , and then helping them also raise from, from different sources. Right. I think a lot of the angels were also tired of, of their companies only having the opportunity to raise with the two or three local VCs that were in the backyard.
And then I think, yeah, for the founders, right? I think that there's this, there's always like multiple components of, how do you convince founders to take you on? Right? And I think that that's like two things, right? This is soft components and the hard components, right? So I think the soft components are very, very hard to sort of,  put on a bottle.
 I think that this has a lot to do with chemistry. And empathy and like how well do you connect with, with founders? Like can they see you as a, someone that can come to for advice? Do they also believe that you have at least some view of the world that can be valuable to them?
And then I think you have sort of like the hotter essence, which is like.
in my case was. I always say that like, if I couldn't win deals purely on the soft skills, I would always say, you know, pull up my Excel sheet with a, the 50 funds in my network. That usually does the trick. So, yeah, I think that's, that's, that's really how anyone wins any deals when you don't have to Sequoia style brand.
Remo Kyburz: [00:31:03] Yeah, yeah, for sure. And I think it's, yeah, it's getting more and more important to have these value adds as a fund or to build a relationship with the founders as a, as a GP to,  , get into these deals and to also help  the startup. .
Christian Jantzen: [00:31:18] But I think we're really in a market of, if I made add, I think we've been in a market today where everyone is obsessing about, , there are sort of like hard value-adds. Mmm. But  I think that the softer parts of things are just very hard to compensate for with hardcore value adds.
Right? I mean, I think that if you look at firms like benchmark or these others that don't have, you know, a full set up like, like so many other funds. Ultimately the reason why people pick them is because they are damn good board members, uh, and, and you know, these sounds like classic, virtuous, but at the end of the day  if you're a sensible founder, that's what you pick the first, right? You pick great advice.  You pick people that have seen it before. And that stuff is a mode that's incredibly hot to penetrate by. Yeah. So I think that that's a lot of people that are obsessing about, , the hardware and , like the stuff that can build into that value add, quote unquote, when they should be obsessing about how do they hire smarter partners.
Remo Kyburz: [00:32:24] Yup. Yeah. . Thanks for adding that. I think that's a very good point. And . Looking at the time, I think I would love to dig deeper into futuristic. , but . Maybe let's switch to now, given that you, , tell us about, yeah. Your, your, your own companies that you built and also about futuristic. 
What are your learnings? Let's say that you look back and , you say to yourself, okay, I would have done that different if I knew X, for example. So is there anything that comes to mind?  
Christian Jantzen: [00:32:55] Yeah. , I think if you look at it from an investment point of view, I think that my advice to all new investors is to not pull the trigger early. And I think that my own mistakes, and this is where starting on your own certainly costs something because you don't have a partner to sort of tell you, "Hey, maybe, maybe don't do this investment."
But I think the way VCs work at the end of the day, it's really, how computers use the sorting algorithms, right? And then like, , within sort of computer science, it's a very simple solving algorithm like the insertion solve. Right? And I think that's really how startups work as well when you're a VC, right?
That you sort of be like. You constantly rank things against each other, but for you it's really get across, but for like really good founders look like you have to see in a lot of fields, right ? And actually the problem is that you might even come across some really good company early on, but because that's sort of like algorithm is not fully functional yet. Right. I mean, you can, you can tell that it's a better company then the other 10 companies, but you can't tell whether it's an order of magnitude better. Right. So I think that for all new investors, that's very, it's very common to invest in  five or 10 companies out of the first 100 you meet, where the real way you should probably do with this to meet a hundred companies and filter the best one. And that's the only one you invest in. And I mean,  for me, I certainly made the same mistake, right? And I look back at those investments now and now that my sort of  "sorting"  it's a lot more tight.  I can certainly see , what were the stakes in making those, those decisions. Yeah. I think that was my, I mean, but that's like, that's a hard lesson learned, right?
Because that's typically a lesson that costs money, right? Mmm. Of course. A lot of softer lessons, and a lot of other things, , but at the end of the day,  the less money you can lose in the beginning  you'll do well.
Remo Kyburz: [00:34:59] Thinking about also your learning from starting your own companies, is there something that you would also tell the companies you invest in as an advice? , Or just as something that you took away from your experience as a founder?
Christian Jantzen: [00:35:18] Yeah. I think pick your cofounders wisely. I mean, I was lucky too, to have a really good co-founder who,  I actually managed to sustain a really good relationship with. , but, but, , I, I see a lot of the opposite. Uh. Where that at costing the company? . I think a lot of startups today obsess over the wrong things. , I think that a lot of patience goes into building a company. I think that company building in the early stages is really about patience and focus. Focusing on the things that matter. And I think that. There is this, uh, and this is also this also, by the way, it comes back to investors giving poor advice.
Uh, but I do think that, , a lot of founders have this tendency to focus on sort of classical business metrics. . Because when you look at a public company, revenue matters, right? And yeah, I'm not saying revenue doesn't matter, but, but is that really the thing you should be focusing on in your first year?
Right. I think that there is a tendency for. For people to focus on growth, , because investors are telling them, you know, you need to hit X revenue number four for, uh, for this to be sustainable. But I will say that the best founders that we've worked with and the best founders I've seen, they are completely obsessive over product market fit.
And they managed to sort of think incredibly long term. In a world that's almost screaming at them all the time to be short term focus. And I think that managing to have that long term view while also being able to fundraise and still sell people on your mission is crucial.
It's very easy to get drawn into the short term, trying to monetize everything, which can come back to bite you.
Remo Kyburz: [00:37:10] Yup. I think that's a very valuable advice. The product market fit and the cofounder and  the team, it's so crucial also from my experience and I . cannot  state that high enough so. , . Let's, before we wrap up, , as, as a last one or two questions, more rapid fire style, I like to ask my guests, , about their best investment.
And this can also, I guess in your case, it can be an investment in a company, but it could also be an investment of your time or energy, , into something. So is there anything that comes to mind as a best investment?
Christian Jantzen: [00:37:47] Oh, that's, that's a very tough one to define. Cool. Mmm. My best investments I would say  , is starting my fund. Mmm. I think this has been not just a game changer for me professionally, but also for my identity. I think that, , I used to have this idea that this was just a thing I was doing in between companies.  But I actually discovered that, that this is probably the journey or this prompted the path that I'm going to be on for the rest of my career.
Um, well, at least for the foreseeable future.  when I started out at it, certainly steamed, , very risky. , I was working alone. That did not seem very compelling. And there was obviously this fear that what if I lose all my money?
Um, but I must say that this has been a tremendous journey so far and, incredibly happy that I made that decision.
Remo Kyburz: [00:38:52] it sounds like  an exciting journey. Definitely. And, , thank you so much for, for sharing, ,  follow stats here on the podcast. And, , before we wrap up, I always ask my guests as the last question,  in relation to the name of the podcast, the Leap Takers - podcast. What does courage mean to you?
Christian Jantzen: [00:39:10] Um, I think courage to me is the ability to trust your own ways. , especially in light of  all the people doubting you. I think that humans are programed to seek social acceptance for everything they do in life. But,  that's also why most people are not happy with their careers and relationships and whatnot. And I think that it requires incredible courage to go against sort of your evolutionary , desires and , I really respect the people who do it and always try to, to err on that side , when making my own sort of decisions.
Remo Kyburz: [00:39:56] Great. Thank you very much for, for that last part of advice and thank you so much, Christian, for coming on the podcast. I really appreciate your time. And , , to close things off. Where can people find more about you or futuristic if they want to  check you out online?
Christian Jantzen: [00:40:14] Yeah, I  write occasionally on my medium as well, so, uh, if you want to see more thoughts, I think that's probably the places I would go. And most of my futuristic stuff is on their as well, .
Remo Kyburz: [00:40:25] Okay, cool. I'll make sure to link to everything and also all the stuff you mentioned before in the show notes of the podcast so the listeners, you can find everything there as well.
Great. Then. Thank you so much, Christian, for taking the time and sharing your insights with us today.
Christian Jantzen: [00:40:42] Likewise. This was super enjoyable.