Sean Sullivan (18s):
Welcome to Converge Coffee with Sean Sullivan. I am here with Alex Perry. She is the CEO of Practically Speaking LLC author of the Minivan mogul, a crash course and confidence for women and a host of the mini Mogul mini van Mogul podcast. So it was a tongue twister there, her passion for all things Speaking comes from spending nearly two decades as a speech language pathologist, helping people regain the ability to speak after illness or injury. Alex is a motivational Ted ex speaker, facilitator, and mentor. She helps others speak and share their stories with confidence in using strategies. She's learned the hard way through her career. She is a nationally certified speech pathologist, speech language pathologist, as a background in adult neurology and emotional intelligence.

Sean Sullivan (1m 7s):
And it was an E Q a dash I 2.0 certified administrator. Most, most importantly, or more importantly, she Alex blends her scientific approach. Speaking with her love of storytelling, laughter and humor. And to her work with individual clients and corporate teams, most importantly, she's a mom Minivan driver and front row fan for her speakers. Alex thanks for being on the show. Thanks for having me. I mean, we had such a fun time in the green room talking about everything in life, thinking all of it. Yeah some really good stuff here. And I think it's going to be it's it's going to help, especially with, with this episode.

Sean Sullivan (1m 50s):
And I put in, you know, the EEQ dash, just because, you know, SEO purposes of transcription these days, like it's so important, but this is about, you know, your transcriptions.

Alex Perry (2m 2s):
I got a laugh at that bio because I'm like, Oh, the road, all that ridiculousness. So many big words, stop.

Sean Sullivan (2m 12s):
It is good. It was, it was, it was telling your story. It was telling you to hear. And so I think a lot of listeners want to know, and I, and I, and if you haven't signed up for a Practically Speaking newsletter, I would say do it now, right after this episode. But, you know, can you tell the listeners more about, you know, Practically Speaking

Alex Perry (2m 33s):
Sure. So practically speaking was born out of a love and an understanding for just how challenging it can be for people to speak up. Whether that's in front of one person, whether that's in front of a thousand people, I help people say what they need and want to say. And this is at the core of who I am and how I operate. And because I spent 17 years as a speech language pathologist, helping people who either by accident by illness, injury, even by birth, they lost their ability to speak. So imagine what it would be like right now.

Alex Perry (3m 15s):
Sean if you agree, you are talking today, we don't have any, we don't actually have any technical trouble talking to each other, but you wake up tomorrow and you've had a stroke and you didn't get a chance to say everything that you needed and wanted to say. And I went into work everyday and watched people crippled from that and helping them get regained that ability and watching their appreciation for even being able to say the simplest things like mom, I love you. I am asking for our basic needs and wants. And so when I created Practically speaking, that was my heart of it is to look at professionals and go, Oh my gosh, I need to make this simple for you because you already know everything that you need and want to say, you actually already know how to do it, but the world has somehow gotten into your head and all of the rules and regulations of how to be a great speaker has gotten into your head and have paralyzed you.

Alex Perry (4m 11s):
And I don't want you to go through life, not having said what it is that you need and want it to say. So that's the heart of it.

Sean Sullivan (4m 22s):
I love that. And you've touched on a point. I've actually talked to a few speakers about that, that people already know. It's kind of like the Walt Disney thing where children already know, and they already say things and then were accustomed to these rules of societal things that inhibit us. They really do that. Yeah.

Alex Perry (4m 43s):
Yes. I point to, there's usually a moment in someone's life where they have had this moment. If someone has told them how to do it, here's the exact right way. It probably happened in second grade for some teachers, did you have in front of a group and said, here's like, here's the rubric. And you got to do all these things in the right way. And I say, Right with air quotes because there actually is not a set of rules that says, this is the right way to speak many, many great speakers have particular quirks or things that they do. But we want to assign this very programmatic, like let's machine. Here's what a perfect speaker looks like instead of focusing on is the person saying what they need and want to say, do the audience understand what was it persuasive, whatever the goal of it was.

Alex Perry (5m 32s):
But by gosh, these poor kids are stood up there. And they were like, if they, if they wiggled there at the end, it was like, stop wiggling your hands. And like, if you're watching, like you can't see me now, but that all I do is move my hands. So I think we do a disservice by looking at a speaker and, you know, looking at like a tiny little second grade speaker and saying, here is the right way to do it. And then making them paralyzed with fear. And maybe that occurs later on, maybe you've had bad presentation at work or you've had a conversation go sideways, or somebody has, somebody has pointed out something to you. That is really just their opinion that actually isn't impeding your ability to be a great speaker.

Sean Sullivan (6m 10s):
Agreed. And the same thing with, ah, comedy, you noticed comedians have certain corks or a certain nervous tics. But the other thing that I've noticed as especially like with, with Jerry Seinfeld, when he did his comedians in cars, getting coffee, he says that comedians just have that natural rapport with one another because they get it. Yeah. And I think that speakers do the same thing. They just get it on your podcast. There's anybody who's doing anything, tinny type of communication that they get it. And that's the kind of the thing is I can see why, you know, that people have that rubric because they're basically breaking you down, but they're not breaking you down in the right way, in a sense of breaking it down the foundation of who you are. And how do you want to present yourself that breaking you down into the sense of like, what you said is kind of, it's almost robotic.

Sean Sullivan (6m 55s):
It's almost like this is a checklist of what to do rather than be who you are and how people are going to resonate with that.

Alex Perry (7m 2s):
Right. Right. And in learning and teaching early on that maybe you are not for everyone. And that's an, that's an okay thing. We are not robots. We are not designed to try to master Perfection. And I think so much of what happens in the realm of public speaking and why it has become such a fear for so many people is because when these standard is Perfection and you are not allowed to make a mistake, that's crippling that scribbling. Instead of teaching people, most, most people don't have to go and be a politician where like that that's a whole different level of Speaking.

Alex Perry (7m 43s):
Most people are trying to, they're trying to get up in front of their executive leadership team. They're going to have a conversation with their boss, or they're trying to give a presentation for their business and not have it be a, a disaster. But that fear of Perfection is crippling. So we actually take away in many instances, what would help us speak or do what they needed to do now, normally, and naturally. And then we, we place the expectations that are just unreasonable. Let me give you an example. It's that don't use notes. So, you know, professional speakers don't use notes. What the heck said, has anyone ever watched Oprah?

Alex Perry (8m 24s):
Have you ever watched it? This is why presidents use teleprompters to take away something that might help a speaker get through and deliver their information in a way that the audience can understand why on earth would you like taking the crutches away from somebody that's got a broken foot? You're not a machine. You're not supposed to remember everything. If you need a couple of notes, use your notes. My God don't be shy. I mean, don't read to me, but I just think the way these arbitrary right here,

Sean Sullivan (8m 53s):
What do you have to start somewhere? Like if you were kind looking at the notes, more of a practice, that's kind of the biggest thing is just, just practice. So my next question off of that is, you know how to do practically speaking, you know, how did that lead you to writing the Minivan Mogul

Alex Perry (9m 9s):
Oh gosh. Yes. So a couple of things to note for people, I tell people all this time, number one, I'd never planned on having a company or owning my own business. This was never on the agenda. So I looked at all of these things in there. Like, did you have a master plan? Not a chance how Minivan Mogul came to pass it. It was, I am, I've opened a Practically speaking, I'm working on Practically speaking and watching what speakers do. I'm trying to create this expert industry, this niche for myself, and then working with my business coach, who is a master and a genius. And she said, Alex, you are a good writer. You know, I have you ever considered writing?

Alex Perry (9m 49s):
And I'm like, yeah, I blog. I do all those things, but she's like, I think you need to write a book. And I'm like, okay. So I took that as let's write a leadership presence book, because one of the, one of the courses that I teach is leadership presence of how do you show up in the world? And really what it is is, is, is of course, it's showing up a few as yourself, but, and how do you do that and feel good about it. But I, I started writing what was the most God awful version of a leadership book that could have ever been written? Its so bad. The leadership presence myth is what it's called. It lives in the files of my computer in a sad, dark, lonely place because it's bad. It's the worst leadership book.

Alex Perry (10m 30s):
And my business coach, mentor friend, she sat through so many iterations of this and she would just shake your head and she be like, no, to get to know what are you doing? And you know, we would have these conversations. We would have these conversations. Oftentimes in, in, in my man I would be on the phone as what, back in the day, when we could drive around and do things. And I would always joke, I'd be like, you know, conference call from the Minivan and thoughts from the Minivan. And she finally said, one day to me, she said, Alex, what if the minivan is the key to your success?

Alex Perry (11m 11s):
And I sort of get all of them, like nobody is going to take a Minivan driving mom. Seriously. I used to try to hide my Minivan from people because I, I, I live in Hamilton County. This is the bubble. I feel like if you don't drive a Beamer, like who are you? So he said he used to hide it. And I thought, nobody nobody's gonna want to hear these stories. But you know, she would just have a nudge me along the way in. So I started playing with it and I started playing with blogs that I wrote. And I started thinking about like, what are the road rules that I want to create for myself? So the book in and of itself is a series of five road rules for confidence in their rules. And I see that very loosely 'cause, here's what I know.

Alex Perry (11m 51s):
You read self-help books and you know, you take what is important to you and then you use it in note, you can't formulate or fix anybody. So that's not what the book set out to do. But ultimately in this process of trying to ride a really bad leadership book, many of you and Mogul emerged in and said here here's who you really are. And let's help people be who they really are, especially women, because we do do weird things, like try to hide our minivans. We tried to, you know, eyelash ourselves into Perfection and we try to find our worth and value in anything other than ourselves. And so I created this series of like, here's here are the guides that I use everyday for myself. And here are some hilarious stories and you're going to take this book and use it as you want.

Alex Perry (12m 34s):
It's short, it's simple. It's really easy to read. I designed it from moms who are staying in the line at target and only have five minutes to read and it fits right into a handbag. And it's just, it's this weird quirky book. It's the actual representation of me, the form book. So that's how I was born. That's how my baby was born.

Sean Sullivan (12m 58s):
That is freaking awesome. I, you, you nailed on an audience. You just, you just basically articulate. I could envision that book being in a mom or anybody is like hand, literally going to a coffee shop. I was literally picturing target target right now. I don't know why, but that's the kind of a thing is meant for, you know, all of the moms or everybody out there or anybody that wants to read that because they're connecting with you and your work and you and your humor and everything else. That's how I connected with 'em, you know, a few authors that I absolutely, you know, love because you can, you can connect with them through the book. You don't have to actually talk to them is the beauty of it.

Alex Perry (13m 40s):
Well, and what's fun about it is that it obviously it's niched, right? So it says for women and it lends itself towards moms and people are like, why can't I read it? I'm not a mom. Like, that's not true. I've had loads of men read it and say, Alex why like, why did you not right this for everybody? And I'm like, because you can't because that's the way marketing rules of work. But the rules are universal. The stories are actually pretty darn universal. It's the struggle to feel good in your own skin. It's the ridiculous things that we do in an attempt to somehow earn the approval of somebody else that actually doesn't matter in our lives. And it's the search for, and the realization that true confidence only comes from within it.

Alex Perry (14m 24s):
Doesn't come from other people. You're never going to find it from anybody else. And so this is just my way of telling you that in hilarious and awkward stories and you know, some, some sorts of moments that will tug at your heart and make you make you feel mushy or whatever. But yeah, it's really designed, you know, like car rider line, you know what it's designed, it's designed

Sean Sullivan (14m 50s):
For an extra long Starbucks CarPlay drive through lanes. Yes.

Alex Perry (14m 54s):
I think, I mean, you could probably read half of it in the Starbucks line these days. Geez. Like everybody has their mobile orders is going through the drive-through stuff and let me know.

Sean Sullivan (15m 5s):
Or the card side pick up, like I just read someone from yesterday. It was like 55 minutes. She did some of them already S got there and then I'm like, so she is like, I'm here to just run into the store and bought out by now.

Alex Perry (15m 17s):
What is going on in Starbucks? That's a whole different conversation. I love, I love some Starbucks and it's B could read my book, waiting for your mobile order is what we're saying.

Sean Sullivan (15m 28s):
You just answered how the book has helped cultivated confidence communication, which has been awesome. And so I'm going to kinda go right into the third question that we have, and this is going to be the last question. So you can go freely about it and we could talk about next, you know, the date of language of his typo, but you know, how do you cultivate a great customer experience by being a front row fan? You've mentioned several things and you've kind of hinted on it throughout, you know, practically speaking and as many van Mogul the book and everything that you've done, but is there any like examples that you want to give a shit about that?

Alex Perry (16m 6s):
Sure. So if I have a gift, it's the gift of sitting with someone where they are and allowing them to be who they are and drawing out their story in a way that honors them and makes them feel like the star of the show. So at great example of this, I do a boatload of speaker coaching. I think that's how you and I met was through disrupt HR. So I sit on the board on the speaker, liaise on there and also participate in the badass women's council, the rise and thrive experience. And I am the speaker coach for all of the women that get up and share their stories. And so when I say I'm a front row fan, I literally number one, I do sit in the front row when I am at an event.

Alex Perry (16m 52s):
And then my speakers are on a stage. And if I can't be there physically, then I make every attempt to be there virtually as well in the, in this sort of context. But I provide both the insight into the story and the drawing out what that says that I'm a fan, which means that I take the time. So we think about how a fan operates a fan knows like all of the things about the person that they're jamming on. So whoever your favorite person is like, I'm a huge Oprah fan. So I knew lots of stuff about Ober or I know lots of stuff about princess di I'm the same way from my speakers. My goal is to know as much about you as possible. So I can bring out the best in you when you go to say whatever it is that you need and want to say.

Alex Perry (17m 35s):
And, and that holds true even in the professional realm. So for the folks that aren't necessarily doing big stage Speaking, but they're just going into a presentation, their going into a boardroom. I want to know everything about you and champion you and your message and the points that you're trying to get across. And I'm going to take the time to become your super fan it, right? It's not about me as the coach, as the guide, it is all about you and whatever I can do to make you shine on whatever platform that you are on. Yeah.

Sean Sullivan (18m 10s):
I like that. And I'm just kind of thinking of, are you an Enneagram three, if you want to guess, what am I am? I have to think here

Alex Perry (18m 23s):
Are they speak street Enneagram. So chip 90 taught me to look at any a Grande pick. The one that made me cringe the most. And that's the one I am so interesting.

Sean Sullivan (18m 32s):
Ooh, let me see. Let me see. Are you a seven? Yeah. Oh, I am. What makes you cringe the most? Oh man. By nature. If it's like the last number out of this, I'm not going to guess. I probably going to get to the last number for now. I'm going to okay. And then I just went over my head there. Yeah. Okay. That makes sense. Because achiever and helper are pretty close, but achiever likes to cheat for themselves to be in that sense, but a helper, they help, you know, they help people. So we have a commonality.

Sean Sullivan (19m 12s):
I'm not a two when I'm at an eight, but I am when I'm healthy, I'm a helper. There you go. See it.

Alex Perry (19m 20s):
But yeah, I always like to know what I'm healthy because we are not always healthy. Thank you for being honest and real.

Sean Sullivan (19m 26s):
Yes, exactly. And this is why I was doing this podcast because I'm healthy now. So going off of no more Gerling questions were gonna go, were going to go in and talk about it. Cause you mentioned this, my native language is typo and I don't know if you want it. Do you want to let the speakers or not? The speaker is the listeners know and they're probably speakers out there listening to w what is, what is the native language for a typo?

Alex Perry (19m 54s):
So my native language is typo. That is the lead line on my LinkedIn profile. I lead many, many, many of my presentations with that. And what I mean by that. So is that I am a speaker. I am an expert in Speaking years and years, and years and years, I can tell you stuff about Speaking that it would blow your mind, write from the neurology of it, to how you formulate sounds. I know Speaking inside and out and I still get it wrong. And I think it's really important. It's one of the cornerstones of my business is for people to know that I am as just as human as you are. So I am not a machine when I talk.

Alex Perry (20m 36s):
I know I have all sorts of weird, funny quirks. I, when I write, I have all sorts of typos in I. What I have found is that that is a very comforting thing for audiences. It's a very comforting thing for the speaker's that work with me. Because again, when you think about classic communication and classic Speaking coaching, there is this demand for a Perfection. And I know if you are looking for Perfection, I'm not the coach for you. And so I need you to know right up front that I'm going to mess up and that that's okay. And that if your going to mess up and that's okay.

Alex Perry (21m 16s):
And in fact, most of the process of speaking and communicating isn't about necessarily the Delivering of the greatest message, its about how do you recover when you get it wrong? Because you will, you will, if you speak enough, if you communicate enough, you're going to get it wrong. And it's the recovery that matters more than the best speech that I've ever given on a stage. My best moments have been the ones that were, I have had something really bad happen and I've had to recover. Those are the most impactful. So I like people to know right off the bat that my native language is type of. You're going to see it. And if that has not for you than we are not four each other 'cause I don't think that I just live in a world that this is, this is reality that we are imperfect and that's a that's that's all right.

Alex Perry (22m 8s):
That's good. We're supposed to be, yeah.

Sean Sullivan (22m 11s):
It's a different level of practice in the sense that you can practice to a point and get a speech. Right. And it just sounds, it, it doesn't resonate as humdrum is or whatever. And then you go to, you see people who give speeches, even stand up comedians. I mean, the way that they have done their stuff is is that even you, you, I mean, even on Netflix, that we've, since we're, you know, 20, 20, COVID either watching Netflix in everything to that, you see, you know, slipups or as an audience member distracts them in a sense that they engage with them and it makes them laugh too. But they recover quickly because they know, you know, it's kind of like working out or something like that where you know how your body is going to react to it.

Sean Sullivan (22m 55s):
And your you're not on garde, but you're aware of, yeah, this could happen various Stuart in the sense of a lot of people don't teach that.

Alex Perry (23m 4s):
Yeah. Right. Because again, we want Perfection we want Instagram. Perfect. We were told that that's the, that's the level in. And if we don't hit that bar that we are somehow less than, and I don't think that that's true for the people that I think that are the most inspiring are the ones that have said that to not only have I not gotten it right, I've gotten it wrong in a thousand different ways. And I'm here to, I'm here to teach you about that. So maybe when it happens to you, it's not as traumatic. I think about how many speakers I have worked with that have had a traumatic speaking experience that has crippled them for years and stopped them from doing the work and saying the, that they needed and wanting to say, think about the impact on a business or on a life win-win we let a moment of failure dictate how we show up in the world for years to come.

Alex Perry (23m 59s):
That's a loss for our communities. That's a loss for our businesses. That's a loss for us personally. I just can't let that happen because it just breaks my heart. How many speakers I've I've I have seen and talk to who can point to a specific moment, either in a conversation, on a stage, in a boardroom that we're, they messed up and they were shamed and they, they felt like they could never recover. And I'm like, Oh my gosh, no one never died over a bad PowerPoint. They just did not actually work with people who would die. Right? Like they were like, I worked in healthcare. My patients would die.

Alex Perry (24m 39s):
No one has died from a bad PowerPoint presentation. You thought that it felt like it. But you know what I mean?

Sean Sullivan (24m 46s):
There is a negativity that is already consumed us beforehand and kind of eliminating that, get it, get it right.

Alex Perry (24m 54s):
I'm not, I'm just not going to let that happen to people. I'm going to try to get to as many folks as I can and say, whatever you've been taught before or whatever is in your head, whatever trash that's rolling around in there, just simply isn't true. And you have something to say, so lets get you out there seeing it, even if it's wonky, even if it's imperfect, even if you have a typo you can live through that. Did that is how we should not be living or dying over whether or not you misspelled restaurant. I still can't spell restaurant. Sean thank God for spellcheck.

Sean Sullivan (25m 32s):
There is some words that I actually have to like stop and like actually have to articulate and say, no, I get it. I, I get it all day long. So enough about typos, your health and the other people. This was part of the Episode about you. I mean, we could talk about Oprah. We could talk about other things too. And it's more so, you know, you kind of hinted on throughout the whole episode of why do you do what you do? Why do you do what you for work? But if you want to kind of be more specific and this is what, this is why,

Alex Perry (26m 6s):
So this is why I do this. Yeah. I mean

Sean Sullivan (26m 12s):
You wake up in the morning and you're like, the first thing that you think of is like,

Alex Perry (26m 18s):
How can I, yeah. So I always say, if I could have been anything, I would've been on Broadway. I would've been a performer. I would've been, it would've been that. I didn't realize when I went into speech pathology that the world of learning and talent development and that this was a thing I have watched a motivational speakers, my whole life and pictured myself doing this. I have pictured on stages. I have pictured what shoes I would, where a picture of how I would move and how I would talk. And so the, the why in all of this, the why I have to talk about typos, the why I have to encourage people to be confident is that these are the things I most had to learn myself.

Alex Perry (27m 3s):
So the adage that people say, people teach what they most need to learn. This is what I most needed to learn was that I had a voice and that I was powerful and that what I said mattered, and it mattered enough to change the lives. And so that's a main, you want that real dirty Like in the crux of it is that I know it, it feels like to not be seen. I know what it feels like to not be hurt. I know that it feels like too desperately wanting to be on that stage and taking up space and taking up air and getting people on their feet. I know what that feels like. And I w so I do it and I teach it and I learn it.

Alex Perry (27m 43s):
And I fall down all the time and I didn't have anybody to grab me and pull me up. Like when I failed in the beginning of this, I've given some epicly bad presentations at Ted and some terrible speeches. I have messed up in every way possible. And there wasn't anyone there to pick me up other than me. So I don't ever want anyone to go through that feeling like, no, I want you to have that person to call, to say, I fell flat on my face. Alex like, who wants to do this alone? I don't want to do this alone. Do you want to do it alone? Nobody wants to do it on. Yeah,

Sean Sullivan (28m 16s):
No, it's human nature. It's all about connection. It's all about connection. It's not about robotics. Its not about algorithms. It's about human to human connection about how can we help one another it's about community. So the next part of the episode is what do you do as a hobby, you know, to kind of recharge.

Alex Perry (28m 38s):
So you know, this is your listeners don't know this, but I am definitely an exercise junky. So I'm a, CrossFitter, I'm a runner. I've been a little bit laid up during COVID. I suffered a back injury for the first time. I've never had an injury, but this was my year to have the injury. So it's been a little late up, but I am, I'm a marathon runner, a half marathon runner a CrossFitter those are the things that bring me life. I love to pick a very heavy things up and throw them down and make like wild animal noises is that feels really powerful. That brings me a lot of joy. I am an avid reader we'd love to read and look at and all sorts of things. Everything from, you know, I've got like Michelle Obama is a, you know, becoming all the way to my friend kit.

Alex Perry (29m 24s):
He wrote a book called I'd rather talk to dead people. I'm going to like, I, I love to read. And in my family, a I am a mom and wife and that, those things at the end of the day, I'm still cooking dinner in making sure like my husband has dinner at six o'clock. I love like the whole Like let's pretend your a 60,000 wife and had this cocktail ready. Like I still want me to do that. So I think that's fun.

Sean Sullivan (29m 53s):
That is the awesome. And I, and I love your perspective on it, on everything, you know, Alex thanks for being on the show. Like I could see you being in Broadway. Like I could see that,

Alex Perry (30m 4s):
Oh, I know, right? Like why did I not have that?

Sean Sullivan (30m 9s):
Well, Broadway, he got hit hard. So we're just going to say, let's say you have your own Broadway. You have your own stage. You have Practically Speaking you have your podcast with your dog. I remember that. Like just it's awesome. And I love that you're a champion for other people. And I did notice that at disrupt HR where you would lift our table and you would go and you would be right in front of it, right in front of the stage each time you, or whoever you coached, you would be right there and taking pictures or like, and so I think that's just letting the listeners know what kind of, you know, what kind of person you, that you can be. And also, you know, if you were going to fail fast or fail, do it yourself, see how it goes, ask for help.

Sean Sullivan (30m 55s):
You know, you have a business coach, you know, figure out things, right. A bad book and putting it in the darkest corners of your computer. But Alex, I really appreciate you being on the show. And I learned a lot from, just from your dedication with, with even just being, being Practically speaking. So thank you so much, Alex. It's a pleasure. Thank you so much. And to all of the Converge Coffee drinkers out there, that's a wrap.