Colin Wynn Gary, welcome to my podcast Moving Matters, it's a pleasure to have you on board. Gary Wheadon Thank you so much for inviting me, Colin, I feel honoured and humbled that you've asked me. Colin Wynn Can you tell everyone a little about yourself and the length of time in this industry? Gary Wheadon Um, well. My name is Gary Wheadon, but everybody knows me as Bert, primarily because of my surname. Bert Wheadon was a very famous guitarist. And when I played football, there was about three or four Gary's in the side. So obviously, if you see the name Gary on three or four different players, then it becomes a little bit difficult. So all my friends decided to call me Bert. So that's how everybody calls me, Bert. bizarrely enough, my niece didn't realise that my name was Gary until she was about nine or 10 when somebody called me Gary and she said, Who's Gary and I said, I am she said but your uncle Burt. No, no. I am Gary. So They say everybody knows me as Bert. I've been in the industry all my life. My father had a removal company. So I suppose you could say I'm second generation removal, man. Colin Wynn So that's how you got started in the industry. Did you? You went to work for your father's company? Gary Wheadon Yes. Yeah, I was. spent all my school holidays working with him and weekends. weekends were sometimes spent underneath the lorry with the jizer cleaning it all down or greasing the nipples to get the lorries all set and ready. So yeah, I was I was destined, I suppose you could say to be a removable man. There wasn't anything else really, that I could do. To be honest, I did have dreams of being a footballer, but you need talent for that. So I ended up in the removal industry Colin Wynn And your father's company, which isn't your company? Gary Wheadon No, my father's company is AW Wheadon limited and I left school when I was 15 and started working for him. I was picked up by my mother at two o'clock in the afternoon as they signed me out. And then half an hour later, I was over in Crawley working with him. Hmm so I've been in the industry all my life. The only other job I've ever done was a Sunday morning paper round. So I've done nothing else in my entire life apart from being in the removal industry. So it's been interesting, but yeah, I I worked my father until 1988. And then I left him and came to Sully's as the manager. And I got the job on the proviso that one day when the guy who owned the company, Geoff Revell, decided he was going to retire. I would actually buy him out, little did I realise 18 months later, he decided I want to retire. So Gary, can you buy me out? And it was just before the recession of 1990. So interesting times interesting times Colin. Colin Wynn But that was after 18 months of you working at Sully's, how long had you been working at your father's company? Gary Wheadon Oh, well I left school in 73. And I joined Sully's in 1988. So I've worked for the father for what, 15 years. Doing my apprenticeship, I suppose you could say Family businesses are great. The only problem is with family businesses. They are family. And I remember speaking to my father one day and saying to him, Look, I want to buy shares within the company because I want to have something that is tangible and is mine that I know is going to be mine. And I've got five brothers, and he turned around and said to me Look, he said this. There's six of you he said when I'm dead and buried the six of you can share it amongst yourselves. He said, But until then. No, he said, I'm keeping control. So I just decided right now it's time for me to move on. So I gave him notice and I would be looking for another job. I saw the job for the manager at Sully's being advertised and applied for the job came for a interview with Geoff Revell on the first of January 1988 sat down with him got on like a house on fire. And he phoned me up two days later and said, Listen, Gary jobs yours, say on the proviso that you buy me out when I decide to retire. So I came to Sully's as the manager in as I say I think it was about the 18th of January 1988. It was he must have seen something in me that others don't I must admit he was a very interesting character. Let me put it that way. Colin Wynn Not just your good looks then, Gary. Gary Wheadon Oh, wasn't my good looks or charm no no. Colin Wynn You own D Sully & Son? Gary Wheadon I do. Well, correction we do me and my wife. We're 50/50 partners. Colin Wynn And what services does the company offer? Gary Wheadon Well, we're just a small removal company. So we do house moving. We do small office moving. I'm not interested. Anything above 20 to 30 people in office. Two big not interested. We do house moving up to five, six bedroom houses. We can cope with that. We do storage. We do. We've got a little bit of crate hire just to do usual run of the mill stuff that a lot of removal companies do. But I say we're only a small company. So it it does it. It does for me put it that way. Colin Wynn And your father's company is still going? Gary Wheadon My father's company is still going the my three youngest brothers still run that Mark, Simon and Brady. They predominantly do European stuff to France and I think France and Spain i think is their two main places from what I can understand. They decided they didn't want to carry on working in this country. Doing removals in Great Britain I suppose you could say. Colin Wynn So having been in the industry for quite some time now then what challenges Have you had to overcome? Gary Wheadon Where can you start? Oh, technology technology drives me mad. I can't get to grips with it. I'm an old fashioned removal man. I just want to go out on the lorries I want to do my job, sitting down and having to do things electronically now just drives me mad. Although I do understand that things move forward. So therefore, you know, we have to have to go with it. That was one of the technical that's one of the things that drives me mad bureaucracies, another one that really gets me you just get used to certain legislation and that all changes. So having to get to grips with that. I think the other thing as well is being a small company, which predominantly my wife and a two or three guys that work for me is that I don't really have anyone to bounce things off within the company and I found that I've got two or three friends who have helped me out greatly over the years. I mean, one of them is Stuart Almandras. So, if I have an idea, I will bounce it off him and he he he has some wonderful insights to different things to bounce back and learn from. Another one is Ian Studd, Director General, I've got to know him quite well over the years. And David Bunting. Those three guys I put a lot of faith in and I do actually talk to them about my ideas and what I should do and what their thoughts are. Don't always listen to them, I must admit. But it's my decision at the end of the day, I suppose you could say. So yeah, those things I find challenging. The other thing is time factor. I'm terrible I spent so much time thinking about my business, rather than everything else that's going on around me, I suppose. to the detriment of my wife, I suppose she she's put up with a lot. She has put up with a heck of a lot with me. So she's she's been a saint. So that's just some of the challenges. Colin Wynn What about the pandemic? Gary Wheadon Oh, let's not go there with the pandemic. pandemic. Colin Wynn No, no, lets Gary Wheadon It's driven me mad. I've probably had a few days off to do a bit of the gardening the rest of the time has been trying to sort out the risk assessments and the method statements and sourcing the PPE and having labels and stickers done up to go on the vehicles. Just doing things on that and then you sit down and you think Have I Got This Covered? Have I got that covered? So the the instance stuff of the pandemic, the things that hit you straight away have taken a bit of time. Is it going to affect the industry moving forward? Yes, I think it will. I think for the next year or two, we will suffer quite a bit. Not just with the house moving market falling down. But also the way that we do moves. There's, I think it's going to be two camps of people that will be looking for removal companies. There will be those that are looking for the total bells and whistles that want you to arrive with the gloves and the sanitization, stuff and the masks and then you've got the others that say, I still want it done for three and six. And so I'm not really bothered about that. I've already had people say to me, oh, well, this COVID thing is gone now, isn't it? So what's the problem? And you just think, no, it hasn't gone away. It's still going to be here with us. He's going to be with us for a long time. And I think gradually people will move away from it. There will be the element of people that will say, Oh, forget it. Just move on. We just we just got to get the job done. So it's gonna be interesting times interesting times ahead of us, I think. Yeah. Colin Wynn So if you could change anything from the past? What would it be? Apart from playing football for Brentford, obviously, Gary Wheadon They just just turned me down. If I could change one thing from the past and it might seem bizarre. I would get rid of the 1968 transport act that completely did away with the A, B and C licences. bizarre. Yes. But that completely changed our industry. It moved us away from having a need for us to anybody can just join in. And once they had that, and they brought in the operator's licence, the world and his wife could be a removal man. And it killed our industry. I remember my father had 2 A licences and a B licence, and they were worth a fortune you had to prove that there was a need for you. And overnight, those licences that were worth thousands even back then were worthless. So if I could change one thing, I would shoot the person who actually introduced that law. Colin Wynn Not literally, hopefully Gary Wheadon Well, not literally not literally, metaphorically. Colin Wynn And what is your high point of being in the industry? I'm sure you have many, but what what high point would you would you take from this industry? Gary Wheadon Oh high point is a very difficult one. I mean, the obvious one is being becoming president of the association. I mean, that was an honour that I never ever, ever dreamed of in my entire life. It was so far back in the distant past that, you know, the BAR was something that, to be honest, was something I didn't really want to be a part of. I remember my father, he had the BAR come he wanted to actually apply it where he actually applied to join BAR and we had an inspection and I don't know who it was and if that person is listening now, I do apologise, but this snot nose spotty oyk turned up to inspector us. And he looked around and he looked at the back of the vehicle and he said, Oh, you haven't got 100 blankets all nicely folded up on the back there. And oh, you'll never be a BAR member. And my dad just turned around and said, Well, in that case you can .... off. And if that's what the BAR is about, I'm not interested. So it was not what you would call a good introduction to the BAR. On saying that though. One of my dad's best friends, was Aubrey Appleton, who was I think he was the MD Hoults back in the day and was very, very well known within BAR. So it was that cross over, I suppose you could say, of wanting to be part of BAR but then again, thinking well, if that's what you think of us, then sling your hook. So the notion of being a BAR member back Then when I was working with my dad was out the window, then when I came to Sully's Geoff Revell, one of the first things he said to me is, is you've got to go to BAR meetings, which I rolled my eyes and he said, don't do that loudly. I can hear it. And he made me go to a BAR meeting, and probably one of the best things he made me do. So actually getting into BAR area meetings and meeting people and talking to them and thinking to myself actually, this ain't bad actually, you know, there's there's a lot of people here with a lot of knowledge. So, you know, let's, let's tap into it. And this was in the southeast London area, which is now defunct unfortunately. And from there, I got the job as treasurer for a short while. And then unfortunately, the southeast London area folded due to members, amalgamating with other members. And I think it's when I first went there, there was about 30 to 40% Going to the meetings and you ended up with about six of us, which was basically me, Stuart Stewart's brother, and Jean and David Finch and Peter Snelling. I think that's about it really. And we just decided, right, that's it. So we folded. And then I think it was probably about four or five years later, I had a phone call from Jonathan Hood, who was talking about the Met area starting up again, and would we be interested in joining the Met area? I said, Yeah, fine, lovely. would love to. So that all got up again. And then I joined the Met area and then from the Met area, I then became chairman of the Met area. I've got no idea why I think I must have been away that day and they just put my name forward. So I couldn't vote against myself. And then went on to becoming a DED. Oh, that was that was an interesting discussion I had with Jonathan Hood. I phone him up and said to Jonathan, I said, Look, I'm thinking of putting myself forward as a D as one of the DED's. And he just said, dear boy, you are the type of member that we would love to have on the board. I said, Well, thank you very much, Jonathan. So I put myself forward. I remember, having the photograph taken up against the brick wall across the road from where we used to be in Cold Harbour Lane, and sending that in with my resume. And nobody was more surprised than myself when I had a phone call from Rob Syers saying, congratulations, Gary, you're on the board of BAR. And I thought, Oh, good grief, what's happened there? So I ended up as a DED and then as they say, the rest is history here. I am now as a past president or as a pop they know is called. And I don't think I could have got any higher within my industry. It was the ultimate accolade as far as I was concerned that people within the my industry were prepared to put me up there on a post to be shot at. Colin Wynn So DED, Directly Elected Director? Gary Wheadon That's correct. Colin Wynn For those that are listening and don't know what the DED is, which is obviously BAR. So there are am I right in saying three that are elected? Gary Wheadon There are three directly elected directors. When this was all first brought in. There were three, three of us that were elected, there was me, Brian Maidment and David Tracy. They, they'd be tracing and we were elected for two year term. And then at the end of the two year term, they would elect three more directly elected directors. As we went through the term it was suddenly realised Hang on a second, we could end up with quite a few people leaving the board in one hit at the end of one year. So it was then decided what we will do is we'll have it on a rolling basis. So it then meant one of us will do two years one of us will do three years, one of us do a fourth year to make things even out the one nominee who get elected to go onto the board. So, I think David said he was going to do two Brian said he would do three and I said, Okay, well, I'll do the fourth one. And then it just became a rolling thing. So now you have one nominee and one director joining the board each year. So you, you keep a upu keep the talent there, I suppose you could say to pass it on you. You don't lose half the board in one go. Colin Wynn And the role of a DED is what exactly? Gary Wheadon um, he is a conduit between the membership, no sorry an additional conduit between the membership and the board. I found I was getting people ringing me up, asking me questions that they didn't feel they could actually do through their national council member because National Council is One of the routes through to the board. However, there were people I found that would prefer to speak to somebody directly to take something to the board, or at least try and get some sort of answer to their query. Something that would be at board level. So it was an interesting role. The other thing as well was that you had to go to the areas. So we split the areas up. There's 16 areas, I think it is within the BAR. So we all took a certain number. I ended up with the most I also ended up with the ones the furthest I ended up with Northern Ireland and Scotland as well. So the idea was that we actually went to the areas we listened to the membership there. And we could also answer questions at area meetings. Colin Wynn Sounds like you had the longest term the furthest meetings to go to and the most meetings to go to Gary. Gary Wheadon Yes, I think you can I think if you could look at me, you'll see the word mug tattooed across my forehead. Colin Wynn Or I'm thinking short straw! Gary Wheadon That's way of describing it Yes. Colin Wynn Okay, so you're a DED you're there for four years. You don't go from DED to President so of the BAR so how did that happen? Gary Wheadon That's a very interesting story Colin. Colin Wynn Then our listeners are ready and waiting for you. Gary Wheadon I'd seen what the presidents have been going through. And I looked at I thought, do I need this hassle? No, I don't. And I've always said, No, not something for me. And when new names were being put forward, I put forward a couple of names myself people and just left it to the rest of the board. And then I was driving home one day and had a phone call from Stephen Vickers and he said to me, Gary said, I hope he can help you with help me. He said, I've, as you know, we're looking for a new vice president. And we've got all these names, he said, and some may be interested, but not at the moment, and others probably aren't suitable because they haven't really served any apprenticeship or they're too young. He said, we keep putting these names together. He said, but we keep coming up with the same name for one possible candidate, and I said, Who's that and he went, you and I went, you're joking. He went, No. He said, Now I know, you've said, you didn't want to do the job. He said, but I've been asked if I would approach you, and put it to you and see if you would be interested. So I said, Well, okay, well, yeah, thank you for asking me. You know, I'm totally shocked. Please, let me think about it. We had a brief discussion. And he said, Yeah, I said, Well, I'll get back to you in the next day or two. And we're walking indoors at home into the kitchen. And I looked at my wife and I said, Diane, you're not going to believe the phone call I've just had. And I recounted the story to her. And she looked at me and she said, Do you think you can do it? I went, yes. She said, You regret more in life, what you don't do than what you do. She said, Go for it. If you find that you can't do it, you just put your hands out and say, Look, it's beyond me. But if you don't do it, you will always regret it. You'll always be saying to yourself, could I have done it? Prove to yourself that you can do it. So I remember ringing Stephen up a couple of days later, and saying, All right, Stephen, let's go for it. Let's try it. So he said, Okay. He said, come in. He said, what we need to do he said. Just have a quick chat about what the job entails and We can we can go through any concerns you have. So I said Yeah, fine, no problems. So a few days later I went up to Watford and he took me out for sumptuous lunch at that wonderful chicken establishment that he loves. whose name I can't remember at the moment Colin, tell me please Colin Wynn It's not KFC is it? Gary Wheadon No, it's the other one that does all the piri piri chicken Colin Wynn Nando's? Gary Wheadon Nando's That's it, Yes. He said we'll go down Nando's. So I was actually interviewed in Nando's. And I remember sitting there and thinking himself. This is surreal. I'm being interviewed for the job as president the BAR sitting in Nando's eating Colin Wynn Having a Piri Piri sauce! Gary Wheadon Piri Piri sauce Exactly. Yeah. Boy, it was weird. We sat there for about an hour actually chatting about things. And I said yeah, I said, Yeah, everything sounds sounds tickety boo as far as I can see, I said. He said Do you have any questions yourself I said, One, I said, it's all very well, me taking this over. I said, but I'm concerned about what your plans are for the future. And I said, You know, I don't want to take this job on and then find, you know, a year or so down the line that you've decided you're going to move on, and I'm tasked with the job of trying to find a replacement for you. And he said, No, no, so I'm not going anywhere. He said, I'm quite happy here. So I'm going to see this through to my retirement. So I said, Okay, fine. As long as I know that I said, because I only run a very small business. I won't have time to actually try and find a replacement for you. So he said, No, no, I'm not going anywhere. So Fine. So yeah, took the job and I think we all know what happened after that. Yeah. Colin Wynn You were set up for that one Gary! Gary Wheadon I was definitely set up for that one. Yes. Yeah. Although I must admit he was absolutely apologetic and he said that the stars, all aligned and things were coming together and now is the perfect time within his family as well. And I fully understand it you know, it was one of those things. So it was I wished him good. Well, I tried to persuade him to stay, I must admit, on several occasions. However, he was adamant he was going, you know, and that there was nothing else. There was no other job. He hadn't been poached for another job. He said, you'll probably hear stories about me being poached to do other jobs, he said, but I can assure you, they are not true and. It was an interesting time. Interesting time. I would add Actually, I still converse with him. I still talk to him. I still text him. We still have the bit of banter about football. Actually moved him as well, bizarrely enough. But yeah, he's we still keep in touch. Colin Wynn So the presidency. Gary Wheadon Yeah Colin Wynn That's a one year term, I believe. But you have to do a one year vice presidency? Gary Wheadon No, no, Colin Wynn oh Gary Wheadon No, you do a two year vice presidency. And then you do a two year term as president. And then you just basically drop off to the end of the pier. And that's it. Thank you very much. Goodbye. I it was a it was a weird time. Weird time. Um, I was I as a lot of people know, I ended up doing three years. I did my two years as vice president. And then I did my two year term as the president. And Mark Herrington was my vice president, and he was due to take over from me. And I remember sitting in the BAR headquarters with Ian Studd. And we were having a meeting and there was me there was Ian, and there was Tony Tickner sitting in Ian's office and Mark walked in And he looked and he said, we need to have a discussion. Yeah. What's the problem? He said, I've left Pickfords. Right. So that means you can't be BAR president. And he went, No. Oh, heck. And I could see the faces of Ian and Tony. And I was thinking, I can't just walk away from this. So I look to them both. And I said, Look, if it helps, I'll do another year. And they said, Really? I said, Yep. I'm prepared to do another year. If it helps people out. So they both said Thank you for the offer. It's something we will look at. And at least it's something we have, I suppose you'd say in our back pocket. So yeah, they ended up taking my offer up and I did three years. And I gotta admit, the first two years you really feel you've got it. And you think, yep, my feet are under the table. I know what I'm doing. But the third year, it went very, very quickly. And I remember thinking, do you know, I think two years is enough for a president. You do think, yeah, there's a lot of things going on. And that third year was, it was an interesting year. But it was a nothing year, I suppose you could say. Although there was a heck of a lot that didn't get done. So it's, it was strange. It was very strange. Colin Wynn Would you do it again? Gary Wheadon In a heartbeat, in a heartbeat. It's something that I really enjoyed. Colin Wynn And an honour surely an honour? Gary Wheadon It was a it was an honour that as I said, I never ever, ever expect to happen to me. I'm just the owner of a very small removal company. And I do look at the board that's in the BAR boardroom with all the illustrious names of those that have preceded me. And I look at it and I think, how can I be up there? I look at the names of people like Freddy Hoult, who was a lovely, lovely chap. Lovely chap. I look at John Luxford, who did two years and David Bunting. And I have so many names out there, Mr. Bartup, senior and junior, and think these are the great and the good of the industry, and yet My name is up there. And my name is up there not just once but twice. Which is bizarre. You know, I did it was up there for my two year term. Then it's up there again up there again for the one year term I did afterwards. And I suppose you could say, at least I've left a mark somewhere. Colin Wynn Well, you could have had your name on the back of a Brentford shirt, but instead you've got it on on the noticeboard of the BAR! Gary Wheadon Yeah, I know. I know which one I would have preferred. Colin Wynn So let's go back a little bit. Yeah. What advice would you give to a young Gary starting out in the industry today? Gary Wheadon Network. Network network is if your life depends on it. Go to the BAR area meetings. I my eyes were really opened. As I said earlier, my eyes were really were opened when I went to the BAR meetings and I got to know people. I find over the years, a lot of people a lot of other people say well, we can do Facebook and we can do things electronically. It's not the same as actually sitting down with somebody face to face, talking with them chewing over the fat and learning about that person, you actually get to know them. And I find I've done more work with other BAR members, since I actually joined the board. And I'm going to conference as well. I mean, that's another thing. Face to face meetings, you can't beat, you cannot beat them. And I urge any youngster coming into the industry. Keep the BAR Area meetings going, please go to them, because they are a lifeblood, they really are. So that that would be one of my things that will give the other one I would say is you work to live. We don't live to work. I've spent a lot of my time thinking about my business, thinking about work, taking it home with me, living breathing work. My wife gets absolutely bored rigid with me. We drive around the country somewhere and I'll pass a house and I'll say see the house there? She say Yeah alright? Yeah. You moved them in? Yes I did. You do. It becomes all encompassing. And yeah, just just remember that we do. We work to live and there is life outside of business. So that they would probably be my main things that I would actually give advice to anybody coming in. Colin Wynn It's funny that you say about spotting the houses and moving people in or moving people out, obviously, I'm in IT, but as soon as I see a removal truck, you can spot it a mile away. And if it's a client's truck, it's always Yes, yes, yes, they've got my paperwork! Gary Wheadon Yeah Colin Wynn So I know exactly where you're coming from. Gary Wheadon Yeah, it's, it's bizarre, I seem to have that sort of memory that I can remember people I've moved from years and years ago. It's bizarre. Do you know, years ago when I was at school. I remember my parents went to a parents evening, and they said about me, and they were talking about me and they said, Gary doesn't have a memory has a forgetory except when it comes to removals. And then he can remember exactly where he's been, who he moved. I still get people phoning me up. I spoke to a lady the other day, she phoned me up. She said, You moved me 10 years ago, and I said, Oh, yes. Right. Yeah, we moved you from that address to that address. And she went, Oh my God. You still Remember me? And I went yeah, so yeah it's it's one of those things I do remember Colin Wynn So networking, BAR our area meetings, I like that. Obviously the BAR comes up quite a bit. I take it you would recommend the BAR to any removal company currently in business? Gary Wheadon I would certainly recommend the BAR to any removal company that comes into this business and started up you know, that would be, it's something they should aspire to. Because they want to be professional, that they want to get on and they want to work together. This in this industry is hard enough as it is, you know, let's all work together. I I still do you know I still find that there are people out there who will try and put obstacles in our way. I I'm probably digressing just for a second Colin, but I did a job the other day There was a part load that I'd collected that had to go up to north of the border. And we held it in our vehicle and they sent their vehicle down. And there was another company that had to put some goods onto their vehicle as well. So we said, All right, okay, we'll all meet at certain companies yard, this company from north of the border can unload and then we'll all transfer and we will, they were unloading. And when we went to start unloading, one of the operatives came out and said, the boss says you can't use our yard. I said, Sorry, he said the boss says you can't use our yard because we're going home. And this was at half past two in the afternoon. So three of us had to go and find somewhere where we could park on waggon and drag and two transit vans, so we can get them back to back to be able to transfer the loads over and it probably added about an hour and a half, two hours to my day. And I'm just thinking, What is the matter with people? You know, we're, we're all in the same business, let's just try and help someone. And it wasn't as if we were going to be that long. I mean, actually, the job actually took us about 20 Minutes to Transfer the stuff over because there was six of us there to do it. I just it beggars belief that there are some people in this industry like that. And I hate to say it was another BAR member. Colin Wynn So where do you see yourself and the industry in five years? I mean, what is there a get out plan for Gary? Or are you just gonna carry on and on and on and on and on? Gary Wheadon I'm one of those that they're going to have to bury me in a tea chest when I'm dead and buried. I have no plans to retire. In fact, COVID-19 has actually reinforced my desire not to retire. Because those few days I did spend at home. all I got was Oh, that needs painting. This needs painting. Let's rub the decking down. Let's get the decking stained. Oh, what are we gonna do now? I'm thinking, Oh, no, no, no, no, I think my wife probably got sick and tired of me being at home as well. So, the thought of actually, retirement doesn't actually come into my psyche at this moment in time. That's not to say in five years time, I might be feeling different. So let's see where that goes. Where's the industry going to be in five years time, I think it's going to be in a different place to where we are now. I think we're going to I, I hate to say this, but I've got a horrible feeling we're going to lose some of the the names within the industry. I think that a lot of companies that have got multi branches will find it hard. And that's no disrespect to the multi branch companies because they run some very, very fine companies. But I think the way that the public, the buying public will be looking at the way we operate. They will be looking at costs. And they will be looking for probably the smaller companies. I think the COVID-19 thing has actually come back to a lot of people to make them think local to think small, small business, and it's made them realise that big isn't always beautiful, controversial, maybe. But that's what I think will happen. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe we'll all still be going in five years time. But it's I think the industry is going to go through a lot of changes, a lot of changes. Some of them good, some of them bad, because I think there are going to be some very good companies that will go that's my thoughts on it. Colin Wynn So outside of the industry, how does Gary switch off clearly, you've stated that you don't want to retire because you don't want to be staining in the decking and doing all this. So you're not interested in all that side, but what does Gary do to unwind? Gary Wheadon Oh, what does Gary do for unwind? He, he loves to play golf. Couldn't hit a cows ... with a shovel. But I do enjoy my golf. I don't play as much as I should do. I must admit the problem with golf is it is a very time consuming game. So to be able to take four hours or five hours actually, way I play out of my time to actually go and play golf it's probably not there. So I'll probably get about three or four rounds in during the year. My other passion obviously Brentford Football Club, don't get to see them as much as I would love to go and see them. But doing well at the moment doing well at the moment. Colin Wynn Well, if you ever want your old manager back just let me know. Gary Wheadon Well, the new manager is doing quite well actually, he's doing a very good job. So yeah, that sort of thing, and basket weaving, I like basket weaving. Colin Wynn Do you know, I haven't done that since I was in school. Gary Wheadon Yeah basket weaving, I do the plane wave You know, there's different type of weaving I love working with Willow and, and honeysuckle, so find, they're they're very pliable. So that all started from days when I well my dad had a secondhand Furniture Company, and we used to go out buying secondhand furniture and we used to bring some of the furniture back and some of it was wicker. The Wicker backs the sofas and armchairs had The Wicker back so I thought I'd learned actually how to repair them. Colin Wynn And you have a passion for dogs. Gary Wheadon Passion. Unbelievable for dogs. Yes, we've had two dogs, we had one. Our first one was golden retriever called Sully. It was quite bizarre actually because somebody said to me one day Oh your dogs called Sully the same as your company. Did you name the company after your dog and I went the company's 160 years old. So don't think did actually name him after the Yeah, we did name the company after the dog So yeah, we Sully was our golden retriever our boy. And then when we lost him, we decided we needed to get another dog and we were offered a guide dog he's a retired guide dog. And he came to us when he was two and a quarter. And on. bizarrely enough, we were his last chance. Apparently he'd been to about nine different homes before he came to us. And he, he just didn't get on with each one. And he would either wet or mess or he would just wouldn't come back to recall. So we were his last chance. And I remember, we picked him up and we brought him back home. And he walked into our front room. We saw Sully's old toy box with all the toys on and he went I've hit the mother load and we never had a problem with him at all. He absolutely adored my wife and he would come back to recall he was absolutely gorgeous. And we lost him about three years ago and we're hoping to get another one very, very soon. Colin Wynn So finally, I always like to end these podcasts with a funny moving story. So I hope you have a funny moving story to tell our listeners. Gary Wheadon Where can I start? I've got my old classic one that I could tell you, which I might tell you in a minute. One of the other ones is about a job that we did for a local council. And they were doing an eviction when we were involved in the eviction. Now, anybody who knows where I am knows what part of London I'm in, so they can work out which council I'm talking about. And they had a squat that they had tried to clear since the 1970s. And they failed miserably each time. Anyway, around about 2002 2003 they decided they were going to do it properly. So they got the High Court enforcement officers in and I remember going to a meeting one day and there was this The great and good of law enforcement there and how they were going to do it. And they were saying we can do this and we can do and they all had to be very Hush Hush. And they were going in under the cover of darkness to surprise these people and that fences were going to be erected and then they wanted us to go in and move the goods out and store them until the residents came forward so they could collect their goods. And come in the allotted day. We were sitting ready at five o'clock in the morning, ready to go. When I had a phone call saying we're gonna have to stand down for a day or two. I said what's the problem. They said, Well, unfortunately, somebody must have let something slip because some of the Eco warriors had found out that this was going to happen. So the in solidarity they were going to go down and help the residents of this squat to repel the police and the enforcement officers. Unfortunately they turned up as pirates because they thought was going to be like a good wheeze away day. And the colour community of the squat decided these have got links to slavery. So they ended up with a big fight between those that come to help them and the residents of the squat. So it was decided, we're going to stand down because we don't really want to get involved with a big punch up. So everything was put back a day or two. Anyway, when they did go in, they took everybody out. And we were duly called to go in, and for about three weeks, we had Arctic's just circling. I had three artics. So one artic would come in with three containers on sorry, eight containers. We would load the containers up with each residents goods. Now, there were 32 houses in this this squat each house had four floors. Each floor had three rooms. Each room was a different resident. So, as the Americans say you do the math, we had to then decide what was salvageable from each room and actually put it into the containers, itemise it, seal them up and send them off. So we did this and it took about three weeks to do it. The High Court enforcement officers that were there, were up for a laugh, anything for a laugh. And I remember just as we were finishing, one of them came out of one of the squats and said, found some. I said, What's he found? He said, Oh, he said, He's probably found some drugs. So we walked over, and he's got this large parcel of cannabis. I said, What do you do with that then? So I said, Oh, we give it to the High Court. What do the High Court do with it. He said, they give it to the police. Right. So what do the police do with it. He said they give it back to us. Alright. So what do you do with it? He said, we burn it. And then he looked to me big smile on his face. He said, that's one hell of a party we have that night. We just stand around and breathing it in and drinking beers. Colin Wynn Very good. Gary Wheadon So, yeah, that was that one. And the other one, which I've got to tell because some people have heard it. And this goes back to the days when I was working for my father. And he had a business down in Brighton. And we were called in very late in the day to go and pick some goods up from a flat in Brighton. So we went over to load it. And we got it loaded. The lady said to us, right, this is the address it's going to so we drove over to another address the inside of Brighton knocked on the door, a chap answered, and I thought this is a bit weird because there's a lot of furniture already in there. So said to him, we've got some furniture for you and he went no nothing for me. So we tried to discuss a few things and after a few minutes the lady turned up and he just rolled his eyes and he said, that's my ex wife. He said, If she thinks she's storing it here, she's got another thing coming. We it was decided that he wasn't going to store it. And could we store it? So it was getting late in the day. So I said, Yes, fine, no problems. So I thought, well, the best thing to do is just go home now this is in Brighton. I live in East Grinstead. So I drive from Brighton back to home, walk through the door, and my mother looks at me and she says you alright? Yeah why she said we've had the police round here. There's a warrant out for your arrest. They've been scaring Sussex looking for you. Why? She said, apparently stuff you've got on the lorry is stolen. What had happened was the lady had gone out to America with her boyfriend. They had a big argument. So she'd flown home. She was then clearing his flat out, which was the stuff that we got on the lorry We'd loaded it up. The lady next door had seen us loading it up and had called the police. The police had got there and we'd loaded and gone. But the lady had taken the registration number of the vehicle and gave that to the police. So the police had obviously done the PNC check found out who owned the vehicle and had gone around to my parents place to find out where I was. And they scoured the whole Sussex looking for me in a big lorry with big red lorry I hasten to add with AW Wheadon limited written all over it. And they couldn't find me. So we ended up putting the stuff in store. And then when it came to get all the stuff out of store a few months later, after the legal stuff has been done, we had a very interesting time saying Who's this And who's that? So? Yeah, it was it was an interesting time. Interesting time. Colin Wynn Gary, you were clearly stuck in a truck stop somewhere. Gary Wheadon I know the backroads of Sussex. Colin Wynn Gary, I really, really appreciate your time for today. I just can't thank you enough. It's been an absolute pleasure given an opportunity to ask you a few questions find out about your past. I really, really thank you for your time. Gary Wheadon Colin, it's been great talking to you. Thank you very much. I do appreciate you asking me to relive some of my past. Colin Wynn Absolute pleasure. Thank you very much. Gary Wheadon Thank you. Colin Wynn You have a good day. Gary Wheadon Thank you, Colin. Cheers. Bye bye. Transcribed by https://otter.ai