Scott Seaman [00:00:09] Welcome and thanks for tuning in for another episode of AWSP TV. [00:00:14] We are so excited to have in our studios today Ben Ibale from WEA. [00:00:18] Ben is a good friend of mine, and we've been doing a lot of work the last few years together and I twist his arm to come join us in the studio today. [00:00:25] Thanks for being here, Ben. Ben Ibale [00:00:26] Yeah, no problem. Scott Seaman [00:00:27] So Ben, why don't we start with what we're here for? [00:00:31] So, I told you we're going to talk about culturally responsive school leadership. [00:00:36] So let's just our audience knows that's where when we talking about today, but before we get there, let's hear a little bit about your background, your journey. [00:00:43] How did you end up here? Ben Ibale [00:00:45] Well, I'd have to say first thank you to my dad, because he joined the U.S. [00:00:50] Coast Guard from the Philippines roughly right around 1970, 1971. [00:00:55] And so that's my immigration story, because I was born in 1970. [00:00:59] And so, and he paved the way for us in White Center, Washington. [00:01:04] So I was away from my father for five years and then my mother for a few years, and then I arrived in Seattle in 1975. [00:01:11] And so I was an ELL student. [00:01:14] And that's where the story, that journey, starts because they didn't have ELL during that time period. [00:01:19] And so I ended up just going into elementary school, middle school, and high school, at Berveley Park, Cascade middle school and Evergreen high school. [00:01:28] And that's kind of where I learned a great appreciation for English and the public school system. [00:01:36] And so I wanted to give it back because I saw things impact me negatively, and I wanted to make some changes. [00:01:44] And so that's why I became a high school English teacher, and I taught for about seven years in this class school district which was sharply different from let's say white center Evergreen high school. [00:01:55] And so that's where I truly understood that term, social justice, was just really coming to fruition, the opportunity gap, achievement gap, back in the early 90s when I went to CLU for my masters in teaching. [00:02:11] But I would get my undergrad from the University Washington, hence the purple and gold. Scott Seaman [00:02:16] You had to throw that in there. Ben Ibale [00:02:17] Yeah well I'm surprised you aren't wrapped up in your alma mater there, Mr. [00:02:20] Coug, so, but anyways I ended up at CLU for my master's in teaching and then I went into Issaquah, but then I had an opportunity with the NEA through an internship, it was a UniServ internship, kind of UniServ director who represents a lot of the collective bargaining agreement issues, bargaining grievances. [00:02:45] And I ended up being in Seattle and I was there for about six years as a user director for Seattle Education Association, and that's where my eyes really opened up on the issues of equity, social justice, because during that time there were probably about one hundred and fifteen different programs and buildings. [00:03:05] And there is a sharp difference, the same sharp difference between Issaquah and White Center, as far as socioeconomics, regionally it was different. [00:03:15] But here you have one district, where, depending on north or south of the Ship Canal, you saw impact of resources, impact of kind of poverty, quality of schools, when it comes to different support and resources. [00:03:32] And so that's where I learned what it truly meant to understand the different cultures of each building, because the culture of the building, I truly believe, has the most significant impact and those who create the culture or abdicate the culture, that's where I saw kind of my work in trying to understand how can we shape that school culture and climate effectively with collaboration from SCA, the Seattle school district administration, and the building leadership from all those different groups, including, you know, your paraprofessionals, your certs, even your bus drivers and custodian staff, and how they work collectively together. [00:04:19] Because they already know how to function separately, because they're just trying to survive and do the same daily work that they know how to do. [00:04:29] But it's creating a culture where everybody is kind of on that same vision, the same understanding to put you know student learning and relationship building with students the priority. [00:04:38] So that's kind of what I learned about coming in as an ELL student, and coming in as a teacher, and now working with creating professional development training around culturally responsive strategies, human civil rights, through WEA resources. Scott Seaman [00:04:56] Right, and here you are today, representing WEA, drinking out of that cool AWSP mug, partnering with us, because, I mean, let's just talk about the elephant in the room: the system needs some healing. [00:05:10] And we have to be willing to come together and have everyone put down their swords and shields or whatever you want and have a common purpose. [00:05:21] And start collaborating around what's best for kids. [00:05:24] So I really appreciate you coming in today to talk to us and we're hoping this is a video resource for people all across the state who are dealing with a culture that's either super toxic or incredibly positive or somewhere in the middle on that continuum. [00:05:41] So, let's do it. Ben Ibale [00:05:43] All right. Scott Seaman [00:05:44] So let's start with the first piece. [00:05:46] When you think about the term “culturally responsive”. [00:05:50] So, in education we're famous for our Ed jargon. [00:05:56] What would be a basic definition for somebody out there who's watching this who's maybe heard that term, and is like “oh, that must be a new buzzword”. [00:06:02] What does “culturally responsive” mean? Ben Ibale [00:06:05] Well, for me it's to understand the journey. [00:06:09] Because it's so complicated because most folks try to have one definition and say Hey, I know what culturally responsive means, it means to be multicultural. [00:06:18] It means to have multicultural instruction and curriculum and adapting to the needs and cultures and backgrounds of my students. [00:06:25] But to me, the best definition is kind of wrapped up in two things: one is there's a definition out there by Gary Howard, it says “the will and skill to create effective and authentic relationships across difference”. [00:06:40] And so to me the reason why is, it's more Why? [00:06:43] Why do you want to have a definition for cultural competency. [00:06:48] Well, the reason is you've got to have the will and skill to create effective and authentic relationships across differences. [00:06:54] So basically, it's around the idea of building relationships. [00:06:58] How do you do it effectively across differences based off of sexual orientation, socioeconomics, gender, ethnicity, language, also… your indigenous populations. [00:07:17] So all these differences that you and I belong to, how do we become more effective across those differences? [00:07:23] And so I love that definition because it gives you the Why. [00:07:26] But as far as how you get there, to me how you get there is the framework around awareness, knowledge, skills and advocacy. [00:07:34] So that comes from Dr. [00:07:36] Darrell Wing Sue and also my friend and colleague Dr. [00:07:40] Caprice Hollins, where first you have to be kind of self-aware and as a principal or an educator you have to be aware that when you enter a room there's an impact, visually. [00:07:51] There's an impact both visually from you entering the room and you seeing who's in the room. [00:07:59] Based off of race, based off of stereotypes, based off of all the things in your mind that's created this world perspective. [00:08:05] So the idea of being aware of those things is really critical. [00:08:08] If you're not aware of those social categories or national biases towards, especially as men, then you're starting off the wrong foot. [00:08:20] That's why you got to first start with awareness, self awareness. [00:08:25] Where your biases come from. [00:08:27] Your preferences. [00:08:29] Right? [00:08:29] So the more that you're aware about that, the more inclusive you are in understanding Other. [00:08:36] Right? [00:08:36] Because awareness, self-awareness because then the other piece is knowledge and that it's increasing knowledge of other all those other social group categories that I just explained to you. [00:08:45] And so as far as a principal leader or educator leader, you've got to know the cultures and backgrounds and movements in your region. [00:08:54] So you understand why you have a Marshallese population in Spokane. [00:08:58] Why you have Ukrainian populations in Kent or in Vancouver, and all the immigration movements so that you have a better understanding of what that students is potentially experiencing as an ELL student, and so that knowledge of Other, right? [00:09:19] So you put yourself in situations where you learn about Other and then skills that's where you get the skills for whether there's PBIS, whether it's for my generation Love and Logic, right? [00:09:33] Classroom discipline, because oftentimes we jump to skills before we go through awareness and knowledge. [00:09:41] Because you want to focus on the technical skills of teaching. [00:09:45] In reality you have to go first through awareness and knowledge, because the last phase of that is advocacy. [00:09:52] Advocacy is advocating for those that differ from you. [00:09:55] Right? [00:09:56] And so that's when you can begin to advocate for that special needs student who has student autism, right? [00:10:03] Or that student that's going through trauma. [00:10:05] How can you advocate when you don't have self-awareness of yourself and your impact on that social group category? [00:10:13] If you don't even have knowledge of that social category, but yet you think you have the skills to advocate for that student, when you haven't gone through the awareness knowledge first. [00:10:24] So to wrap it all up, just the idea that those are all choices you make. [00:10:29] Those are daily choices to either have self-awareness, increase your knowledge of that student by putting yourself in experiences where you're going to learn more and be more self reflective, and then the skills necessary to be effective across those differences in order to truly advocate. [00:10:49] So if you saw those four areas as choices that you put yourself into those places where you're going to be more effective and increasing your awareness, your knowledge of other, the skills necessary to be effective across those differences, and then to be able to truly advocate. [00:11:06] We all go into teaching thinking that we're advocates. [00:11:10] When I came out of Seattle University and USC Washington, I thought I was gonna change the world. [00:11:16] I was gonna pick up the starfish and throw back each one, right? [00:11:21] When in reality what if that starfish wanted to stay in the sand? [00:11:25] And I'm just thinking, no, the ocean is good for you right now. [00:11:27] No, I just came from the ocean. [00:11:29] I want to stay here. [00:11:31] So, to me that's what it means to be culturally responsive. [00:11:35] It’s to understand that journey, and that's ongoing, that it's never going to end and there's going to be places of discomfort, and you have to go towards that discomfort. [00:11:45] And so it's much more complex than just simply understand, yeah I'm culturally competent. Scott Seaman [00:11:52] Well what a great definition to start us off. [00:11:55] I mean those are four huge buckets. [00:11:59] So when you think about the changing demographics in our state, our students demographics are rapidly changing, the ranks of the teachers and principals, not so much. [00:12:11] Especially the principal level. [00:12:14] We still have a predominantly white population of principals in the state. [00:12:19] So, when you think about your role in traveling all over the state and working in schools, you can walk through the front door of the school and feel the culture right away. [00:12:29] You've probably seen good bad and ugly. [00:12:31] And we believe that a principal sets the tone for a school through leadership and the culture that they create, and most often the culture they inherit is what they is what they begin working with. [00:12:46] So let's talk about the key role principals play in culturally responsive leadership. [00:12:55] So if you think about the research from the Wallace Foundation, we all know that teachers are the number one influence on student learning, highly effective teachers, the number two influence is a highly effective principal. [00:13:10] Obviously they've been watching so far and they got one great takeaway right out of the chute: look in the mirror first. [00:13:18] What would be the next step? Ben Ibale [00:13:21] So I think the first step is definitely looking in the mirror, and I would reemphasize constant, that constant reflection, that constant understanding of yourself, not just your — yes race and ethnicity and language, but also style. [00:13:39] Because your communication style whether you're direct or or you've got your different types of personalities and leadership styles, if you have a staff predominately considerate which a lot of our elementary school staff from what we've done in PD. [00:13:57] There's a lot of considerate staff and analytical, and then you've also got the really engaging kind of extroverted staff too. [00:14:06] But I think understanding that style is really important as part of that awareness piece. [00:14:11] That knowledge piece is I think, for brand new principals, really critical. [00:14:14] It’s fully understanding your staff and I understand that you know just like you have students are carried over from one grade to another, you get intel on staff all the time I'm coming in. [00:14:28] I would encourage you to read that Intel but have a tabula rasa slate clean slate and do one on ones. [00:14:37] As a union advocate and union representative, we believe in one on one relationship building. [00:14:44] And so if you could take time to truly understand the why of every single staff member, from the bus drivers to the food service providers to the custodial staff to the to the front office desk to your SLP, nurses to your certs and all of the others. [00:15:07] Spend what, five to 10 minutes just getting to know the staff and understanding their strengths and their Whys. [00:15:15] That's going to paint a whole different picture. [00:15:17] Because just like any you know with the Seattle Seahawks right, go Hawks, right. [00:15:22] You've got amazing staff there they have created a culture where that culture will eat anything for breakfast. [00:15:29] Right. [00:15:29] And that comes from Dr. [00:15:30] Anthony Mohammed. [00:15:31] Because if you have a toxic culture that's going to eat you for breakfast. [00:15:38] Culture will out live you. [00:15:41] So I think in order to change culture it's not about top down. [00:15:47] It's about relationship building. [00:15:49] It's understanding the Why, why is it toxic? [00:15:52] What has happened? [00:15:52] So I can tell you a lot of toxic cultures are basically defensive responses to the bureaucracy and the constant lack of resources to the constant fear. [00:16:05] Here's the greatest fear that I've seen over the past two years the greatest fear of our educators right now is the fear of failure. [00:16:15] I have these kids that need me and I know they need me and I can't provide it. [00:16:22] That's why they're overwhelmed with all these new initiatives and all these new demands, and then you throw on top of that salaries. [00:16:29] My Why disappears because then what replaces that is survival. [00:16:36] And so when you're in that constant imbalance there's a there was a mindfulness study published in 2017 — 18 that said half of all teachers 50 percent of all teachers and educators around the United States believe in this statement and that statement is the disappointments and challenges and failures involved in this school aren't worth it. [00:17:04] So if that is the culture of your staff because of what's been done unto it because of the fear of failure and they see students failing and they don't know how to help them because of the constant overwhelming amount of expectations, you've created a failing public school system in multiple areas. [00:17:28] Honestly there are schools that are doing amazing, I mean I can reference them very easily, but as far as the overwhelming cultures that are out there there that that are really challenging, I think the greatest solution to that is to flip it and build those relationship pieces to combat the bureaucracy piece. Scott Seaman [00:17:48] So starting over. Ben Ibale [00:17:49] Yes. Scott Seaman [00:17:50] So starting over with relationship building one on one's focus groups. [00:17:55] What are some other strategies for a principal that's watching this right now who maybe stepped into a toxic culture? Ben Ibale [00:18:00] Yeah, to me one of the things to do is what you just said is that is to do some focus groups. [00:18:07] I think sharing focus group data, that's one thing that Dr. [00:18:10] Yolanda Parrish from the University Washington and myself have been doing and measuring is understanding the culture and climate from from two perspectives. [00:18:17] One is from the community based perspective and the other is from the student focused groups perspective where we just have conversations and record the conversations, transcribe them and then share them with staff. [00:18:29] So they can see the different perspectives around these issues and and opinions and thoughts about the challenges within the within that school culture and climate because then that's their data. [00:18:43] It's not data that's coming from another place another district or from Washington D.C. [00:18:48] or from even Olympia. [00:18:50] This is our students, this is what our community's saying, this is what our staff is saying. [00:18:54] So I think facilitating those opportunities because one of the those things that I really want to emphasize is that the principal should help facilitate hope and resiliency with staff, because we know that the research out there around the greatest predictor towards graduation is not a test score but it's the resiliency of a student's ability to get back up when they fall. [00:19:18] So in the only way to increase hope and resiliency in students is to actually build meaningful caring adult relationships. [00:19:25] So we know that that's a charge for educators, for adults, but there's also research out there through the Gallup poll that says if you want student engagement you've got to have teacher engagement. [00:19:36] And how do they measure teacher engagement in that Gallup poll there's two ways. [00:19:40] One is the support and loyalty to the employer. [00:19:44] So basically the educators loyalty and sense of support from their employer. [00:19:48] Number two is the depth of relationship with colleagues. [00:19:52] So those are two huge things that we don't necessarily think about because we're in the you know trying to understand what it means to help the student learn. [00:20:01] But the impact of that was hope and resiliency coming from the adults in the building to each other and the relationships they're building and depth of relationships and loyalty, those are the things that drive people out of buildings into other buildings and transfer. [00:20:17] And so I think for me as an edge as a principal leader facilitating hope and resiliency with your staff. [00:20:25] That's your creativity. [00:20:27] Because here's the genius of it all: the folks that do stay in education because if half of all those teachers and educators say that you know it's not worth it. [00:20:36] Here are the ones that stay according that same research. [00:20:40] The ones that stay have two characteristics. [00:20:43] One is openness and the other's curiosity. [00:20:46] How are you as a leader helping create the openness and curiosity of your own staff? [00:20:54] And how do you create that culture where staff can be creative in addressing these issues. [00:21:00] It's to me those are things that we as leaders have to help facilitate in order to create a better culture. Scott Seaman [00:21:07] So have you seen some good examples this year where we obviously had some fractured relationships out there. [00:21:14] And I would say everybody wants to heal and move forward. [00:21:19] Have you seen some good examples of everyone coming together and saying this isn't right, let's get back on the right tracks together and do this together? Ben Ibale [00:21:27] Yeah there's actually some really good examples of that. [00:21:30] And the reason why I know about these examples is because we have a four hundred fifty thousand dollar GPS grant to provide culturally responsive strategies around classroom management. [00:21:46] And as of almost of a free or low cost PD for Washington state and so CRS, culture responsive strategies. [00:21:55] And so there's been three districts that we've worked collaboratively with. [00:22:01] One of them is Central Kitsap. [00:22:04] Central Kitsap you know just like everybody else, they've had to bargain difficult contracts in order to create the best salary packages to keep our educators in the field. [00:22:18] And so one of the things that I've seen with them is that they have entrusted their leadership to collaborate freely with the association president and also the WEA. [00:22:30] And so what's that created is a five year plan. [00:22:32] A five year plan of culturally responsive strategies district wide. [00:22:38] And so we've got the school board behind us, we've got the new transition, think about this. [00:22:43] You had a transition from a retiring superintendent to a new superintendent. [00:22:48] You have the association there. [00:22:50] You have the H.R. [00:22:52] department the PD department that are collaborating with you. [00:22:56] And then you have your association staff and your classified personnel as well. [00:23:02] So a five year plan with all those groups at this at the table creating something that will not just you know check the box for a cultural culturally responsive strategies, but to truly create the culture and what that's created is now we have we've got approximately 7 trainers in that in that school district that we have trained personally that are current members. [00:23:26] And as a training Corddry and they've gone and they're training equity teams in the district district wide and we're also doing building by building. [00:23:37] So it's our first year and I can tell you it's it's a model that we're going to have to really unpack because there's so many good things are coming from it. [00:23:46] Because you are there's an empowerment of the staff to create equity teams, and I went to a meeting where they shared what they did based off of the trainings that the previous trainings that received including one of them was CRS and they are now doing it on their own. [00:24:01] And so to me that's the kind of collaboration and here's the here's an here's a great learning: that district, along with Spokane and Prosser and soon to be Marysville, we started the trainings first with the principals. [00:24:16] Because like you said, principals are key. [00:24:20] We don't need to be perceived as a threat and they don't need to be perceived as a threat to initiatives and things because if we know what's right and that is building meaningful caring to relationships students for the purpose of increasing hope and resiliency, that's what we're trying to do. [00:24:36] And so we actually train the principals and admin first so that they can kind of unpack it a little bit and filter it through their own initiatives their PBIS their AVID so they can see that this is not just another add on, it's not another added stress, it's another lens that actually makes the work that much more effective. [00:24:54] And so I think that to me that's been a great collaboration and that's that's it's starting to spread. [00:25:01] Marysville and Spokane, Spokane has been doing already, but it's a larger district so there's a lot of different pieces that have to we have literally probably around 20 trainers out there from their own Spokane Education Association. [00:25:16] And so we're gonna do district wide but it's going to be building by building there. [00:25:19] Marysville, we just met with them and with their senior leadership and their association president and there is a lot of positive energy there. [00:25:30] They're going to move forward from that. [00:25:32] And so to me that those are some clear strategies to implement with intentionality and fidelity, rather than just check the box. Scott Seaman [00:25:41] It would be great if a system if we've built the system around a relationships relationship building wouldn't be crazy, like time was built in the day for us adults to engage with kids that way. [00:25:50] Absolutely. [00:25:51] Let's switch gears. [00:25:52] Sure. [00:25:53] And talk about community. [00:25:55] Principals are evaluated on engaging the community. [00:25:58] It's one of their criteria. [00:26:02] Principals land in a new community they may not be familiar with, as you think about principal churn and all the leadership changes across the state, what are some key strategies that principal could take to understand and become aware of their community and then ultimately engage at a deeper level and an authentic level with their community? Ben Ibale [00:26:24] Sure. [00:26:25] I think just unpacking the term community a little bit. [00:26:28] That's one way back to that kind of that equity mindset and that culture responsive strategies mindset, is if you're waiting for the community to come to you, you're gonna get a certain community. Scott Seaman [00:26:42] I mean the open house and 10% parent. Ben Ibale [00:26:44] Yes absolutely. [00:26:45] And God bless them I love the PTSA, and I think they're, it's an amazing organization. [00:26:51] But not everybody participates on the PTSA. [00:26:54] Not everybody feels comfortable representing themselves on the PTSA. [00:26:59] But they feel comfortable attending, you know, the local community based organization. [00:27:03] Local faith based church or synagogue. [00:27:08] The LGBTQ community groups, the advocacy groups. [00:27:14] I think our job is to understand the different community based organizations and try to get them marginalized voice especially at the table. [00:27:24] Because if we don't have that lens of equity to bring everybody to, as much as everybody to the table, from the different social group categories that are in your school, then we're missing a critical voice. [00:27:40] And so what we mean by that then is to actually come up with some key themes that you want to address like for us again the passion myself before we create the curriculum and culture response strategies, we actually went out to five different community organizer communities around Washington state to get feedback on what does it mean to be to have Culturally Responsive Classroom Management. [00:28:05] So we went to Monroe, Washington, Spokane, Washington, kind of Lakewood area, Kent, and then kind of the Des Moines Park Highway near Midway Elementary School. [00:28:18] So we just use that that to to hear what what communities had to say about what about classroom discipline. [00:28:25] And it was phenomenal. [00:28:26] We learned so much. [00:28:28] We we we already had a curriculum but we changed it, because we wanted to make sure that we built it with kind of a community perspective. [00:28:38] And so we rebuilt it based off of their input. [00:28:42] And so it's so much more relationship building versus just straight. [00:28:48] Again we jumped to skills first but we want to make sure that we figure out our own awareness and knowledge first. [00:28:56] And so that's that takes that relationship building first and so that's why communities are really excited about that, I just met with Tacoma's NWACP Education Director Johnson is out there and also vibrant schools. [00:29:17] And I shared with them kind of the strategies of working with communities in the past and they're we're really excited about possibly partnering on that as well on some of those strategies where you build around us like you said you build around the relationships first. [00:29:34] It's like how do we do that. [00:29:36] And it can be done. [00:29:38] It definitely can be done. Scott Seaman [00:29:39] Sweet. [00:29:41] Great great strategies, more importantly great awareness. [00:29:44] Yeah. [00:29:45] Hey there. [00:29:46] Hey you're learning. [00:29:49] Let's pop over and talk about, and you've already talked about some of these things but let's talk about the staffulty. [00:29:56] It's a term we like to use here at AWSP because all the adults matter and you've been hitting on this throughout this conversation and it's every single adult who interacts with kids is super important. [00:30:09] So we like to just eliminate this whole staff versus faculty. [00:30:13] So we just say staffulty. [00:30:17] Obviously awareness is crucial. [00:30:22] So I'm a principal, I step into a building, I've got one hundred and fifty staff members if I'm in a large high school, or I've got 30 elementary and anywhere in between. [00:30:34] Where do I begin? [00:30:36] How do I how do I help that teacher that's been teaching there for 30 years was maybe thinking about retirement and I come in and start talking about being a culturally responsive teacher? [00:30:50] Where do I begin? Ben Ibale [00:30:52] That's a really good question. [00:30:54] I can give you examples of some staff, I won't use names, just because I don't have permission, but there are — This isn't being recorded. [00:31:05] OK thanks appreciate that. [00:31:07] But I think as a leader we want somebody who has a vision. [00:31:13] A vision that we want to buy into. [00:31:17] Because if you're just coming in and maintaining status quo, that's that's that's fine. [00:31:24] But if you want to us to bring out the best in ourselves and by creating culture that we want part of, you know to me that's where I would want to go is to a place that has effectively an effective leader. [00:31:42] Somebody who has a vision that obviously has around a focus around building relationships with students. [00:31:51] Right. [00:31:51] For the purpose of increasing hope and resiliency and academic gains and learning. [00:31:56] Right. [00:31:57] Success. [00:31:58] You know to me, I would want that leader to define success more than just we need to increase these test scores. [00:32:08] We need interventions that are specific to these deficits that we see in our students and maybe even in your classroom, right. [00:32:18] To me that we all know that's that's there. [00:32:21] I want to be able to believe in a leader that believes in me. [00:32:29] And to me, if you believe in me, just like you're asking us to believe in our students and when we believe in our students ability to learn and succeed and we say I truly believe in you and you're authentic about it, that student's behavior changes. [00:32:44] I honestly believe I've seen the same thing because we're humans where if you believe in me and you know that I have a gift and talent, and you're going to put me in a place where I can succeed, you're going to utilize my talents and you're going to understand my talents. [00:32:59] And you're also going to send my weaknesses because if we're all honest we're all we we all have senses we all have places of weaknesses. [00:33:08] If you look at my desk comparison to your desk you know that's how I structure things that may be perceived as a weakness. [00:33:16] But there's a huge strength that comes out of some of those imbalances. [00:33:22] And so you're going to need to understand my strength and still believe in me, that I have a place in your culture and your organization because you know the impact I have on kids, right. [00:33:34] That's to me that's got to be the starting point. [00:33:37] Because if you come in believing already and my deficits and you treat me that way, we don't want that for our students. [00:33:46] Why do we why do we accept that for our adults. Scott Seaman [00:33:51] It's great, we preach to all of our principals don't go in there with the attitude if you're only going to be there for a few years. [00:33:57] We say have a five or ten year vision for your school or else the adults won't come with you. Ben Ibale [00:34:01] Absolutely. [00:34:02] Absolutely. [00:34:03] I think it's got to. [00:34:03] It can't just be also a kind of a pie in the sky dream, right. [00:34:08] I think it needs to be you know the whole idea of realistic goals and those kinds of things are important. [00:34:16] But again a good example is one particular principal that I that I've seen and spoken with staff about is that they said that this is the first principal they've seen with a vision, and they're willing to kind of work through some of the climate issues that have happened in the past because they believe in this person's vision. [00:34:41] They have such a heart for students and and now we want to transition that that heart for students for a heart for staff because the vision is so clear and people want to be part of it but they also want to be included within that vision as well and to help shape it for that student impact because everybody wants to have that impact for that student. [00:35:09] They want to buy into it but you also have to buy into them. [00:35:13] So. Scott Seaman [00:35:15] So if you were to say to an audience full of principal prep candidates they're just coming out they get their certificate this year they're heading into their first year of potentially leading a building or an assistant principal, what advice would you give to them as far as how to enter in to to begin making those trust deposits building the relationship and the vision piece because you do want him to jump in and say I've got a pie in the sky vision but they have to start somewhere. [00:35:47] What advice would you give them as they enter in? Ben Ibale [00:35:50] Well I think again it's back to that same question of having that first conversation with staff of getting to know the individual staff and what their own vision is, and what their own Why is. [00:36:04] When are they the most effective? [00:36:06] Right. [00:36:08] And find out those those moments and then integrate those personal visions into kind of evaluating what is yours and how are you going to create a vision a common vision for all of us that we believe in. [00:36:24] And so it's it's getting to know kind of the needs of each individual staff, but also knowing their hidden talents as well and then creating something that you know that they'll buy into. [00:36:37] But bring them with you. [00:36:39] So part of it is actually you know having authentic representation at that leadership level, where I've seen you know building leadership teams where they're very connected to the staff and and they truly represent the staff voice and understanding. [00:36:59] And that can be like you know a very good culture and climate there. [00:37:04] But I've also seen building leadership teams where they don't represent staff, where it's not as effective because there's a breakdown in the communication as far as who's at the leadership level and how it gets down to the other staff and how it's communicated. [00:37:23] And so I think having representation of those different voices, of those those well respected voices from other colleagues is really really important. [00:37:33] And I think part of that is gauging who those leaders are in your building and because sometimes the most effective leaders within the staff aren't the ones that are on that building leadership team, but they're the ones that people go to. [00:37:46] So I think truly understanding who are the ones that represent the voices among the staff that they will be able to get buy in from the staff is really important to build those meaningful relationships with them. Scott Seaman [00:38:02] Awesome. [00:38:02] Shift gears again. [00:38:03] Sure. [00:38:04] And not that we're shifting gears to something that's not equally important, but let's talk students. [00:38:11] So just because they're last is I mean we're not prioritizing them here in our conversation but what are some examples you've seen out there of tangible strategies that principals have used to connect with kids whether you've seen firsthand or whether you've experienced yourself or you know it's so easy for a principal to just get bogged down here in the administration of the building that we constantly encourage connecting with kids. [00:38:39] So what do you see? Ben Ibale [00:38:41] Well I'm glad you asked that because that's one of the one of the strategies that I think I forgot to share, was celebrating the successes. [00:38:50] I can guarantee that there are strategies implementing every single day events every single day in classrooms all around Washington state. [00:38:58] They're literally closing the opportunity achievement gaps. [00:39:01] We don't publicize it enough. [00:39:04] And so what we're doing is actually going and recording some of those events that are happening and I can I went to a classroom of one of our trainers Muncie cedar green and over in Puyallup, and I watched a group of first graders… was it third or it was primary, I think it was first grade, they ran their own classroom meeting, ok? [00:39:37] Here it is April and and she's invested time for the students to actually create classroom meetings for the purpose of helping them problem solve their own issues together. [00:39:50] And she takes about 15 minutes each day. [00:39:53] So I got to go out there and just record and watch and I was blown away. [00:39:57] They had two facilitators that prompted you know what are some some shout outs just kind of shout outs of positivity that they've seen and people were thinking. [00:40:09] And it's called an appreciation circle so they were sharing appreciation to other students so seeing a first grader learn and appreciate somebody else's behavior and being shared around the table, right. [00:40:21] In this and the staff are there too, around, and they're the ones that are kind of receiving the praise. [00:40:28] And then they went on to more importantly I think not only the appreciation but one young woman raised her hand when it was time to talk about issues and problems that they might have seen that they want resolved. [00:40:41] And this young Asian girl said people when we were in our reading Lit groups people weren't listening to what I was saying they were interrupting, so I couldn't finish my story. [00:40:56] And and so then the facilitator said: OK, that's great. [00:41:00] Is this something that you just wanted to share or are you asking for feedback or for a solution? [00:41:06] First grade. [00:41:07] And she said solution. [00:41:09] So hands went up. [00:41:11] So you had all these students about three or four students shared specific things by saying one person said, one young person said you should tell them: excuse me but I wasn't finished yet, and I feel like you're not listening. [00:41:26] So I want to finish my story. [00:41:27] So just being direct with them. [00:41:29] And I was just like wow. [00:41:31] In response after response and then she got, so then the facilitator said which one do you want to try to do this week. [00:41:38] Well I want to try to do that one. [00:41:39] OK. [00:41:39] Great. [00:41:40] Let's role play. [00:41:41] So can I get a volunteer. [00:41:43] So both of them stood up in the middle and they they they role played what she would say and to everything. [00:41:51] I almost felt like it was scripted but it was totally natural and they walked with solution. [00:41:56] And then the facilitator at the end said OK we will check on you in next week see how things are going. [00:42:03] Blew my mind. [00:42:04] And that was 15 minutes that 15 minutes of time invested each day at the elementary or or at the Middle School is 15 minutes at the end of the week or even at a high school that we've seen, to me that was a really amazing strategy of building meaningful relationships with students but not only teacher to student but student to student relationships. [00:42:29] And so as a principal we actually talked to the principal afterwards and she basically has really promoted that strategy and also has allowed visitations in that classroom. [00:42:43] It's not and I want to be cautious about being mandating it, I think the idea of us facilitating opportunities to experiment in a safe space to where our colleagues can learn from that, to me that that's something that we're missing. [00:42:58] That it's you should be feel good about taking a risk and learning from both the successes and also the failures of it and facilitating an opportunity to experiment and and try new things. [00:43:13] To me that principal is representing the kind of leadership that they are doing behind the scenes, rather than you know say hey we're told that you have to do this this the way you do it versus hey let's try to pilot it, and WEA is going to record it right, and we're going to promote it in that manner. [00:43:33] And so to me as a principal building the student to student relationships is as effective as the teacher to student relationships. [00:43:42] So utilizing those students that already have kind of strong social emotional learning skills and giving them opportunities to share with students that may be struggling on social emotional learning because that's going to help the overall culture, because that's being promoted top down, and believing in all students believing that all kids are capable of success. [00:44:02] No exceptions, right. [00:44:04] If that's being promoted from the top and it's being promoted to the staff member that staff member is going to actually promote to the students. [00:44:11] And you watch the students do relationships grow from that. Scott Seaman [00:44:15] Can I put you on the spot? [00:44:17] You've got your school walkie talkie, you're the principal, secretary comes over the radio and says "Hey man we don't have a substitute down in so and so's room. [00:44:28] We need you to go there right there right now to cover the class". [00:44:31] So you are now walking to the class preparing your lesson plan in your head of how you're going to engage with kids. [00:44:38] I used to look at that as an awesome opportunity. [00:44:41] So what would you do at the moment you walked in that room then? Ben Ibale [00:44:43] Well I think the more that would walk in and I was asked I would probably just do a quick assessment of, you know, where they are in their school day as far as are they in the middle of a lesson plan or what's going on, but then I would somehow make sure that we would get ourselves into a conversation, and if they're doing classroom meetings I would say — Hey we're gonna do a quick classroom meeting today and I want to see how things are going, right. [00:45:17] And basically if I was at the high school that's kind of where my comfort level is, I'd want to gauge this as a focus group. [00:45:25] As you know hey is opportunity from the principal, I want to hear from you. [00:45:30] The strategy of these meetings happen all the time in our schools in the classrooms. [00:45:36] But if a principal went out and kind of truly gauged on what are some you know what is going really well for you, and what's not. [00:45:44] And I'd maybe I'd break them up into groups of three, so you don't get that silent death kind of an around group thing. [00:45:51] I'm thinking 16 to 18 year olds. [00:45:53] But if they did in small group say hey what's working for you at our school and what's not? [00:45:59] And then collect that information as vital data that whether to gauge you know your current climate and what you need to do to improve it and then have them share with each other and then do a quick jotting it down say I think I just thank you for your honesty. [00:46:17] I mean this is the kind of stuff that we need to know because I did not know. [00:46:20] So part of it is, again back to that cultural responses, the culture company piece of awareness knowledge. [00:46:27] So you don't go in there assuming you know what to do for the kids. [00:46:30] Right. [00:46:30] We want to get garner them, their perspectives, their marginalized perspectives because that's what we've been doing and it's been phenomenal. [00:46:37] We just want to wood way high school and just recorded students responses to the cultural climate and they're gonna share that with our staff, remarkable. [00:46:47] I mean they are the greatest observers of our bureaucracy. [00:46:51] They're either graders observers of the lack of hope that's in our schools from their perspective and we all have all the best intentions of increasing hope and resilience in our kids and their faith and in having a future after high school but we don't necessarily listen to their feedback about what we're trying to build for them. [00:47:14] So I think as a principal we need to know that because then we can share that with the staff and say, this is our Why. [00:47:20] I've heard all of the Whys that you have and that's awesome, but there is a disconnect with your Why and what the students are feeling and seeing. [00:47:30] How do we bridge that together? [00:47:31] Where's your creativity? [00:47:33] Let's focus on your creativity and curiosity to bridge that. Scott Seaman [00:47:37] OK we're almost there. [00:47:38] Time wise. [00:47:39] So two last quick things and I just want to speed round one with you. [00:47:43] If I asked you to throw into the camera some of the best resources that you've seen out there for somebody to engage at an entry level or take their learning deeper around becoming a culturally responsive leader. [00:47:58] Rattle off some of those resources you don't have to go into descriptions. [00:48:02] Just rattle them off so that people watching this video can go jump into Google. Ben Ibale [00:48:06] Well I'll do a couple shout outs to our own PD network. [00:48:12] So the WEA PD network we have professional development training around some very effective areas. [00:48:21] One is a special education, one is evaluation, one is culturally responsive strategies which is my department. [00:48:31] We have one in National Boards. [00:48:36] So those are resources as a leader. [00:48:38] I'd want to know about because they are accessible through the association to bring into your school. [00:48:46] And so if you have questions about that an amazing resource. [00:48:50] The other news resource that I would actually emphasize we've got one person that we just brought in, his name is Dr. [00:48:58] Anthony Mohammed, and he came in and just blew our socks off at our last teaching equity conference. [00:49:05] Our teaching equity conference is yearly in April and that's a resource as well, where you can bring in teams and usually we have about 250 people, 300 plus people show up and we're really trying to focus on how do we create that culture and climate in your building. [00:49:24] And Dr. [00:49:25] Anthony Mohammed has a new book on change. [00:49:28] And it's a very eye opening perspective. [00:49:32] He shared bits and pieces of it during his one half hour keynote. [00:49:37] And so I'm looking at that as a resource because I think he's doing it right. [00:49:42] I think when he talks about his we focused so much on the skill and technique, but the opposite of that is culture that we got to focus on the culture and how he is how he… the metaphor for that is you know it's the seed. [00:49:59] That we focus so much on the seed the technical skill of the seed like we want that seed to grow but as important is what about the soil you know where is this how what's the soil is will this seed ever grow in this kind of soil. [00:50:11] So we've got to cultivate that soil in order for to change to occur. [00:50:16] And so with that soil is your staff culture that is your building culture and we're so focused on you know let's bright by the next iPad let's buy the next program let's buy this and that and invest in these seeds. [00:50:28] But if you're not dealing with the soil of it then then that seed is not going to grow. [00:50:35] So I think that's a great thing that that book it's called Change, Dr. [00:50:40] Anthony Mohammed is another great resource. Scott Seaman [00:50:44] And you and I have talked before about what would be great if that was a teaching and leading equity conference and AWSP and WEA together. [00:50:52] Just planting seeds. [00:50:53] Yeah absolutely, I see some opportunities there as well. [00:50:57] All right. [00:50:57] Last question for you then we'll get you out of here. [00:50:59] Nobody comes into the studio without this question. [00:51:02] And it is: can you think of a favorite principal when you look back through your K12 experience, a favorite principal in your life, who that was and and why they stand out to you? Ben Ibale [00:51:14] OK. [00:51:16] I was at Cascade Middle School was a middle school associate principal, vice principal. [00:51:24] His name was Mr. [00:51:24] Prece and he was little balding on the top, like many of our our educator of our principals, and we were taught to fear our principals as a young immigrant you know you respect your administrators you just listen what they say. [00:51:42] And you just follow the rules and so on. [00:51:44] Well when I went to cascade Mr. [00:51:47] Prece always had a smile on his face. [00:51:52] He was always warm and friendly and just kind of jovial and kind of use uplifting and that I'd never seen before. [00:52:00] And so say what? [00:52:01] You mean administrators actually have a sense of joy? [00:52:08] And that was my first, you know, he broke the mold of my previous elementary school principal who was just all this and we just followed the rules and it was fear based and things like that. [00:52:18] Someone's got swatting it and that school, that we saw it's where you know legal but Mr. [00:52:23] Prece, and I wanted to follow the rules because I wanted him to smile, not because of the punishment. [00:52:31] Right on. [00:52:31] I want him to smile. [00:52:32] And so that's a different type of relational strategy I guess to wanting students to follow rules is to you engage them you make them smile. [00:52:45] And I think I prefer that even to this day. Scott Seaman [00:52:48] Right on. [00:52:49] Well Ben we can't thank you enough for coming today as you were listing off those resources. [00:52:54] You were humble not to say Ben Ibale is a great resource so, I'm hoping principals reach out to you as somebody who can come work with you on developing that culture that's ideal for our schools. [00:53:08] So thank you for your work at WEA, thank you for your work across the state, thank you for your work with Kids at Hope and the impact you're having there, and let's keep partnering. [00:53:18] That's it from all of us here at AWSP TV studios. [00:53:22] Ben Ibale from WEA. [00:53:23] Thanks for tuning in. [00:53:24] See you next time.