[Show Intro]
Jala
Hey, thanks for coming! I'm glad you're here. Come on in! 
Everyone's out on the patio right now. Looks like a couple of people are in the garden. I can't wait to introduce you! Can I get you anything? [turned away] Hey folks, our new guest is here!

[Intro music]

00:00.43
Jala
Hello world and welcome to Jollla John's place I'm your host joll apprene she her and today I am joined by Juliet (she/her) and Rachel (any/all) ya this is exciting because this is your first time on the show. Rachel.

00:12.38
Rachel _any_all_
Wow Hello It sure is I'm stoked to be here talking about a movie that I forced people I love to watch with me.

00:25.39
Jala
Absolutely I did the same thing we we definitely did a watch party in my Discord server and I had you know mentioned to various people I am so excited to say that we are talking about the Barbie movie today. Um I was also very excited to say that my theater. Had 1 of the Barbie boxes. So I got to take pictures in the Barbie box and of course I had actually just gotten back from a fitness expo that I had gone to so I was flexing muscle pose I am muscle Barbie so I'll have to be.

00:57.43
Rachel _any_all_
Heck yeah, heck yeah, we had a ah we had a barbie box at my screening too. But I got in the Barbie box before I went to see the barbie movie. So I look like a schlub in my I'm Shluvy Barbie over here just like look in. Like I was not prepared to be seen by humanity I was like I'm going to a movie I don't need to look good and then the Barbie box was there and by the time the the second opportunity to get in the Barbie box was there. It was absolutely mobbed so I was not able to get a reshoot.

01:26.72
Jala
Ah, yeah, ah, that's ok, that's ok, even if you might have been in like you're you're cleaning out the garage clothes or your Netflix and chill clothes or whatever you want to call it. Um. You know at the same time you are so fabulous that it shines through anyway. I am sure I am sure beautiful. So yeah, um, you just kind of like rolled up. You just got home. So thank you for popping on for recording I appreciate that? Yes, yes, so and Julia.

01:46.30
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, thank you goodness.

01:55.51
Rachel _any_all_
Of course, thank you for having me on.

02:00.75
Jala
Yeah, how are you doing today.

02:03.49
Juliet St_ Moon
I'm I'm doing I'm doing all right I'm doing pretty well I'm here I'm happy. So yeah.

02:08.95
Jala
Thriving in your lane moisturized. Yeah, very cool, very cool and um, thank you as well for being on I'm very excited to talk about this movie with both of y'all. So. At the beginning of the episodes I always tried to give everyone a little bit of time to talk about the stuff that they do so Juliet. You haven't talked very much yet. So um, tell folks what you do if you have anything going if you don't great. No problem.

02:36.47
Juliet St_ Moon
I Don't really have much much really going right now at least not in terms of a public work I'm just you know, just kind of you know, guessing on really cool podcasts here and they're just kind of like tricking people into inviting me on. You know, that's how it goes.

02:50.49
Jala
No, you get requested so often by everyone. That's fine. Yeah see look look. That's meta. That's super meta that's awesome. So Rachel how about you.

02:57.10
Juliet St_ Moon
Ah, yes, see I tricked you I tricked you into wanting it though is the thing.

03:05.93
Jala
Um, I know that you've got screen snark on temporary hiatus. But there's a whole backlog of of episodes tell folks about it.

03:12.18
Rachel _any_all_
Yes, Ah, which oh so so many? ah thank goodness we made a little evergreen podcast. Ah that can just hang out while while the reason of hiatus is going to become very apparent as I speak I am.

03:29.31
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, in the midst of my second full year of training to become a professional wrestler. Ah it is an absolutely wild life. Um I am gearing up for taking on ah matches outside of my school. Um. Learning how to navigate ah in in a wrestling ring. Um and not being actually allowed to wrestle. Ah you see I am forebodden from it. So I have also taken up the duties of managing an actual pro wrestler by the name of Charles stunning. Ah she is. She's thriving truly out there in the world of the squared circle. Um, and on top of that. Ah I I have a cat who just jumped on my lap that is why I got so to start as like I hello. Ah, that the champion cat. Ah his is his name and you might hear him a couple times apologies. He's a very talkative ah, kitty catty um, oh good, good. Good. He he has been so obsessed with me lately I don't know what's going on but he's like I'm on your lap.

04:31.77
Jala
We love Pod pets. It is all good.

04:45.25
Rachel _any_all_
You're doing something I'm here I'm here. So yeah I am a pet parent and an aspiring pro wrestler who legally cannot wrestle so I take care of the wrestler charles setting. It was definitely not me not me.

04:53.55
Jala
Right? right? But yeah, well it sounds like you have a whole heck of a lot going on for sure. But yeah, but then you do have put the whole entire backlog of screen snark.

05:02.86
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, that charles is quite a mess.

05:11.40
Rachel _any_all_
Yes.

05:12.65
Jala
Ah, screen Snark which is part of a certain pov podcast network. So um, that's findable on certain pov.com and

05:22.38
Rachel _any_all_
Yes, we had the distinct pleasure of having Jolla on one of our episodes. Ah and that one had to sit silent for a while because it talked about struck media.

05:32.74
Jala
Yeah, yeah, this this episode right here we were planning on doing it like last summer right right? when it it first came out and um then the strike occurred and so we were standing in solidarity with the strikers and so we could not.

05:50.53
Jala
Record that episode until now. So here we are Yes, we have absolutely the real world. Oh I don't know how I feel about that. We'll talk about it. We'll talk about so I do want to.

05:54.47
Rachel _any_all_
We've done it. We've made it here. We are in the real world.

06:06.92
Jala
Everybody um, also that you can sport the show and the fireart media network by going to our coffee. It's Ko Hyphen F I dot com slash fireheart media you can kick us bucks couple bucks here and there there's lots of extra goodies. There are extra contents. Lots of shows and reviews and show notes and stuff. So yeah, ah take a look at that. There's also a swag shop where you can buy shirts and stickers and stuff that have our logos on it so take a look at that. The links are in the show notes and that is all I've got so. So without further ado let us talk about Barbie yay so Barbie is a 2023 American Adventure comedy about self-discovery directed by Greta Gerwig written by Greta Gerwig and Noah Bombbach Am I saying that right? That's if so that's awesome bobach. That's a great name. The score is by Mark Ronson and Andrew Wyatt and um it was distributed by Warner Brothers of course it's part of Mattel films which is you know its whole thing mattel I think at this point is like planning several more Barbie movies or something like that am i.

07:23.52
Rachel _any_all_
I believe they're also planning a bunch of other random property movies anything they have their hands on I think they're trying to make again not to get way into it but we're we're taking the wrong lessons for Barbie already I don't think anybody wants.

07:41.82
Rachel _any_all_
Hungry Hungry hippos the movie you know I'm just say I'm just saying I don't think everyone's clambering for such a such a venture but here we are apologies.

07:51.24
Juliet St_ Moon
And hungry hungry hippos the beginning. Yeah.

07:57.54
Rachel _any_all_
I Can't wait for it to become a whole fast and furious franchise and then we get Hungrier Hippos Hungriest hippos.

08:03.87
Juliet St_ Moon
And and know you misunderstand a beginning is actually spelled like it's pronounced like beginning but spelled like big and in as in the process of getting pig. So you know.

08:12.41
Rachel _any_all_
Oh my gosh. Yeah oh you know what I take back everything I said I need to see this movie.

08:20.66
Jala
So it's like the Miss Marvel Hungry Hungry hip post Crossover nobody thought it was going to happen and big in right? So ah, ah my so yes, um before we proceed any further I forgot to mention we do have a spoiler wall. We will be talking. Um.

08:27.22
Rachel _any_all_
In begin. Yeah I Love that.

08:39.48
Jala
Pre and post spoiler wall. So like if you want to hear about the movie a little bit and you don't want it spoiled for you. Good news. There's going to be a spoiler wall and then we will get into all the nitty gritty and all of the super deep stuff about this movie. So um, we'll talk a little bit here at the top about it. So. What is the spoilerfree version of the narrative. So we've got stereotypical Barbie just called Barbie in the movie most of the time and a wide range of fellow barbies all residing in Barbie Land a matriarchal society where all women are self-content and self-confident. And self-sufficient and successful and there can counterparts spend their days engaging in recreation recreational activities at the beach and the barbies are holding important job positions like doctor lawyer politician president beach Ken. And aka like the primary can in the movie by Ryan Gosling is only happy when Barbie is looking at him and he seeks a closer relationship with her but Barbie is just telling him no in favor of independence and female friendships. So there's a dance party and then suddenly. Barbie is stricken with worries about mortality. 1 of the things that you see in the I believe it's in one of the trailers for it is she's dancing. Everybody's listening to the music. It's all grooving and then she's like do you guys ever think about dying and then that that's when it hits and that's the beginning of.

10:12.83
Jala
Ah, the whole drama that goes on with Barbie herself the next day she finds that she can no longer complete her usual routine and discovers that her feet have gone flat and she has cellulite so weird Barbie. Ah wise but disfigured outcast which is you know the barbie that every child has mutilated except for me I never mutilated a barbie I took care of those but we'll we'll sit on that in a minute ah tells her that to cure her affliction. She has to travel into the real world to find the child playing with her and on her way to the real world Barbie Finds ken stowed away in her convertible and reluctantly allows her him to join her so ah, ken is along for the ride going to the real world to find the child that is playing with barbie so that she can fix the situation because there's something going on with that kid. That's the basis of this narrative.

11:07.40
Jala
So what did you all think like I wouldn't when you went to go watch this movie. Did you know a lot about this movie before you saw it either of you.

11:16.81
Juliet St_ Moon
Okay, so I I didn't I I intentionally went in blind aside from like the first trailer or something and this was just one of those cases where like the moment I heard the kind heard that they were making this movie. And you know well little details that they had revealed are about it like the casting and everything I'm like okay this is either going to be the worst thing the world or it's going to be the absolute coolest thing on the planet and I'm really hoping it's the latter because like it just immediately. It gave me really strong. Ah lego movie fibes.

11:54.99
Juliet St_ Moon
Just in terms of like kind of like deconstructing like you know the meta around this really popular you know timeless children's property and you know I was like a yeah yes and I was just kind of like okay they they can do that with this and I'm really really really trusting.

12:02.48
Rachel _any_all_
Also will farrell.

12:13.67
Juliet St_ Moon
That they're going to and I and ah speaking boldly I I I think that I think that's correct I think they knocked it out of the park. Honestly.

12:20.54
Jala
Right? right? Rachel how about you did you know about Barbie before you saw barbie.

12:24.66
Rachel _any_all_
Agreed Ah, um I Very similarly kept myself very out of the loop about it I didn't want to be influenced in any other way Also caught those Lego movie Vibes. Um. But as the days got closer to release I couldn't help but get more and more and more excited. Um, specifically through the release of singles off of the album. Um, once I sort of knew and Understood. What.

13:00.54
Rachel _any_all_
Like the pop music landscape of this movie was going to be I continue to get incredibly hype. Ah I'm not going to Lie. Ah that do Alipa Song is everything to me personally and the moment I heard it I was pretty sure that this movie was going to Rip. Ah, and I was absolutely blown away by how much it does ah every moment of this movie is a delight and an absolutely beautiful telling of what it means to.

13:36.93
Rachel _any_all_
Be a person and have have this understanding that like that life is ephemeral and that's what makes it worth it. You know it's It's so it's so beautiful and also there's just there's this incredible.

13:53.93
Rachel _any_all_
Love of Cinema within its language you know, ah it it just it did everything I wanted it to do and then it just did have more. You're welcome happy birthday. You're welcome. Um, yeah I aored it I adored it I think I lo you think about it all the time.

14:11.10
Jala
So about the music as soon as we left the theater I looked up the album and bought it and then I will tell you anytime I play the album like it doesn't take much to get Dave to start singing my husband. 

14:26.98
Jala
But like anytime I put on like pink we will we will jamed to pink or we will jam to like I'm just Ken the Ken song and we will belt out the whole thing together the entire and we would like it. It can't even peaches like a line if any if you one of us starts it for any reason.

14:44.15
Jala
I Have to play it and we have to sing the entire song together. So it's a thing. It's a thing in our house. We we belt out random parts of the those different songs. Um all the time.

14:48.35
Rachel _any_all_
Yes, but this. Yeah, it's a smash every like all those tracks are incredible and this movie is phenomenal. Hello I love it 12 out of 10 on this movie for me.

15:05.40
Jala
You're right right? Yeah, it was definitely like my movie of the year last year and um I also also also went in not knowing anything like I had seen some some buzz on the internet about it and then I'd seen like a little part of a trailer and I'm like it. Might be good but I was really worried that it was going to be like so over the top that it's like you know, ah overexaggerated in like the bad way. You know, um and then it was actually I believe when Matt was posting about how excited they were. Ah, Matt Dormaddon ah you know they were talking about how excited they were about this movie and I'm like well if Matt's excited about this movie maybe I should be more excited about this movie and so um I just kind of went to the movie on a whim after I finished this fitness expo I had gone to um because I was like well I need. See it that you know it's not just Matt there's other people I know that are really excited about this movie I should see it and so I did and then I walked out of the theater and David I were just both shell-shocked. We were just like wow wow and just spent. The whole car ride home just talking about it nonstop and then the next several days talking about it nonstop like it just didn't didn't end for a long time. There. So just definitely um.

16:32.88
Jala
As you say like there's a very good love of cinema. There's also the way that it is done is also sensitive to the experience of growing up with Barbie in our current day and age and like.

16:47.90
Jala
Being a person who is the age of the mother of of Sasha you know like Gloria the age of Gloria in this. Um and you know the experience of becoming an adult after having grown up with little barbies and things like that and um barbie. When I was growing up wasn't something that I played like I had barbies. It wasn't my favorite toy I tended to like boy toys far more than I liked girl toys ah girl branded toys at least? um. So you know like I played more with dinosaurs and and other stuff like that than I did with barbies but I did have some um I never had a weird barbie because I took care of all of my stuff I didn't want any of it to be messed up I never brushed Barbie's hair because I knew that would turn it frizzy. And I never marked them up I was very careful with them. But um, you know I had a few I had what I think 3 has 3 so so yeah and that was my experience with Barbie.

17:54.62
Jala
Um, did either of you happen to have barbie in your life at any point as a small child either your own or someone else's around you.

18:01.72
Rachel _any_all_
Incredibly so I had a barbie everything I was a barbie child. Ah my my love for this doll ah is deep and immense. Ah, ah yeah I'm I'm trying to.

18:20.69
Rachel _any_all_
Decide like how bad it's it's gonna get for me right now. How much I'm going to say ah I had Barbie Curtains Barbie bed sheets Barbie's dream house I had the my size barbie that was three feet tall and you could wear her clothes and that was the greatest gift.

18:40.30
Rachel _any_all_
I ever received and I'm pretty sure that my size Barbie is in my basement in my parents house somewhere to this very day I loved her I loved Barbie I had so many I never mutilated one of my barbies I only think I gave one a haircut. Because I didn't understand that her hair was not going to grow back? Um I just I I just was into I cut my own hair at that time too. So I was just like really wanted to cut hair. Um, and I did make a Barbie look bad with a terrible haircut. Um, which I I very much regret doing um.

19:17.42
Rachel _any_all_
Both as my little self looking back on it and me as an adult going. Why would you do that that was very stupid. Um, yeah, no I've I had a huge Barbie collection like it was real at the car I had it all. They got me. They got me.

19:31.17
Jala
Awesome I I really really wanted any of the little cars you know I I never got 1 um like as much as I could I had ninja turtle everything that was me I was all into the ninja turtles a thousand percent so

19:47.79
Jala
But Juliet how about you.

19:50.82
Juliet St_ Moon
I actually I did have a kendall when I was a very little um, ah you know I also had a baby sister so you know she had a bunch of barbies and whatnot and you know I thought it was fun. We would play you know with the lot together and and ah you know through her like I kind of got to you know since you know i. You know since I grew up. You know you know a boy or however, you want to say it like I you know I kind of got the I kind of got the built in excuse of having a baby sister who had a bunch of barbies like you know we can kind of like play with them together and have a good time with them. Um I do remember um a number of the. Absolutely wild like mid two Thousand C G movies that were musicals that they made like but like like like like I still have some of the scenes and some of the lyrics from the songs in like movies like print Barbie princess in the pauper and stuff like that like still in my head like.

20:43.83
Juliet St_ Moon
Like that is why I'm just Ken song like some of those songs I just have memorized I've seen them so many times.

20:50.95
Jala
That's awesome. Yeah, so like I had a ken. Okay, so so here's the thing about Barbie I I was very very sensitive to representation or lack thereof and so um. The main Barbie is blont and I was looking for one that looked more like me and so I ended up getting like um because like at first I think we could only find the redheaded one so I had the redhead and then I got the brunette eventually and then you know that was the one that I preferred to play with um.

21:21.61
Jala
So that's the one that I had ah and then I did have a ken but I thought it was very very weird that his hair was painted on. You know like he doesn't have like soft hair like Barbie does. He's got like the painted on.

21:36.53
Juliet St_ Moon
Ah, same thing.

21:36.81
Jala
Yeah I thought that was very upset that was deeply upsetting to me and I was just like um.

21:39.92
Rachel _any_all_
Ah I had ah the Barbie version of beauty in the beast. Ah and the prince from that like it was like a little costume you could put on him. He had real hair I got to say ah it's creepy.

21:55.64
Jala
Yeah I know.

21:58.40
Rachel _any_all_
The fake hair better is the fake care works more I'm just saying because like the boy hair mm nightmares.

22:00.16
Jala
It? Yeah yeah in in the thing is is that that those those Nylon fibers or whatever. It's made out of do not do well at a short length. They really need to be longer. Yeah.

22:13.65
Rachel _any_all_
Yes, it was bad that Pony tale was bad.

22:18.37
Juliet St_ Moon
Yeah I think I think I did have a I think the Ken doll I had did have real hair and it was like just this really sad a little like weird like almost like bird plume of hair that wouldn't actually like stay down when brush or whatever it was like.

22:34.28
Jala
Definitely you like Yeah yeah, if you brush it. It's just going to get worse. You just touch it at all in the hairs. There's going to be a mess. So ah, it. It is actually a good thing that it's painted on the actual doll. but but yeah, um so yeah and ah but yeah like my my sensitivity with Barbie was that I wanted a barbie that looked like me and I was upset that that Barbie was relegated to like the friend you know, like rather than being a ah primary Barbie and like eventually they did come out with um barbies of different. Um, hair colors and skin colors and things that were official Barbie but like that was later after I had basically gotten out of the point of of having barbies. Um, you know like actively. So. Ah, that was that was my thing um back in the day and that's the thing that I've mentioned before about like trying to find representation for the way that I exist in the world. You know like um, trying to find female role models or any any kind of character role models that fit me was so hard growing up. Um, and. This movie to to link it back to the movie this movie addresses that this movie addresses a lot of stuff that like because there was this big backlash in the 90 s about you know? oh well Barbie you know has made all these you know pressures and and it's just this uplifting of this.

24:01.25
Jala
Beauty myth and this this expectation that men have the patriarchy and blah blah blah all this stuff. Ah you know was being touted in the early 90 s and foist it onto Barbie as you know like oh well Barbie is is basically the devil more or less and.

24:21.20
Jala
I Remember all of that happening and I was like yeah, that's right because I don't look like a barbie you know and and so on and so forth and um I I like that this movie addresses that and this movie tries to address to a certain extent. You know like the inclusivity part. Ah, and. It Also you know like it. It brings up a lot of these topics in a way that's sensitive to those experiences of not just like a certain population but like a larger a larger audience of people like you know I I feel like this movie was written with so many people in mind. In a way that feels like considered in in far far more so than I would have expected of it.

25:09.33
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah I I feel that too there is a there's definitely an and like an intentional decision being made to be like hey in Barbie Land everybody's Barbie you know so that means anybody can be Barbie it's like it's kind of like the ah spider verse of it all like and.

25:29.23
Rachel _any_all_
Could be Spiderman anybody could be Barbie you know, um to sort of comment on the backlash of the 90 s situation. Um I think that discussion was the thing that kind of turned me off to Barbie for a long time.

25:43.53
Jala
Me too.

25:46.78
Rachel _any_all_
You know I I really kind of like saw and understood. Um in hindsight I kind of wish that I had had the thoughtfulness to be like but Barby's a doctor also like we're looking at something that is aspirational and going like why is this so aspirational.

26:04.30
Rachel _any_all_
You know, um I just think I think sometimes our our backlashes are very interesting and very telling about sort of where we are as as folks and and while I I do agree that like Barbie is so beautiful I think. Just pinning Barbie with the problem of an entire societal situation of beauty standards was kind of bizarre hey ninety s there is a lot of other like I think heroin chic was in at the same time you know so it's just it's it's very funny to watch the the way we sort of like.

26:40.66
Rachel _any_all_
Internalize a problem and then project it outward you know, like Barbie's the problem. It's like I think a lot of other things are the problem and I think that's what's really great about the Barbie movie itself. It's sort of that commentary on. Hey there's a lot of reasons that things are this way. It's not just Barbie. That's the problem. It is that women are asked to be this and this and this and this which are all contradictory. it's it's it's it's really great. How smart this movie is in understanding. It's. Own property its own lore its own cultural impact and being able to dissect it and discuss it in a movie that is incredibly charming and funny again. Um every every time I talk I'm just getting in on the statement this movie knocks it out of the park.

27:29.79
Jala
Yeah, it's it's masterfully done and especially because it well it doesn't sit on any particular aspect and in a way that overstays its welcome. You know what? I mean. So.

27:32.83
Rachel _any_all_
I Love this movie. How could it.

27:45.23
Jala
Like it talks about self-discovery and idealism versus realism and the complexity and contradictory nature of being a woman in a patriarchal society the loneliness and isolation of patriarchal men and the need for independent thought and becoming your own hero. And all of these like these are just a few of the themes that are in this movie and it's not like um, an assault of like all of these different ideas thrown at you you know or anything like that. They're brought up in an organic way. They have their moment. They're examined. And then we move on to you know like the rest of the narrative. The narrative is complex and like what the characters are feeling and what you feel when you're watching it all of that is complex. But it's because the subject matter is complex because living life in our world is complex. So ah, definitely It's it's a great movie. Um, and and so like I Juliet you haven't talked in a little bit. What what do you think about the way that this movie is presented generally.

28:51.43
Juliet St_ Moon
I I I mean I like like I I I mean you you kind of said most of the things I would say honestly like I do I do particularly want to plus one the idea of like you know everyone being Barbie I just thought that was on top top of everything said I just think that's fun. Honestly like you know it is kind of like a joke that tells itself that there will be like you know 8 people in a room and every single one of them is either Barbie or Ken and they're talking to each other and it's just kind of like it's just kind of assumed that everyone you know knows you know which specific Barbie or Ken is being referred to you know.

29:30.19
Juliet St_ Moon
Yeah, and just um, but yeah, yeah, I yeah I yeah I don't I I don't yeah yeah I haven't so much was tonight my my thoughts on like the presentation don't really go that much deeper than this this is really really cool I like this I think they really like got the tone down in the aesthetic down and. It just really feels authentic to what Barbie is and also it's kind of fun but also it doesn't like get to the point of like just cynical parody you know, like yeah.

29:57.62
Jala
Yeah, right right? Although I will say um the moment that I walked into the theater and I sat down and the movie started and then you have the spoke Zara Thustra playing

30:11.17
Jala
And then the little kids playing with dolls and and this is the only part of the actual movie I'm going to mention because it's it's too good. Um, there's little girls playing with dolls and then Barbie arrives and then like what happens after that. Just. Had me rolling with laughter and at that at that very moment at the very beginning of the movie I'm like okay I didn't I walked into this theater not knowing what I was going to get but this is already so good in the first several seconds of the movie that I have faith that this movie is going to be a very good time.

30:45.60
Rachel _any_all_
And the fact that it's an absolute sendup of the beginning of 3001 space odyssey like how dare you how dare you like it almost almost a shot for shot remake of it but instead of the dot of humanity. It is the dawn of the doll that is Barbie incredible I Think about that all the time I think about it all the time.

31:08.70
Jala
It's so good. It's so good like there there is no other way to say it. It's It's fantastic. So normally at the end of like us this spoiler free section because I think we all just want to talk in depth about this movie at this point So I don't want to prolong this intro. Um, normally.

31:25.96
Jala
I Say who do you think needs to see this media. Who would you recommend this to and the problem is I would say everyone and I think everybody would say everyone am I wrong. The.

31:32.70
Rachel _any_all_
You I agree. No I I would have yeah everyone cinenophiles should see this movie people who hate movies should see this movie I I do believe in its ad campaign. It would.

31:37.29
Juliet St_ Moon
And now you're right.

31:48.47
Rachel _any_all_
If you love Barbie you'll love this movie if you hate Barbie you will love this movie and it truly threads that needle. So yeah, everybody should see this movie.

31:55.46
Jala
Absolutely absolutely so that is the end of your non spoiler section y'all we are going to go ahead and head on over to the real world. Yay.

32:07.87
Rachel _any_all_
Oh I'm so excited.

32:10.13
Jala
Yeah, spoiler wall fully erected fully erect Spoiler Wall who look at that spoil of spoiler wall. It's so erect. Ok, ah.

32:18.11
Juliet St_ Moon
I I thought they didn't have spoiler walls I Thought that was the whole point.

32:22.77
Jala
Right? right? Ah, they don't they can't they they can't at least not oh maybe they do but only at the end only at the end. Okay, so

32:37.26
Rachel _any_all_
Sublime The only wall it just is. It's a like a revolving. What is it a little swinging saloon door. That's it your spoiler swinging Saloon door is here so you might yell sublime about this movie.

32:42.56
Jala
Um, right? right? Yes, yes, absolutely so ah, continuing the narrative. So so Barbie has to go to the real world to figure out what's going on with the person who is playing with her in the real world. So that she can fix her cellulite and her flat feet and go back to being um, happy in Barbie Land so she arrives at Venice Beach and along with Ken and the 2 cause multiple antics. Ah the part that Juliet was referencing was when ah.

33:21.90
Jala
Barbie is like oh wow I got wolf whistle that that's really weird I'm going to go to the construction site. So I can get some girl power because in Barbie Land everybody's barbie. Our Barbie is doing all the jobs. So she's like I'm going to go see the you know girl power at the construction site and seize all the men and the men are. You know, ah oggling her and giving her you know wolf whistles and whatever and then she's like I don't have genitals so ah, therefore we do not have a spoiler wall this where the wall cannot be erect because there there is no such thing available to Ken.

33:58.18
Jala
So but yes, so when they're are off in the real world not understanding the differences between Barbie Land and the real world. They are arrested and end up alarming the mental Ceo who is will ferrell who orders their capture. So ah, they're like oh no, a barbie has escaped. This hasn't happened in so many years or whatever. Um, so apparently this has happened every once in a while and he says no no, no, we got to get her and capture her and take her back to Barbie Land before this chaos erupts in the real world. So ah Barbie tracks down her owner a tween girl named Sasha and when she goes and finds Sasha she goes to the school to go talk to her and sasha unloads on her in this scene that like. My eyes got so like sor eyed when I was in a theater watching this because I was like I cannot believe they went there who who Rachel what do? What do you think about like that whole scene where Sasha is just unloading.

35:08.74
Rachel _any_all_
Oh Sasha just lazed to Barbie I went oh I've been that girl oh ain I oh man. Um, it's so sorrowful and so hilarious at the same time.

35:26.60
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, because it is it is the movie having its moment to in equal parts discuss and dissect Barbie's cultural impact as overly aspirational. The thing we were just talking about with the with the 90 s situation. Um, it's also. A deeply illuminating character moment for Barbie to understand suddenly that the the story she has been told in Barbie land that they saved the world because of their barbie is a fiction and it also is so funny because it is a child making a grown woman cry. Ah, genius I love it. Ah ten ten out of 10 on that scene. Ah, just because of how much it is doing without necessarily like telling you what it's doing. Oh it's like watching a magic trick.

36:16.99
Jala
Right? right? Well and then too the actress for Sasha is giving such a great performance and the fact that they chose to have Sasha be like a tween girl who's like too cool for Barbie anymore but isn't like full teenhood yet.

36:36.37
Jala
Is perfect because like that's the attitude of like the beginning of the rebellion the troubling stage right? and so you know for her to pop off is a natural and normal and expected thing for that age of character. So um. You know like that that fits it's not like it's shoehorned in at all. It would be so different if it was like ah an adult being bitter at Barbie you know what I'm saying but having this tween who's there with her friends and then like one of the other classmates is like.

37:12.60
Jala
Oh don't go over there. She's gonna rip you basically rip you a new asshole and then Barbie's like oh no, it's fine. She loves me and goes over there and then leaves crying and then the the classmates like I told her you know, um, it's just very good because it it channels like you know that the experience. Ah.

37:17.83
Rachel _any_all_
Um, yeah Mingham bar me.

37:31.50
Jala
Being a kid right? and then also an experience of growing up and realizing the difference between what you were told as a kid to expect and then what your reality is as you age and become you know start to become an adult.

37:47.80
Juliet St_ Moon
And I think 1 other thing about that scene that was it that was you know, kind of funny but also kind of interesting is like you know if you remember she ends that whole rant with saying you know you're literally fascist right? and it just feels like kind of like.

38:07.42
Juliet St_ Moon
That whole conversation. It feels kind of framed like kind of in the context of like I don't know how intentional this was but it kind of gives me like I hate how it's impossible talk about these things without you know, evoking like certain shitty like you know. You know, right-wing talking points but like it feels like it evokes just a little bit of like you know online like outrage culture or cancel culture type stuff where it's like you know this woman is just you know just getting like absolutely dressed down and like you know at least as far as her like perspective goes like she she was called a fascist basically just for coming up and saying hi to someone.

38:39.12
Jala
Yeah.

38:42.10
Juliet St_ Moon
And you know and was with you know a whole bunch of other loaded baggage with that and and you know it was kind of funny because like oh yeah, that sounds like something that would happen on Twitter but also like you know, looks like it sounds like they were modeling that whole exchange on a particular type of online interaction. It feels like.

38:56.16
Jala
Well and that is part of why it speaks so well to the audience who is watching it at that moment. This isn't like some outdated speech that is is being made to Barbie from like channeling the 90 s and only the 90 s it's you know, channeling that. Echo that that echo of what once was and it's bringing it forward and modernizing it and having like a youth of today. Not a youth of the 90 s telling that story so you know like that's very cool. You know because like so where is sasha going to hear all this. You know like sash is going to hear this from other people other other girls and and their moms have told them stuff like Sasha's own mother loves Barbie and would never but like you know, um, ah she's going to hear it from other people and other people's parents. You know who are going to tell their kids and so on so you know. It's this interesting way of just like showing that that message has conveyed down and hasn't been updated or anything you know until the time of this movie There's also another scene. Ah that happens I I forget if it's before or after she meets Sasha. Where she's where Barbie is sitting at a bus stop and there's a little old lady just sitting there. It is so good. It is so good because she's sitting there and Barbie just turns and looks at the old lady for a moment and she just says very very sincerely.

40:18.19
Rachel _any_all_
Is my favorite scene.

40:32.83
Jala
You know you're beautiful and then the little old lady just turns to her and says I know and it's just this quiet moment. But it's so beautiful.

40:44.36
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, but that's absolutely my favorite scene and in the whole movie also for a little bit of trivia. Ah, the woman. The older woman is the costume designer for this movie.

40:52.27
Jala
Awesome.

40:57.78
Juliet St_ Moon
And I was going to bring up the scene if no one else did because it's also my absolute favorite in the movie and um without getting ahead. I do think it's interesting that this scene kind of. It does act for as kind of a tell of what ends up happening to Barbie at the end of the movie because you know it's like even though Barbie doesn't quite realize it like even at this point in the movie like she sees like this you know, extremely human. Um, this. This very strong like example of you know what being human does to you know this? this woman is you know, very very very very old and Barbie is just struck by like oh my god you're so beautiful and you know so like Wal which you know, kind of acts as like even though she's kind of freaking out about having cellule etc. Like there is also like a part of her where like if she isn't like looking at herself she can kind of see like the products of humanity and someone else and think it's the most beautiful thing in the world.

41:56.94
Jala
Right? She's appreciating what it is to be human and she's appreciating the value of another woman who is older who in our society is devalued older women are devalued and you know are not. Appreciated that same way. Um, since I'm now going on 42 this year I'm like at that point in in time where I've way past my my expiration date. So like I'm I'm seeing and you know experiencing all of that stuff now as I age so you know. Ah, though the way that I am treated is vastly different over time as I get older. So yeah, ah it it was very important that that scene be there even though it doesn't have any you know it doesn't bear any um, it doesn't have any particular impact on anything else that is going on. It's a brief moment. The moment passes Ken comes back up and you know both Barbie and Ken are both wearing western outfits because back before they got arrested for the second time they were trying to get new clothes because they had worn their their roller blading gear and then they went to a store but then they you know tried on everything and and whatnot. And then they left without paying because they didn't realize they had to pay and they didn't have any money so that's why they got arrested the second time and um and the cops were like oh well, you look really good in it. You just keep the clothes so you know she's walking around it in her western outfit.

43:23.40
Rachel _any_all_
Home.

43:34.60
Jala
Ah, and after this very very important scene and after the scene with Sasha in the school ah Barbie realizes that it's not Sasha like Sasha gets picked up by her mother. Gloria. And Gloria like she she finds out that Gloria who is a Mattel employee is the one who was playing with her not Sasha. It's not Sasha that is having the problem. It's it's Gloria that is and Gloria has been playing with those. Um, she's. The one who caused this existential crisis for Barbie. Um I don't I don't remember is it like so so Gloria comes up. Gloria's picking up Sasha Gloria leaves is it that at that point that Barbie recognizes that. Really early in the movie or is it a later point when she gets that.

44:36.26
Rachel _any_all_
Is it after that in the like in the car I can't remember honestly I was it's It's become a soup a delicious soup in my mind.

44:41.29
Jala
Yeah, yeah, yeah, right, right? Well so there's at some point in here approximately at this time. Barbie discovers that information. Ah meanwhile Ken when when Barbie was very busy going into the school to talk to Sasha Ken has been learning about patriarchy. Ah so he he was really obsessed with horses and so he went in and was ah asking like he ended up going to the library in the school.

45:14.60
Jala
To learn about horses. But then he also learned about you know, patriarchy along the way when he was in the school and you know he asked someone for the time and then the lady who was answering him said oh yes, sir and all this other stuff and he was like she respects me. And and so on and so forth and then he's like walking around the town for a little bit and then people are just like you know, ah treating him very differently than he was treated in Barbie land because you know of course we are a patriarchal society so you know ah he even at one point. Decides that he's going to try to do a surgery and then the the nurse is like no you can't do that. You're not a doctor and he's like but I'm a man and there was this whole scene with that. Um, so yeah. Ah, he feels important. He feels accepted. Ah, he's kind of bowled over by everything but Barbie is too busy with her own stuff to realize what's going on with Ken so um, oh yes yes I think I remember now how it goes so when they're at the school. Um. So so Barbie Barbie and Ken re reconvene for a brief moment and then Ken goes away to go learn about patriarchy ah Barbie is not does not have any time for him so he just goes away and does his thing Barbie Sees Sasha and Gloria leave and then I believe the Mattel people come.

46:44.59
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah I yeah I thought she went to matel before she makes the discovery that she is in fact America for bary.

46:45.00
Jala
And that's like she she gets gotten by the Mattel people at that point so she goes to the Mattel headquarters.

46:59.17
Jala
Yeah, well, um, she might have made that discovery. Ah yeah, she probably made that discovery when she gets into the car with Gloria and Sasha but um at the same time like she sees Gloria for the first time right before she gets in the Mattel vehicle.

47:17.20
Jala
So ah, like basically when they say oh we're you know we're from Mattel and then she's just like oh great I'm so glad you know? and and all this mess and then she just goes in the vehicle with them to the Mattel headquarters so that she can go back to Barbie land and because she thinks that they can fix everything. So um. Meanwhile Ken is finding his own way back to Barbie Land he's found out about patriarchy. He's discovered. You know, um, that men rule everything over in the real world and so he takes patriarchy back to Barbie Land and so he and the other like he tells the other kens and all the Kens take over Barbie land and begin to so basically subjugate all the barbies into submissive roles such as maids and housewives and agreeable girlfriends and all of this stuff and that's what's going on in actual Barbie Land so back with Barbie. She goes to Mattel headquarters and will ferrell and his council of useless ceos all decide that they are going to ah try to send her back by putting her in the Barbie box and she ends up deciding that she does not want to go back to Barbie Land without you know, figuring out what's going on and and whatnot so she ends up trying to escape from them. She doesn't want to just go back and be the way she was before without figuring out and and fixing the problem so she has this whole chase scene where she's being chased through all of Mattel.

48:50.86
Jala
It's very funny because the cubicles like don't have any entrances they are just like boxes and the people are just in boxes in there.

48:57.64
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, it's great also an incredible needle drop for this j sequence of Charlie X E X's speed drive. It's so I popped so hard in the theater when that needle dropped I was like yes yes yes, great. Great chase sequence. Great pop track.

49:17.61
Rachel _any_all_
4 chase sequence. Unbelievable.

49:19.70
Jala
Yeah, yeah, so um, one thing I do want to mention about like the the whole meeting with Mattel is that like it's all men and then barby's like where's the woman in charge and you know will Ferrell's like we had a woman president once. You know, like seven billion years ago you know and that kind of thing and it kind of is emphasizing that everybody in Mattel is masculine. They they are not women Barbie was expecting women to be running it. But no, that is not the case.

49:52.29
Jala
And so so she gets that little tidbit of information and ah Juliet did you? What did you think about like the appearance of will ferrell and his cohorts.

50:03.15
Juliet St_ Moon
And I think it's I I do notice that you know or earlier I did mention that like the movie generally avoids like really obvious like you know, cynical parody like you know in general when it's. You know at least straightly when it's like you know presenting its material I do think an exception is kind of for the dudes at Mattel and I'm sure that was like some kind of compromise they had to reach because they they couldn't like literally actually like they couldn't present Mattel as looking like too awful. You know since you know they're the rights holders. You know you know for the property for the movie they're making and the result was kind of like this almost like I guess like almost like I even me as a criticism but just like way too obvious like you know parody of like you know businessmen in suits. Basically.

51:00.11
Juliet St_ Moon
Um, you know you have that whole you you do have that whole bit where you know will ferrell kind of like does the um he does the whole parody of like performative corporate. You know, like feminism. Where you know it's like oh well, you know we love women so much we had a president once we we had 2 with a female presences. At 1 point you know and so on and so forth and it just feels like these are kind of like you know these are the bumbling loons of the movie. Basically.

51:26.22
Jala
Oh yeah, absolutely and I will say 1 thing that I was surprised by is that when ah the people at one side of the table start whispering and you know each person is whispering to the next person to pass the message on to will Ferrell. I was really expecting it to be like a game of telephone where by the time the message got to will Ferrell. It wouldn't be the same at all and he'd come out with something nonsense and I was actually kind of disappointed that didn't happen because all the rest of this part is is pretty exaggerated right? So but um. 1 thing that I will say about will ferrell existing in this movie like he's okay, here later in the movie he gets to the point where he's like oh call me mother and all this other stuff and like all of that just was like. A bridge too far for me where I'm like I you're not working for me here right now I don't know if maybe it's just because I'm not the biggest will Ferrell fan. Um, or if it's just you know, just something about the stuff and like regardless of who was saying it you know like I wasn't cool with that I don't know we'll we'll see. Um, but anyway so so chasing we have the the cool music and we've got the chas scene and so Sasha is like meanwhile okay so while barbies and Mattel Sasha is being driven home by Gloria.

52:47.90
Jala
And then Sasha is telling her. Yeah, this lady came up and she said she was a barbie and then saw you know? ah Gloria is just like oh my god you know what happened? Oh she got taken by the Mattel. Oh my god we have to go save her and so ah, Gloria and you know still with Sasha and tow. go up to Mattel to go rescue Barbie so Barbie happens to have eluded the different corporate goons and has run outside the building right? at the time the Gloria drives up and so Gloria's like get in the car and and that's during this part is where. Gloria and Barbie realize you're a mind Barbie you I'm you' a Barbie you know? Ah, you're the one that you that I have the you know has the problem right now and end during this scene. America Ferrera is telling you know Barbie about. Ah, just all the different things that she's been feeling and how frustrated she is while she's driving like during this chasing because all the corporate goons are are driving after them and Gloria is just you know driving like super mad skills and Sasha meanwhile is in the back of the car like where did you learn how to drive like this you know. Ah, and Gloria just kind of yet that that part is so good and.

54:00.34
Rachel _any_all_
And so cute. Oh you have some guy dad. Yes, your father definitely so good like right, You're not ready to know that I had other relationships before your dad who.

54:20.92
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, oh ah, lest we not forget that during the chase sequence. There is a moment of respite where Barbie meets the ghost of the inventor of Barbie.

54:28.41
Jala
Oh yes, there was also that let us talk about that for a second she eluded the corporate goons just for a moment and found herself in kind of like I I guess the basement area I don't know it looked kind of like some weird off the beaten path.

54:33.72
Rachel _any_all_
Oh my goodness. What.

54:44.37
Rachel _any_all_
Just at a an alter an interdimensional space within the establishment of Mattel.

54:52.38
Jala
Um, it really reminded me of Bill and Ted's bogus journey when they were in hell.

54:57.39
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, yes, yes, ah this movie loves movies.

54:59.86
Jala
Guess it does so so Julia what? But what did you think about the scene with Ruth.

55:05.50
Juliet St_ Moon
Um I was I want. Well 1 thing I want to say first is that like I do wonder how much ah, how much ah, these people liked ah the matrix because there are. 2 possible allusions to the matrix in this movie and I feel like this is one of them like just because mainly just because the whole scene like reminds me a bit a bit of going to see the oracle like you know, just like the orange and the buy. But also you know we we to mentioned this but also earlier in the movie there is that bit where they kind of do the parody of the red blue red pill blue pill where

55:41.98
Juliet St_ Moon
Where barby tells her to choose the shoes. She wants based on whether you know she'll go on this journey or you know, However, it goes so like yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, and was yeah and was.

55:45.65
Jala
Ah, right, right? She either gets her pomp or her what birk and stock or whatever.

55:56.16
Juliet St_ Moon
Yeah, and then you know, but and then of course you know the joke was that you know, no, you didn't actually have a choice I just want you to choose it. You know, but but the um and like you know I could be wrong. They could not be thinking of a matrix but that's kind of like like there there there were 2 times at this movie. That's. Generally nothing like the matrix made me think of the matrix and it is weird that happened twice. So.

56:15.42
Jala
Yeah I it would not surprise me. Yeah, yeah, exactly. so so yeah um so then there's Ruth Ruth is adorable, low old Grandma lady.

56:15.76
Rachel _any_all_
I Don't think that's an accident honestly.

56:18.89
Juliet St_ Moon
Yeah, yeah.

56:30.50
Jala
And at this point you don't know who she is related to anything else. You don't realize that she is the creator of Barbie yet you just know that she's a little old lady somewhere in the mattel building that um is just talking to Barbie and trying to give her some advice and so on. Um.

56:49.68
Jala
and and yeah there's like there's just a brief interlude of peace and quiet and you're like who is that you know, um and I want to say that there is kind of like a light in there I remember it being like a lighter scene and that's why it reminded me of like Bill and Ted's bogus journey because. In that part. There's just like a bunch of corridors in in the part that I'm thinking about in hell where like they just go into the different rooms and then see different stuff in each of the rooms and in that movie. It's like channeled by memories. But here it it sort of is too I mean. Um, sort of kind of but ah Barbie something beyond what Barbie would remember so so yeah ah Gloria and Sasha realized that Barbie is Gloria's doll at at this point and then.

57:45.42
Jala
She's the Gloria is trying to help Barbie and Barbi's like oh my gosh we have to get back to Barbie Land I have to tell tell them you know like whatever I have to go go back to Barbie Land so Gloria and Sasha escort Barbie back to Barbie land and they all go together to Barbie land when they get there. They find that. All the kens like like I mentioned before have taken over. They have turned it into a patriarchy party and all of the barbies have been basically brainwashed and so she goes there and she tries to convince Ken Ken and the barbie to just like go back to the way things were but that doesn't work like just talking to them doesn't work Ken doesn't want anything to do with Barbie Ken has taken over her dream house and made it his mojo dojo casa house and you know. The other barbies are too brainwashed to listen to what stereotypical Barbie has to say so she becomes depressed but then Gloria gives her an inspirational speech about what it means to be a woman and when she does this the other barbies that were brainwashed around stereotypical Barbie. Suddenly snap out of it and then weird Barbie and the other barbies realize oh that's that's what we need. We need Gloria to basically tell all of the barbies. How much nonsense it is to be a woman and if you have not seen this and you're listening to this without having seen the movie.

59:16.60
Jala
Go look for that speech on on Youtube. Also why haven't you just watched the movie but definitely go check out that that speech or look it up and read it for yourself. It is absolutely phenomenal. So.

59:31.91
Rachel _any_all_
It hurts it hurts. It's so good that So it's so true. It's so real like.

59:34.74
Jala
Yeah, yeah, it basically is talking about the different inconsistencies between the things that women are expected to do you have to be thin but not too thin and you have to be successful but not too successful and. You have to you know, be really nice but you have to stand up for yourself and all this other stuff and it goes on and on and brings up a bunch of.

59:57.15
Rachel _any_all_
Your yeah, the be. That's the the contradictory nature of needing to be nurturing, but not to you know, just like you have to be attractive but it shouldn't look like you're wearing Makeup. You know that that entire circus act of what it is to be acceptable as a as a woman under a patriarchal lens you know it's it hurts it hurts the hurts.

01:00:30.13
Jala
Right? right? And um, you know last year I was doing the episodes on different aspects of toxic masculinity and ah the beauty myth and your your physical like your body dysmorphia. Your gender dysphoria your fat phobia and all of that and so many of these things are all intertwined with some of the messages that are in this movie as well. Um, so like this movie is kind of like the perfect piece of media to talk about a large number of things that I've talked about for hours on this show. So Juliet what? What did you think when you heard the speech for the first time.

01:01:13.13
Juliet St_ Moon
I Ah I It's all hot. Ah I I don't know I I think you covered most of the things I would say about it just you know it. You know it, you know it. It was it was tough. It was you know it was. It was just True. You know like yeah I.

01:01:32.59
Jala
Juliet how did the Barbie Speech make you feel.

01:07:04.70
Juliet St_ Moon
Ah I mean it was I feel it kind of speaks for itself. But the one the one that really stood out to me was that you're not supposed to get old because like on top of just like being contradictory. You know that one is just you know, flat out impossible and like.

01:07:23.96
Juliet St_ Moon
It feel it feels like you know you know she's complaining about the impossible Goldilocks zone that women are expected to exist in right? You know you get you got to be just right? But also what's just right is never you know, consistent either on top of all that yeah, it's it's a moving target that.

01:07:35.87
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah.

01:07:35.98
Jala
Um, it's a moving target.

01:07:42.32
Juliet St_ Moon
Will change its pattern. Whatever it feels like and like you know, just there there doesn't There is no like like ah there's a weird comparison but you know it's It's kind of it's almost like you know if you're if you're you know, making you know content on the internet and you're trying to chase an algorithm right.

01:08:01.30
Juliet St_ Moon
Like like there' is no actual like formula for doing it. You're just kind of blindly guessing and hoping it works and usually it doesn't and you know it's it's it's stressful. It's anxiety inducing and that kind and the kind of like and just the kind of like hopelessness she has at the end.

01:08:20.73
Juliet St_ Moon
Like where you know where it's kind of like where it's like yeah women deal with this and apparently a doll you know representing a woman deals with this then man were but just kind of fucked basically is is the kind of energy energy. It seems to end on.

01:08:32.54
Jala
Right? right? Well the thing the thing that stands out to me is the fact that the the unspoken part there is it doesn't have to be that way and that's the part that you know the the kind of.

01:08:50.89
Jala
Turn that it takes to where you know it's messy. It's contradictory is this that in the other but at the end of the movie Barbie chooses to be a part of it because she can make an impact in the real world and do stuff despite how. Hard it is to go about living in the real world you know and um, that's because it doesn't have to be that way and she wants to make a change for the better. She can't go back to being. Ah, Barbie and Barbie land anymore. So um, this whole last section of the movie is is pretty wild so we we have a lot of emotional stuff going on ah like a lot of the movie has been funny and cute and they're still funny and cute parts.

01:09:45.40
Jala
Towards the end of this movie here. But ah so so with the encouragement of Sasha Gloria weird Barbie Allen which we didn't even mention Alan ah.

01:09:56.48
Rachel _any_all_
Oh yeah, ah Michael Sarah in the role of a lifetime as Allen Kin's best friend I could never harm alllan unless protect Allen I can't even put a pin in him.

01:09:58.72
Jala
I know well put a pin in Allan we'll talk about Allen in just a second but like all of the yes we have to I know well the the barbie is ok. So basically I just want to finish the sentence.

01:10:15.93
Jala
Of the barbies free themselves from the kens and manipulate them to fight amongst themselves so we'll talk more about that in a minute. Let's circle back to Allen there are some discontinued dolls that show up in here. There's pregnant midge who is Alan's girlfriend who is the brunette.

01:10:34.34
Jala
And she is just in part of the very beginning of the movie and basically everybody's like oh it's so weird this pregnant doll is really weird and then you know she's just kind of looked down on and then shoved off to the side. But Allen though. Ah there's only Ken everywhere as far as the eye may see except there is 1 allen and Allen was as as Rachel mentioned Ken's best friend. Do you want to tell us more about allen.

01:11:08.16
Rachel _any_all_
Of meat. Yes I do I'd love to. Ah he can wear all of Kin's clothes ah Allen is the only entity of his kind in all of Barbie land. And he also has sentience beyond the plot he addresses the narrator directly he is on a multidimensional joy ride through Barbie land and he and he just wants to escape Barbie land but he's. The best guy like he's he's the he's the ally like for real I don't want to be like he's an ally but he's an ally he gets it. He sees to the core of what's going on because he could hear the narrator he is. He is truly unplugged from the matrix. It is.

01:11:46.14
Jala
The hair.

01:12:00.83
Rachel _any_all_
Phenomenal. Ah, and Michael said is so good in it. He's so good in the role. He's just so dry. It's perfect.

01:12:05.60
Jala
Yeah, there's oh go ahead.

01:12:08.80
Juliet St_ Moon
Yeah, ah, alllan might be my favorite character. He's just incredibly sweet just the um I think what's really funny is like I don't know how I don't know what their sizes in real life are but like he could he can.

01:12:13.49
Rachel _any_all_
Oh my God What is what a pure being.

01:12:26.31
Juliet St_ Moon
Fit all of Ken's clothes when it's like he is so small compared to or looks so small compared to just about every other ken in that movie. It's like he's he's just a real sweetie and.

01:12:33.97
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, you.

01:12:36.85
Jala
Well, the the time that Allen like because you see him on the beach briefly but then Alan reappears right? about the time that Barbie has talked to Ken about patriarchy and tried to turn everything around and then failed to do so and then. All of ah like Gloria and Sasha and everybody are going to go ahead and go to the real world and just leave Barbie land and they're in the car they are heading back to the real world and then they find out that Alan is stowing away because he needs to escape Barbie land at all costs. And ah so like then there's like this whole altercation where like they're trying to you know like the that the kens are trying to stop the barbies or Barbie and Gloria and whoever from leaving. And then Allen gets into a whole fight with them and he says all of hit the taglines from the box that he was manufactured in he wears all of Ken's clothes and whatever and like it says all all of his taglines are from the box that the doll was was.

01:13:32.10
Rachel _any_all_
You up. There's all of things closed.

01:13:41.35
Jala
Put in when it was manufactured way back in the day and it's just this very great scene. But yeah, like he's definitely the ally character he is a real bro. Um, we love Alan we stand Alan Allen is the best. So.

01:13:58.61
Jala
Ah, after that scene though, the Barbie and the others decide that they need to go back and Allen's like what because he had just you know, beat up everybody and was like trying desperately to help them escape and to get out himself and then they turned around to go back.

01:14:15.60
Jala
So poor Allen at poor allen yeah I am absolutely so so the barbies are deprogrammed when Gloria is giving her speech to them.

01:14:18.99
Rachel _any_all_
Um, Mar Allen justice for Allen frankly get him out of there. He'll want to be there. Get him out.

01:14:34.83
Jala
And then they all decide that they are going to manipulate the kens to fight amongst themselves because all of the kens decide that they want to sit on the beach with a guitar and sing I want to push you around and they all want to sing it to barb. But then they, they're all going to get up all the different barbies are going to get up and then go to a different ken from the one that they came to the beach with and this ends up starting a Ken war on the beach which is phenomenal.

01:15:08.31
Jala
Those sounds make me feel like you have something to say about it.

01:15:11.82
Rachel _any_all_
It just I just remembered that the water isn't real so they're just running on the plastic water and I remember that like Ryan Gosling like runs full force into this stationary wave. Oh this movie's so good because it's.

01:15:31.24
Rachel _any_all_
So stupid. That's so that's so stupid y'all. That's so so the wave is just a just literally a piece of plastic doesn't move it. It's the best it rules this movie is incredible. Thirteen nine to 10 ah, water isn't real.

01:15:50.21
Jala
Well and then too like the whole epic battle between the Kens is so funny because of all the stuff they're throwing at each other and everything. It's just a lot of nonsense.

01:16:01.70
Rachel _any_all_
Um, it's beautiful. It's a beautiful fight sequencequins on fake water.

01:16:06.46
Jala
Yes, and um, like they're they're having this whole thing and they're trying to turn the kens against each other so that they do not show up to vote because the next day they're supposed to go and vote to have patriarchy in Barbie Land forever or to get rid of it. And so the barbies intend to show up and vote and they want the kens to not vote and so they're going to distract them by having them fight amongst themselves. So ah, they do this and the barbies do show up while the kens are all distracted fighting each other the barbies all go. And vote and then they get rid of patriarchy and bring Barbie Land back to its normal positions of power and so that that keeps the kens from altering the constitution. Basically.

01:16:58.37
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, so the barbies do a voter suppression and the kids do a musical number in response ah to everything. It's my whole heart.

01:17:01.35
Jala
Yes, they do I know it's so good. The the I'm just can Yes, it's great. Yes.

01:17:11.42
Rachel _any_all_
On and it may I ah this movie loves movies and it loves old school hollywood musical movies. The fact that they do this incredible dance number on this sound stage. It's it's. Giving the old bing Crosby white Christmas singing in the rain like splendor of that old classic hollywood and this is a musical number. It's not just it's not just a needle drop. It's not just a little music video. It is a song. That is highly emotional that perpetuates the plot in a forward direction. It doesn't bring it to a halt. There is a resolution within the song that ends the Ken war because the Kens have reached such an emotional zenith they have to sing about it that is the entire point. Of musicals as an art form and this movie is doing it and it is doing it. Well this movie loves movies and I love this movie.

01:18:15.79
Jala
And the I'm just Ken is so great and the thing about it. The little bit of trivia that I love is the fact that this song almost was not in the movie. It was written as a joke and the guy who wrote it you know sent it to Greta Gerwig who was like ah that's pretty funny. You know and that that was all it was meant to be but Ryan Gosling got ahold of it and was like oh no, this is integral to Kenda as a character we have to have this in the movie and he performed it because you know he he's the one who sings it? Um. He performed it and when he did it was so good and it was you know so important like he he argued to keep it in the movie and so it's because Ryan Gosling took it and ran with it that we have that song and that musical number and all of that I don't know what they would have done.

01:19:03.18
Jala
Without that at that point to be honest.

01:19:07.75
Rachel _any_all_
I Mean they were already sitting on a really fun fight scene. You know it it I think it it could have survived ah but I'm so glad that it thrives with this. You know it it just it ratchets everything up to like the next.

01:19:25.20
Rachel _any_all_
Level which makes a lot of sense because of course Barbie Land would be a land where musicals happen. There's the song pink that it plays that is completely self-aware of what's going on on screen because everything is very on the nose. It's the whole point of Barbie land. It would it wouldn't make sense. But them not to have a musical number. You know this is all this is all fanciful and fantastical in like this like next level this like hyper hyper saccharin universe so it. It makes perfect sense.

01:20:01.10
Jala
Well and then too. It's like um, just the way that the whole opening of the movie where pink is playing and then like the barbies are in their their dream houses and they're waking up and then they're just like floating down from like their their houses that don't have walls stuffling that.

01:20:01.46
Rachel _any_all_
It's incredible.

01:20:20.39
Jala
You know because like they get picked up and and set in their car or whatever and it's very good and just like the way that they walk and the way that they move and the way that they sit and everything. It's all very much you know, um, just like.

01:20:34.20
Jala
This is a girl playing pretend and like it's it's going with that notion of there is somebody in the real world who is playing with these dolls and that's why they're moving around and stuff and like that's a very cool like there's there's a lot of layers of what's going on here and it's just like juggling so many different levels simultaneously in such a great.

01:20:53.69
Jala
Fashion. So um, when they vote out the male male domination they barbies also realize that they have to ah update their constitution and everything to treat the kens more fairly because they have not. You know had a ah good societal system that is equal for everyone. It's mostly the barbies. So um, they try to bring in the outcast dolls and the kens and everything and then Barbie and Ken apologize to each other and acknowledge their failings and Ken. But like there's so much that like I'm I'm summarizing in just like a few few sparse words we will sit with it in more detail. All of these different things in just a moment Ken bemoans that he has no identity or purpose without Barbie and Barbie encourages him to find his own identity. And Barbie who remains unsure of her own purpose and identity ends up meeting the spirit of the Mattel Co -founder ruth handler again ah this is the lady that she met in the mattel building and then ruth explains to barbie that barbie's story has no set ending in her ever evolving history. Surpasses that of her roots. So barbie decides to become human and go to the real world and sometime later gloria her husband and sasha take barbie now going by the name barbara handler to her first gynecologist appointment and that's where the movie ends. So um, real quick just a ah nonsense.

01:22:24.95
Jala
Thing I know ah in the part where it shows Gloria's husband that's actually America ferrera's husband who's playing her husband in the movie. Yes, yes, so um.

01:22:33.99
Rachel _any_all_
So it's great. Smoothie's great.

01:22:39.40
Jala
There's a lot of different parts moving parts to like the end of this movie. A lot of people have a lot of emotional things going on Barbie has an emotional point. Ah what I was half expecting to have happen is Barbie and Ken come together and be a couple I am very glad they didn't do that? Um Ken doesn't know what to do. He's very codependent. He does it because. That's how he was made right? He was made to be codedpendent on burbie he doesn't know how to be himself. Yeah, right? so ah so yeah like ah Juliet I know that there's some stuff that you wanted to mention about how.

01:23:04.78
Rachel _any_all_
It's what he was made for you might say thanks Billy.

01:23:18.87
Jala
Ken doesn't realize how patriarchy also suppresses hint like himself and like he's he's sort of it's not said in those words but he's kind of realizing that at the end of the movie like when he drops his act. And he he drops the patriarchy and he's like I just honestly don't know what to do.

01:23:39.81
Juliet St_ Moon
So yeah, there's like this whole like you know a thing in the mill of the movie where like you know he he he explicitly says at 1 point that you know oh well I couldn't really you know. I couldn't you know like I couldn't you know cut it with patriarchy in the real world but I can totally just make patriarchy work back at home basically and what what he kind of fails to realize there is that when he's in the real world and despite him like benefiting from the patriarchy just for being a man. He's also very very very very very suppressed by it because he doesn't have any of the like you know, privileges and talents and you know just kind of like social capital that you know is kind of required under patriarchy to be to thrive and he instead of kind of realizing that. Hey maybe this is a huge problem that's going to bite me in the ass later. He just kind of goes. oh oh s so big deal I'll just go back I'll just bring patriarchy home and you know if I'm at the top of the patriarchy then it's all going to be fine basically like which I don't which that that that feels that. Feels intentional but the movie barely you know touches on that bit there in a way I thought that was interesting and then of course at the very end. You know when you know everything falls apart and it's like you know what I hate this anyway and like it doesn't sound like sour grapes. It just sounds like I'm being yet, you know what I hate this and this and this and this.

01:25:06.98
Juliet St_ Moon
You know, aspect of you know, being control and so on like I'm not cut for it. You know.

01:25:08.95
Jala
Well.

01:25:10.90
Rachel _any_all_
Did It's not as Horse Centric as I thought it was going to be I'm not just interested honestly real talk not enough horses in this patriarchy for me I'm get it I'm good. Thanks for doing the voter suppression I'm good.

01:25:27.11
Jala
Right? Well and the thing about it is that the way that it gets displayed like when Barbie comes back and Kens have taken over and they're all partying and whatever is that all of them are performing masculinity. Ah very hard.

01:25:43.34
Jala
You know, trying very hard to perform masculinity as much as possible and there's a moment where Margot Robbie is is really sad and upset and distraught and Ken you know Ryan Gosling is looking at her and you can see in in Ken's face you know he's. Feeling bad about it but he's got his walls up and he's in his you know performative masculinity mode because all his bros are there and he turns her away even though like that's not what he wanted to do in that moment.

01:26:17.34
Jala
And so he was stuck in his role as well because you know he brought it there and then he was in front of his you know Bros and that was what he was going to do because um, we've talked about it before on the episodes about masculinity. But so much of toxic masculinity the way that it is presented. Um, in in this movie and and other places in the way that it is out in the real world is performative for other men. It's not about showing off for women. It's not about you know the women at all. It's about performing for other men and. Reaching the expectations of manhood in the eyes of other men. So the fact that Ken is doing this and Ken turns away Barbie and acts like this in front of the other men and then like all the other men are also doing it and then none of them realize that they don't really want to do it in the first place. Um, that's real. You know, um, it's not sat with in this movie as much as the tones of you know, ah focusing on what it's like to be a woman the disparity between what Barbie thought being a woman meant versus the reality of what a being a woman meant but it's there. And I like the fact that it is in there. It is approached a lot of how it's treated is not treated in words it is in the delivery of the performance by the actors and actresses. So.

01:27:50.55
Jala
So yeah let's go ahead and move on to discussion questions about this movie. So um, basically these discussion questions come up because when I was doing some research I found that there were various things that people were discussing about this movie. So I wanted to bring them up and you know sit with them here with everyone so an article that I pulled up from feminist puts forth the idea that this movie is specifically a white feminist movie. Um, there is even a point in the film where Sasha calls Barbie White savior Barbie but it also falls down in terms of intersectionality. So ah, the way that this this article is presenting. It is okay, there's a transgender actress as Dr Barbie there's a lesbian actress as weird Barbie there is black president Barbie and so on but all of them except for one is thin. And all of them lack any sort of accent or cultural representation. They all sound like middle american barbie you know, ah, there's ah, a barbie in a wheelchair but she's only in the dance scene and then is never seen again. There is no queer representation in the character development and so on and so forth. So ah, there's also an insensitivity to indigenous folks when the kens takeover there's a line in the movie comparing it to the smallpox epidemic startup by colonizers. Um, so the indigenous community was very upset by this because it's insensitive and that line really didn't even need to be in the movie.

01:29:27.39
Jala
And that's what was upsetting to them now. Um my own personal take on this. So. It's true that they have a lot of characters that are there for being on screen for a second and they are not pivot points upon which the plot turn. But. This movie is already handling so many different things that I don't know that it has enough room to really fit because they would have to fit in another character to make that workout with the story that they were trying to present with the the bread and butter can and barbie.

01:30:03.53
Jala
So like they do have their their characters for the real world Sasha and Gloria are hispanic so they do have that representation and that was not mentioned in that article whatsoever.

01:30:17.93
Jala
Among the barbies. Yes, they're there but they're not the the main barbie because again like this movie is trying to deal with like the first Barbie and Ken if you will like the the default setting.

01:30:26.35
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, the thing that sort of is like when you conjure in your mind the image of Barbie what do you see? So it must be essentially like the avatar of all Barbie you know so it.

01:30:45.60
Rachel _any_all_
Since it needs to be such a personal story. It's it's kind of a miracle. They include so many barbies initially you know Dr Barbie president Barbie you know, ah because it it could have gotten very like 1 Barbie one Ken centric.

01:31:03.36
Rachel _any_all_
But it's really it's it's showing what it has the capacity to do and with what capacity it is doing it. It is trying to be thoughtful about like what does Barbie represent who can represent Barbie everybody's Barbie and I think the fact that like so much of that intentionality of showing that Barbie is anyone. Anything yada yada gives it gives it license to push back against maybe like an argument of tokenism because we are doing so much in such a in such a way that other that other movies in the current landscape aren't achieving this. They definitely aren't you know? um.

01:31:42.40
Rachel _any_all_
So I think given that this this movie is trying to critique about a culture while also being a part of that culture. It is going to be a flawed representation of that and it is going to fall short on certain things. But I think when we when we talk about the subjectivity of art is important to look at a piece as a whole and go hey what was. The intention behind this like what are we trying to say and these pieces coming together in sort of a media literacy landscape go we're we're we're trying to push as far as we can. There's only so far we can go. Under the constraints that we have to attain because again even though this is a piece of art and this can be something that is making a statement about patriarchy and womanhood under a patriarchal society and how our genders are enforced on us. You know all while still having to I don't know make a profit.

01:32:36.27
Rachel _any_all_
Make a board happy. It's kind of incredible that they're able to thread this needle and I think even if a piece of art has many flaws and does not necessarily have the option to age. Well you know I'm thinking about meme girls from 2004 and how it. It has a lot of moments that are very off color today and we're off color at the time but we allowed it in in the landscape we were in but it still is an incredible piece as a whole and the intention of again dissecting like what it is to operate. Under a a a toxic societal landscape be it Klick culture in high school you know and how do we push back against that I think if you're if you're trying to look at like what are the themes. What's the message even if it is imperfect. It is still trying to push our narrative a little further as. Ah, a culture because we are going to have discussions about it. You know and and and can can see where we need to go but we can also see like what we're progressing toward. You know if if any of that makes sense. Sorry I'm off my soapbox I have a lot of thoughts.

01:33:44.91
Jala
Um, yeah, ah, no, no, please do because like a lot of that is stuff that I was definitely wanting to bring up as well. Um, because like. As much as yes I can see how someone who is you know sitting with a lack of representation would feel I mentioned at the top of the episode I was not big into Barbie because the brunette character was the side character. It wasn't you know the big main barbie at least not for a long time and you know that kind of thing. So like that that representation ah matters to folks and you know so yes I can understand the criticism but also I I like again like you said it can be flawed but also still be worthy in its own right? for the thing that it is trying to do. And it is being inclusive as best it can while still trying to push the the story that Greta Gerwig was trying to tell in the first place. So um I think too there might be concern Greta probably had some concern um with. Trying to write in characters of a kind of culture group or whatever that she herself does not belong to um, you know because then you get into a whole landmine of this is a black person written by a white lady.

01:35:14.41
Jala
Or whatever that that kind of thing where then it becomes well then that's also can be problematic in its own right? Um, not having those experiences to speak to and then trying to write that character. So um, you know like I I don't necessarily see it as you know ape.

01:35:32.23
Jala
Problem per se in in the terms of like oh I ding this movie I Harshly criticize this movie because of this this aspect like it was so ambitious with what it was trying to present. And how many different balls it had in the air at the same time that it was juggling without dropping one. Um that it's It's hard to say Well why didn't you juggle 3 more you know. So um, that's ah.

01:36:03.31
Jala
To say that like you know in in 1015 years time I I might look back at this movie and go you know, maybe there would have been a way or whatever but like you know as of this particular moment like I can't it's doing so many different things and does have to please the board and does have to you know ah pander enough to Mattel. With the the um ineffectual but still not horrible. Goons. Um, it has to do some some pandering a little bit in order to get made in order to be a success and it was a success like um.

01:36:38.21
Rachel _any_all_
Boom.

01:36:39.57
Jala
The last I looked it was near a billion. Did it make a billion. Yeah like wild wild. So ah Juliet what did you think about like um so so feminism.

01:36:43.50
Rachel _any_all_
I think it did make a billion pretty sure. Yeah.

01:36:58.61
Jala
Feminism is not just like for women. Feminism is meant to free everyone. It's kind of the whole concept of like um, you know if 1 of us isn't free then none of us is free. You know, kind of solidarity piece. So um.

01:37:18.51
Jala
About the question of feminism. What? what? Julia? What do you think about Um, because I know you were thinking about the patriarchy stuff and the suppression on Ken's all the kens and everything. Um, how do you think. Of this movie in terms of like the the presentation of what they were trying to say with that like do you think it could have gone further. Do you think it did a good job. Ah, what do you think.

01:37:47.66
Juliet St_ Moon
So It That's a really tricky one um like it like I suppose it could have gone further but I also think that like they. I Don't think getting too deep in the sauce of of the topics was going to really happen in a big Blockbuster Hollywood movie for general audiences like I know that sounds like kind of like.

01:38:19.10
Juliet St_ Moon
Like like an excuse for like dumbing down a topic but you know the reality is is that it's a movie about Barbie like and like I feel like I mean we we really talked earlier about how like making sequels to this sounds like misguided. But. Like you know if they did want to make sequels and they did want to make them interesting. They could make them. You know, go deeper into those topics. Especially if we like especially if you know they end up like kind of navigating like you know Barbie as a human in the real world dealing with the struggles of being a woman in the real world. Like you know and so on and so forth like you know Barbie becomes antifa Barbie or whatever and and and and it's just like it's just strange because like on one hand. Yeah I would I would always love a much you know deeper poll on these topics. But also i.

01:39:12.97
Juliet St_ Moon
Don't I can't really blame them at all for like kind of sticking where they did where it's almost like in a way it's and that's the other thing like like I would still say it's a bit more than like feminism 1 on one you know like like it does go a bit further.

01:39:28.20
Juliet St_ Moon
Then the kind of really like popcorn feminism 1 to one that we see like in a lot of other movies. So like it's already kind of like batting you know above that it just didn't go like really deep into the gritty about it because you know it's still a. Movie by mass market children's property that you need to have a you know happier ending.

01:39:46.78
Jala
Right? right? And here's the thought that I was having um since the time that I first watched this movie which is so ah, we've had a lot of stuff coming up in our society about. Masculinity and like the hyper like you you're Andrew Tateson your your what have yous that are trying to sell like alpha mail or whatever to people. Um, you know, disillusioned men and young young men and boys and things like that and I'm thinking about it. In terms of the movie and what it's doing with the patriarchy part and how I mentioned that a lot of the delivery of what it has to say is in the nuance of performance and I wanted to. Bounce it off y'all do you think that if it had dug into patriarchy more you know verbally and frontally would that have even flown I don't know that. American society the way that it is now at least mainstream american society I don't know how ready it is to actually confront the face of what patriarchy does to men.

01:41:10.30
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, no, you can already. You can see in sort of the reactionary backlash in reception to this movie this movie that just goes hey maybe patriarchy, not great. Ah. The fact that the response has been so pearl clutching and this is ruinous. You know you know you know the playbook get righteously angry about anything and everything it's It's all by it's all by design over there but just to like see that backlash. There's no way. There's no way it could have been biting or hyper realistic also as as Juliet said it is about a doll a plaything.

01:42:02.30
Rachel _any_all_
Um, if I know we we we haven't really talked about the the barbinheimer of it all but did you want Barbie to be Oppenheimer like is that what you need I'm deeply confounded but the fact that you can tell.

01:42:19.79
Rachel _any_all_
A meaningful story within the bounds of essentially an all ages comedy. You know I think that is a great way to start delivering a message to start a conversation like artists objective and that's what's great about it. It's here for conversations.

01:42:34.19
Jala
Yeah, yeah, so I was just thinking about it in terms of like when people critique this movie and they're saying well it's not intersectional enough or it only it doesn't really talk about the patriarchy stuff. Verbally it's only. You know, just like bringing it up and and leaving it to the performance for you to figure out and unpack if you want to and all of this and and people analyzing that and like you know, yes, there's a certain degree to which it's like yeah absolutely like this is a movie about a doll. What were you wanting it to be. You know? um. For sure for sure a hundred percent on board with that. But then 2 it's also like I believe that the people who made this movie also realize that society isn't isn't ready at this point. Ah by and large not not for a blockbuster. Hollywood movie with a massive. Um, you know like Mattel like I don't think Mattel would have been on board if if Greta Gerwig had dug into patriarchy you know, yeah, could be.

01:43:40.97
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, and also that may not be exactly where Greta's politics lie like this may be very abundantly like as far toward any any push against center or right that she's going to go. You know that there's.

01:43:54.70
Jala
Yeah, absolutely.

01:43:59.40
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, also because remember Greta is an incredibly wealthy woman it it it does it does put her in a different class and puts her closer to power. So don't forget also don't forget that so yeah it maybe it's not intersectional enough.

01:44:07.24
Jala
Yeah, absolutely.

01:44:16.81
Rachel _any_all_
You're asking a rich white woman I don't I don't know y'all I Maybe think about that Maybe think think about that just a little bit. You know it it and it doesn't have again. It doesn't have to be perfect. It can be subjective and it can be flawed because it is going to.

01:44:34.15
Rachel _any_all_
Once again, be a contributor in a larger conversation that hopefully will push the needle more toward intersectionality in the future. You know you got is got star somewhere.

01:44:45.39
Jala
Yeah, absolutely. So um, the next question that I have is Mattel being presented as sort of real sort of fantastical like the actual building. The place Mattel. Ah, but the executive officers are all very cartoonish. They're only concerned with making money and so on because capitalism. Um I was I will say I was floored by the fact that they actually presented the Mattel people is literally only caring about making money and that it actually got made I was so surprised I was like I can't believe they approved this to be in the movie. Be actually? um, but anyway, ah, do you do you all have thoughts about just like their role in the film concerning the major dilemma in the plot or any of that like it's they're there. Um, they're kind of like just driving people forward at a rush but like. You know they're they're not really, they're not really super plot important.

01:45:54.73
Jala
You have the capitalism drove driving the sales particularly of the patriarchy Ken dolls. So like that is mentioned that there's patriarchy Ken in the real world when Ken has taken over Barbie Land it also drove Mattel's acceptance at the very end of the movie for ordinary Barbie which is something that Gloria suggests she says how about we just make ordinary Barbie and then will ferrell turns to his goons and then says.

01:46:26.59
Jala
What about this idea and they're like it's it'll make a lot of money. Yes, we will make an ordinary barbie so you know it's just self-serving third party. That's all that it is. It's it's capitalism is not being portrayed in necessarily a negative light. It's just you know, ah that the Mattel people are only making.

01:46:46.33
Jala
Kind of goofy decisions based on just whether or not it's going to make money and they're just comic relief for me.

01:46:57.64
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, and I'd also say in their portrayal being so samey and so like a massive goon like a face almost like yes will Ferrell is like the face of all this, but it's a very faceless very non genuine. Very artificial look and that's kind of interesting because if you wanted to sort of interpret that as sort of like the system is going to system no matter who's sitting on the top of it. You know it doesn't it doesn't really matter I mean obviously yes like we have we have built. Our current society around favoring like heteronormativity and whiteness and all of that. But it's still like a mechanism and you can sort of see even when you get intersectionality into the mechanism. It still kind of continues to mechanism. So I think it's. An interesting choice that they're not very active. Not that they're not active I mean they go all the way to Barbie land but that they're not actively this sort of antagonist directly but sort of an antagonist in theme.

01:48:07.50
Jala
Yeah, yeah.

01:48:11.65
Rachel _any_all_
You know I think that I think that is a that is ah that is definitely a choice that is being made but also at the end will Ferrell's character does go I I'm in this business to make little girls dreams come true. So it's still ah, a bit of metalel apology. Yeah at the same time.

01:48:24.39
Jala
Yeah, listen.

01:48:29.77
Rachel _any_all_
Can be lots of things. Things aren't binary. Hello. My name is Rachel I am I am also non-binary. Let's really think about that. Ah yeah, so I think it's. Ah, smartly done way to criticize without getting in trouble for criticizing.

01:48:48.16
Jala
Yeah, yeah, because it's like it's it's definitely appeasing Mattel but it's also like trying to make a point at the same time you know and um, again like I was just really surprised that it came out it. It was allowed you know.

01:49:06.20
Jala
I'm I'm surprised that the board of of people looking at this movie. Let that be there. But.

01:49:11.24
Juliet St_ Moon
And it's it's kind of what I was getting at earlier with how like Mattel is portrayed because it it feels like of all the swings and of all the very like pointed remarks this movie makes like everything involving like Mattel itself feels like honestly like. Kind of gutless in comparison. You know like it's like they're they're they're allowed to say they're allowed to say like that like the tiniest little implication but also it's got be light enough that it can be instantly written off as entirely just a joke and not at all representative of Mattel. Like in any real way shape or form or.

01:49:52.22
Jala
Um, so how do you feel about Barbie choosing to become a real woman at the end and how Gloria's story kind of ends.

01:50:10.30
Rachel _any_all_
I mean for me, it's kind of the whole point that Barbie continues forward because she is one of the protagonists of this movie I think you could argue that ah can. Gloria and Barbie are protagon us in this movie but she is having the coming of age transformation and how is she going to have her coming of age transformation if she doesn't transform she can't go back that she has to she at at the end she's wearing a pink burkin stock. She had no choice. This was her.

01:50:43.51
Jala
Yeah, absolutely.

01:50:44.67
Rachel _any_all_
This This was her journey. It was always meant to be this way because she had she had to grow and she had to evolve. There was no other option so come on come on babies the Heroes Journey let's go.

01:51:00.23
Jala
Um, yeah, absolutely I Like the fact that she's going to the gynecologist at the end to signal that she's a real woman you know like.

01:51:06.38
Rachel _any_all_
It's perfect.

01:51:07.78
Jala
You know she's a woman now. She's not a doll so that means that that comment that she made earlier about not having Genitalia is no longer applicable. Um, that's that's a very smart way of doing it to where you can put it into like a a movie that a kid can be in and they just won't understand what that is about you know.

01:51:26.19
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah, yeah.

01:51:27.49
Jala
So and that's fine. So yeah, but like ah Gloria she she ended up getting her ordinary Barbie made but like she's not getting any extra compensation or anything that seems to be noted in the movie. But um, she is unified with her daughter again at least and um. You know the world itself didn't change or anything but Barbie is now in the world with her and you know like her family is kind of like brought back together again because the 1 thing I want to say is that um Gloria and Sasha's relationship is shown in a very like a very real. Real down-to-earth way. It's not like the hollywood exaggerated version where it's like the kid just has to constantly antagonize the mom and like hate on her and this that and the other because that's what it started to look like right when you first see Sasha and she's being all like you know, pissy about everything. But then like you see that? No, she really does care for her mom and you know she's just a tween slash early teen or whatever and um, their relationship is is presented in a way that is very feels very real. And in a way that I don't really see in movies very often. They kind of um say oh this is the the archetype right? The archetype is that this is a teenager so that means that this is an antagonistic relationship because that's how we've set this character up to be and.

01:52:53.67
Jala
You know Sasha herself does some growing even though it's like in the background. So um, you know like that's also very important as well. But.

01:53:04.37
Rachel _any_all_
Yeah there's a beautiful moment where even in her like angsty ways she says I love your drawings. They're so weird you know and just the look on Gloria's face it's such a real moment. You know I think that is. Ah, deeply real I I mean I don't have kids. Ah so I can't really speak to the feeling of what that is, but it's like I have a cat and sometimes my cat will just give me like a look of just like I love and appreciate you and it's like you feel it in your soul and like Gloria feels that. Compliment in her soul because she is very unsure of where her relationship stands with her daughter. It's gorgeous. It's gorgeous. It happens in the car. Gorgeous.

01:53:48.56
Jala
Um, yeah, so um, about America ferrera's whole speech and like um, there's something from a book I was reading today as of the day we're recording. Ah, from can't even how millennials became the burnout generation by Anne Helen Peterson so ah tell me if this sounds kind of familiar and kind of like the Barbie Speech we should work hard but exude work-life balance. We should be incredibly attentive mothers but not helicopter ones we should engage in equal partnerships with our wives but still maintain our masculinity. We should build our brands on social media but live our lives. Authentically we should be current conversant. And opinionated about the breakneck news cycle but somehow not let the reality of it affect our ability to do any of the above tasks trying to do all that at once with little support or safety net. That's what makes millennials the burnout generation I think part of the the reason why I bring this up. Um, this this book. Um, can't even it was written in 2020 so before the Barbie movie and the thing about it is part of the reason why the speech is so impactful for so many people even though they may or may not be a signed female at Birth is because.

01:55:09.92
Jala
It speaks to everybody's experience like you can insert different words and still get that same thing you know like this this book about Burnout is talking about how our entire generation feels essentially that ah contradictory expectation and so that's something that's just. Really cool, but um, so we already talked about our favorite scenes. So like I think everybody said that their favorite scene was the scene with the old lady on the bench then.

01:55:42.55
Rachel _any_all_
Yes.

01:55:45.17
Jala
Juliet same for you as well. Awesome. So then what is your kind of like final takeaway for the movie Rachel's going to say it's 14 out of 10 at this point.

01:55:46.25
Juliet St_ Moon
Yeah, that's my favorite scene by far. So.

01:55:59.74
Rachel _any_all_
80000 out it to it's about an infinity out of 10. It's so it's it's so smart. It's so kind. It's it's so pretty to look at I can't. I can't knock this movie I can't I I super duper can't and I I I can completely see and understand and can see the subtext the the the fallings the the the failures of this piece to. To to fit everybody but I really commend it so hard for trying and also for being this really idiosyncratic piece that made so much money I just really want us to learn the lesson and like things can be very successful. And very specific and very personal and we can tell a story without spoon feeding everything because we are we are creative minds and we can interpret and what's great about art. Is that it is interpretable and you can read this movie as a coming of age story. You can you can read it as a trans narrative you can you can read it as as an adventure story. You can. You can read it so many different ways it is being Barbie and Barbie is everybody.

01:57:26.80
Rachel _any_all_
And this movie is everything and it is everyone and if and if it isn't and if it isn't you to a perfect degree. It isn't mean to a perfect degree either and nothing that is art should be. We should find all of ourselves and none of ourselves in it that is. That was not very short I'm sorry I feel a lot of feelings about this movie.

01:57:45.39
Jala
That is. It's great. It's great now I just feel like a mic drop I don't know. Okay, so um, my only follow up would be I Wish this movie had come out when I was a kid although that couldn't have happened but like um.

01:57:57.89
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, yeah.

01:58:00.20
Jala
I Wish this was around when I was a younger person because like this feels like it would be so formative to me if I had been able to like I mean it's already still a formative movie but like um if it had come out when I was still in the the developmental stage of my personality and everything um I feel like this would have been so impactful.

01:58:19.92
Jala
And so important to me. Um Juliet final thoughts.

01:58:24.82
Juliet St_ Moon
I I mean I mean let's be real. It's It's no Barbiean princess in the paupper but it is pretty good.

01:58:36.14
Jala
Ah, that is that is very good. Um I Just wonder.

01:58:37.33
Rachel _any_all_
Nothing can be.

01:58:37.42
Juliet St_ Moon
And look Barbie Barbie and princess in the paupper has a male Calico I mean how how many how many can can can can barbie 23 say that I don't think it can.

01:58:50.20
Rachel _any_all_
No I don't think there's a single cat in this movie. Ah, that's I take back everything I've ever said. That's nice about this movie. This is worst movie ever.

01:58:51.80
Jala
Ah, oh my no there's not not 1

01:59:01.78
Juliet St_ Moon
This cat girl barbie.

01:59:03.60
Jala
Ah, ah there you go? Oh I I just wanted to throw in one little little tiny trivia bit and then we'll wrap up here. So.

01:59:15.42
Jala
According to Ryan Gosling he accepted the role of Ken after seeing his daughter's Ken Doll lying face down in the mud next to a squished lemon. He then took a shot of the doll in the lemon and sent it to Gretta Gerwig saying I shall be your Ken his story must be told which is just a fantastic.

01:59:34.39
Rachel _any_all_
Perfection.

01:59:34.67
Jala
Story even if it's not real that'll that'll be my ah my real way that that ended so yes, um, that is all we've got for Barbie the movie. Fantastic time. Ah so.

01:59:50.59
Jala
Where in the world can people find you on the internet if you are to be found anywhere. Rachel.

01:59:56.94
Rachel _any_all_
Ah, please locate my shenanigans on social medias. Ah specifically Instagram you can find me at I am Rachel quirky ah, it's it's it's really, it's mostly my cat now. Frankly. Um, but you can also follow the wrestler I manage on Instagram at Charles stunning. Ah they are coming up in the world and actually you can if you want go to the. Ah. T two t wrestling academy Youtube page and watched Charles stunning fight real real wrestler title belt holding wrestler Cpa ah, it's a silly silly match. Ah and I will say Charles did enter to ah dance the night. Ah, in that Match. So the Barbie movie represented. It's not in the video sorry because obviously copyright music. But when you go watch the match know that charles entered to that do a lipa song. Um, because Charles is kind of like a punk rock Barbie but like a burlesque Barbie. So do with that way. You will I would love it if you I would love it if you watched it it. It. It's it's so weird. It's just.

02:01:09.23
Jala
There are a lot. There are a lot of of adjectives being thrown around in there. Um, send me the link I'll put it in the show notes for everyone so they can yes.

02:01:21.69
Rachel _any_all_
Cool. We'll do we'll do so that like just dropped like yesterday. So it's fresh on my mind and I keep going oh right? There's a Youtube video it exists. Yeah.

02:01:24.73
Jala
Absolutely.

02:01:32.50
Jala
Yay! Very cool, very cool and Juliet how about you where can people find you and if they can't find you because you're an internet cryptid then do you have anything you want to plug.

02:01:45.99
Juliet St_ Moon
So I'm Juliet saint moon um, you can find me at my house. No no, please don't do that. But.

02:01:51.53
Rachel _any_all_
Said you? ah.

02:01:53.53
Jala
Ah, right? right? You can find me anywhere that I can be found at jalachan including jalachan dot place where you got this episode and all of the other episodes. So thank you very much for listening. And until next time take care of yourself and remember to smile.

[Show Outro]
Jala
Jala-chan's Place is brought to you by Fireheart Media. If you enjoyed the show, please share this and all of our episodes with friends and remember to rate and review us on your podcast platform of choice. Word of mouth is the only way we grow. If you like, you can also kick us a few bucks to help us keep the lights on at ko-fi.com/fireheartmedia. Check out our other show Monster Dear Monster: A Monster Exploration Podcast at monsterdear.monster. Music composed and produced by Jake Lionhart with additional guitars and mixed by Spencer Smith. Follow along with my adventures via jalachan.place or find me at jalachan in places on the net!

[Outro Music]