24:01.52 Cameron I'm your host for this episode cameron. It's me two weeks in a row hi everyone and we're back in business. We've got both of our regular hosts here. We've got Dave and Leonard Dave how are you doing. 24:14.39 Dave Um, yeah, no pretty good. It's ah it's good to be back. The place appeared to be in good hands while I took time off to scream into the Void um over black Friday because that was something. Ah. 24:21.54 Cameron Ah. 24:23.21 Cameron Yeah, yeah, yeah. 24:29.94 Dave Yeah I I missed out on all the mad God Good I Still haven't watched that yet I I need to find some time to watch it. Ah it it sounded like it. It sounded quite the the challenging ride something. 24:32.89 Cameron Yeah, it's It's worth an experience watch if nothing else. Yeah, Lenon. How are you doing?? yeah. 24:50.62 Leonard I'm good hi kids I'm back I've I left I abandoned you ah ah willingly ah, delightfully um with with joy in my with with with joy in my heart. 24:54.47 Cameron Um. 25:02.99 Dave Delightfully. 25:06.30 Leonard And ah refreshed myself I I ingested some souls and some um not being online all the time and now I have shipped a theseist myself back into. Ah your wonderful company. So it's good to be back. 25:07.54 Cameron E. 25:16.80 Cameron Oh that must be nice. 25:24.49 Cameron Um, yeah. 25:25.44 Leonard I Hope everyone missed me and and much like the the statues found all around yarnham were reaching to the sky begging for my return. 25:35.38 Cameron Um, it it is very nice having you back? Yeah, oh my god our lord yeah, it's been it's been a couple of weeks of me just. 25:35.57 Dave I mean they they probably were but we couldn't see it because Twitter is like trash fire right now. It's like oh. 25:41.77 Leonard Yeah. 25:49.77 Cameron Instead of being on Twitter just jumping around 5 different social media platforms to see if anything's happening and going. Well no, nothing's collapsed or cemented itself as the winner yet. So I guess I'm just still going to hop skip around for a bit. 25:58.87 Dave No, and yeah, and then some of them are just like oh I it it initially seemed to be like oh this this could work and then now I'm just seeing stuff going. Hey maybe don't go on that one. There's no security. It's really bad. 26:14.78 Cameron Yeah, did hear about that that is a shame. 26:17.92 Dave Oh that's a shame. 26:20.79 Leonard I simply refuse to leave I I I will I will I will um ah ah, openly admit that I ah when when Twitter first started I thought it was a stupid idea because. 26:30.41 Cameron Um. 26:32.85 Cameron And yes. 26:35.26 Dave Like now. 26:36.95 Leonard Quite frankly I think ah having an open forum to say whatever you think is a stupid idea because most people are stupid anyway, um, and so the only reason I actually currently exist on Twitter is because I need it as a you know. 26:44.10 Cameron Yeah, yeah, yeah. 26:54.37 Leonard Place to promote myself and the work that I do if that wasn't the case I would not be on the platform. But that said I will not be bullied off of it by the imbecilic buffoon currently running it. 26:58.84 Cameron Um. 27:12.34 Cameron Leonard just chaining himself to the wheel of Twitter I've been here longer than you. Um. 27:14.51 Leonard Um, the yes. 27:18.71 Dave Yeah I mean it's the same thing I don't um I engage with a few folks on there. Ah but pretty sparingly I Never I've never have like done a lot of engagement but the thing is I don't know anywhere else to promote stuff like that's just where I've been. 27:31.10 Cameron Um, yeah, written. 27:35.48 Dave So it's that same sort of wall I don't have a ah following but a platform built up anywhere else like no no that stuff I had deleted that crap like a long long time ago. 27:42.10 Cameron Yeah, yeah, edit it's it's odd. Oh God I Yeah, the only reason my yeah, oh yeah. 27:43.63 Leonard Um, yeah I'm not going back to Facebook what's wrong with you. 27:55.30 Dave Although you say delete it but you can still just recover it. It's very silly. The internet is forever. Yeah, and then I thought about stuff like red I don't understand Reddit still. 27:58.75 Cameron Yeah, my Facebook only exists to contact my grandparents. That's all it's for. 28:08.38 Dave Like I I keep trying to go look at it and I'm like I can't don't know what's happening here I can't can't parse it my my brain doesn't want to like deal with it I could rather go look at a old record just a forum like where's forums at. 28:08.67 Cameron Ah, yeah. 28:13.96 Cameron It's a bit of a mess. Yeah. 28:26.66 Dave Like that. Yeah I mean they had their own issues but it was understandable I could I could navigate them but the other stuff's just like don't know don't we have a discord but and you know no one shows up there. So. 28:27.78 Cameron Ah, yeah, Miss Forums Those were good. Yeah yeah, yeah, exactly Well yeah. 28:44.12 Cameron We have a Discord no ah nah don't worry. Not many people are and I'm not 1 of them either? Um, but yeah. 28:46.74 Dave That's fine I tried I tried real hard to like run that but I'm I'm no good at that kind of thing. I am. 29:01.37 Cameron Let's let's look outward from the horror of the modern digital world and inward to the horror of the modern fictional world. We've ah, we've distributed digitally amongst ourselves. Um, last week we discussed. Mad god which was a much anticipated film by a very well-known ah personage within the within the film industry this week we're going to talk about antlers which is a less anticipated film bankrolled by someone very famous in the film industry that. I watched so um, for for context alys is a film that came out in October Twenty Twenty one it was actually slated to release in April of 2020 so there there there was it sort of its first big issue. Um, it's. Produced by Guillermo Delorro ah which was sort of the the big thing going for it initially is like oh Gemotora is backing backing a project. This looks good this looks good and then I saw the trailer for it on the day it was meant to come out and went wow that looks awesome I'm going to go watch that and then I went. Wait didn't literally everything just lock down and then I then I had to wait a year and a half to watch this film. Um, but yeah, ah antlers is a 2021 so there's a horror suspense film. 30:32.78 Cameron Direct by Scott Cooper and based on a short story. The quiet boy by Nick and toska and this is sort of going to join other things. We've talked about like until dawn in the native american folklore and particularly the wendigo discussion. Um. 30:51.28 Dave Yeah, we did the Algernon blackwood um stuff. 30:51.98 Cameron Yeah, yes, yes, we did do that story Absolutely forever ago. Been for years. 31:00.73 Dave Yeah, it's been a few years. Um, the the other nick antoska's things were more recent. He did the the channel 43 what is it? Channel whatever wordss. 31:08.00 Cameron And. Yes, yes, Channel something? yes. 31:18.27 Dave Channel something channel zero. Yeah yeah, channel zero I don't know why I say channel 40 to me. That's the other thing that's the analog um, weird one. 31:23.59 Cameron Channel 0 Yes, ah yes, that's it. Yeah yeah, no numbers. Yeah, ah yeah. 31:32.86 Leonard From the other guy that did channel 0 stuff. 31:37.78 Dave Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's why I got I confused myself because there's multiple people involved with these projects. He also did the Brand New Cherry Flavor Um anthology like little series thing which I didn't watch but I heard was good. 31:49.79 Cameron I Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah, ah I might check that out then yeah, um, but yeah I I personally waited for a long time for this film to come out. Um. 31:54.90 Dave Um, yeah. 32:03.42 Cameron And was very glad to be able to go and see it in cinema and finally again a year and a bit after that actually talk about on the show and um, yeah let's let's go. Let's go with a brief overview here. This is ah yeah, this this is ah a horror suspense. Piece set inyspis falls in central oregon I have no idea if cyspos falls is a real town I assume it's not um, but it's you know it's that yeah, it's like it's that quintessential Oregonian small town feel. 32:27.11 Dave I would say it's probably not. 32:38.83 Cameron Of This used to be a big mining town and now it is decidedly not ah and it the the film overall is not necessarily directly about the monster and is more about issues of. In particular like abuse and generational trauma and societal issues like that. Um with the the monster sort of working its way through the film as an allegory for that kind of thing. Um, because yeah in the absence of the mining Boom This town has definitely fallen. From its previous heyday. Ah, and yeah, there's a lot of issues in town. Um, we we we start out in the old mine. The Gray mouth mine I believe they call it where a young boy is sort of just. Hanging around outside playing around in the in the abandoned ruins and then when he hears a strange noise runs back to a truck and jumps in just as his dad comes out of the abandoned mine with a gas mask and a big old box of mysterious stuff because they're. Running a Meth lab out of an abandoned mine because that's the best way to make money in this small town apparently um, from here they they go back down into the mine for a moment to sort of pack up and an ancient Evil has stirred down here in the dark and. 34:11.75 Cameron Mysterious thing attacks both the the father and his co-worker co-producer of drugs partner partner and crime that's a good way to put it. Thank you words escaping my mind as they always do ah and. 34:17.60 Leonard Partner partner. 34:19.93 Dave Um, and gets his yeah. 34:28.99 Cameron As the as the the gun trots and screaming start the little boy hops out of the truck looks into the mouth of the mine ask for his father and we cut to the title. Um, this entire film is so gray I think is the main thing I can say about it visually. Is. It's really selling this sort of depressed air does that make sense. Yeah. 34:55.51 Leonard It's It's so ah, ah there I do have a couple of notes on the way that this film looks um, ah it is ah the cinematography fee for this film is really really gorgeous like it is. It's It's a depressed. 35:00.80 Cameron Um, yeah. 35:06.75 Cameron M. 35:12.62 Leonard Ah, but very beautifully shot film like it. It really nails its mood and atmosphere especially in like the early opening of it. Um, as you mentioned of the monster aspect of it plays of. 35:16.88 Cameron Mm. 35:23.50 Cameron Yeah. 35:30.84 Leonard Very small part in this film. Overall Um, but yeah, there's a lot of mood. A lot of tone. Yes, it is very gray I Believe the most colorful thing I ever saw in the film was some grass. Um. 35:34.22 Cameron Um. 35:42.75 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 35:45.52 Leonard There're are really like long lingering wide angle shots of scenes of scenes framed that way. Um a lot of shots of just the since it said an organ like it's Pacific Northwest and it's a gorgeous area. 35:52.98 Cameron 5 35:58.69 Cameron Yes. 36:02.34 Leonard Um, but it is it like it's presented as cold damp and destitute like really having fallen like out of its heyday now that the mining operation dried up in Cesspis falls. 36:06.74 Cameron Yes, yes. 36:17.61 Cameron Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Ah, but good news. Everybody my mining's coming back as the as the environmental protection agency strips environmental regulations in the area. So we're going to reopen that mine in a couple of months um which 36:30.29 Leonard Right. 36:35.90 Cameron Ah, yeah, there's probably why the the ancient evil has awoken again. Um, you know the the sort of the the traditional horror movie trope of the the disrespecting of nature or traditional territories is often. What can bring about monsters that kind of thing. Um, and you know from here on the film gets rolling. It doesn't have a massive runtime so it does things pretty efficiently. We begin to follow the day in the life of our young protagonist Lucas who is the older brother of the young boy. We saw in the truck named Aidden as we find out later he just spends his days. It seems going to school and then roaming about collecting roadkill and or killing skunks ah himself and taking the carcasses home. Ah, because he's living in a very dangerous situation was his father down in mine with his little brother that was captured and they you know they all lived together in an essentially abandoned house up up overlooking the town. And in the house is one very important door. You can tell it's important because it has all the brand new shiny locks very securely placed on it and a little medicine bag in the in the native american style also on there is a ward and. 38:09.16 Cameron This is how Lucas spends his time you know he cuts up some rokill listens to some screaming in the night puts on headphones to ignore the terrible noises in his home and otherwise he goes to school where our other sort of sort of protagonist Julia his classroom teacher. Has noticed that there's definitely something wrong, not just in the town in general but with Lucas in particular and ah Julia herself has recently moved back to sispis falls after she left as a teenager to. And once again this this movie being about the human element of it. She escaped cyspas falls to escape the abuse of her own father and has only recently returned to sort of make up and reconnect with her younger brother after their father passed and. She's not having a great time of it either. It's I really liked the classroom scenes because as a teacher I can sort of connect there a bit. There's nothing more frustrating and also disheartening than a room full of kids who more or less refuse to acknowledge you. Ah. 39:22.00 Leonard Um, right. 39:27.25 Cameron It's real rough. Um, but it again it is that that depressed overall environmental feeling here is a lot of this I feel is not just she's the new teacher and there's only 1 kid who really wants to work on making her feel welcome here. It like these kids. Overall again, there. In an area where you know they're not getting the opportunities and and um experiences that they sort of need at that young age. They've become a lot less and ah outwardly interactive with adults and that kind of thing. Um. And you know this this sort of varies through the classroom you have Lucas who's actively dealing with absolutely terrible stuff every day and they got the rest of the kids who just kind of live in a ah depressed area socioeconomically speaking um which you know you i've. I've I've seen in my days being around at different schools doing various things whether there's volunteer work or regular paid work. It is sort of a thing that can happen and it sort of really comes through quite um, authentically here I feel at least. 40:41.57 Cameron Ah, but they're talking very importantly as always with a school scene in the beginning of horror movie about something that sets the theme of the of the whole story they're talking about stories and how they used to pass down. You know, information down through generations and how to tell people about how. We live and all that kind of thing and so she ends up asking Lucas to tell a story because everyone's been working on a story in class and he just comes out with the the most thinly veiled clearly clearly a cry for help. We're in a horror movie. Please understand this story I've ever heard which is the tale of the 3 bears in which father bear and baby bear get very mean and angry and sick and they don't have anything to eat except raw meat. But it's okay because they were still together all 3 bears. Even if little bear had to do all the lifting himself. Um, notably Lucas hasn't written this story down anywhere. He has instead been dedicating his time to drawing a bunch of like traditional horrifying creepy pasta images. 41:58.70 Cameron In his in his notepad. 42:00.43 Leonard Yes, he he has he has in fact, graduated from the ah child art school of Horror movie. Ah scribble. Ah ah images which is I'm just like a man like. 42:07.74 Cameron And and. 42:15.63 Leonard Did he was he the one that drew the Baba duke when. 42:18.37 Cameron Oh absolutely. Yeah, this kid created the Baba Duk absolutely 42:21.41 Dave Yeah too that was yeah that was. It's always the most impressive thing is because they they make the the kid horror art. It's it's ah it's a set design. It's a specific design. 42:36.39 Cameron M. 42:38.69 Dave That you know no kids going to be able to it's it's too well put together because too. Yeah, it's too well done but it just happened to be done with crayons. 42:44.13 Leonard Right? The composition's too strong for. 42:44.64 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 42:51.81 Leonard Right. 42:54.23 Cameron Yeah, yeah, it's It's like this kid's only ever seen one movie and it's Sin City and also and also he hates bears. Um, it's it's all blacks whites and stark reds and yeah it is. 42:59.35 Dave Um, yeah, um. 42:59.95 Leonard Um. 43:07.98 Cameron Yeah, you're exactly I said that um sort of I Guess you'd call it trophy at this point it's become standardized enough across. Yeah yeah, that trophy very very childlike, but definitely not actually childish style. Yeah, so. 43:12.60 Dave No, it's yeah yeah. 43:21.92 Dave Yeah, and it's something that like I've tried to mimic before because it's it's it's just well done and it's hard. It's hard to draw in that style. 43:27.63 Cameron So yeah, yeah, me too. Yeah. 43:31.66 Leonard Yes. 43:38.57 Cameron Yeah, absolutely. 43:41.80 Dave Draw as if you were a child drawing but still like convey more with it. Could you have more skills. Yeah super super difficult. 43:48.47 Leonard Yet I've I've also tried to recreate that style and it looks like a child actually Drew it but it doesn't convey the horror the actual horror. Um. 43:55.67 Cameron Yeah, that's oh man. Yeah, been there done that I've I've absolutely been there look I'm I'm not ashamed to admit back before I started doing all this podcast and stuff I had ah I had a. 44:00.27 Dave Ah, it's banging in different horror. Ah. 44:10.95 Leonard Fast. 44:13.10 Cameron Phase where I thought slender man was really cool and I tried to make a little prop journal and it was god awful. Um I think I still got that in a box somewhere I don't want to look at it. Someone's going to find it in 50 years and be either very concerned or very very laughing. About my absolute lack of skill. Ah um, man. Yeah, ah, but ah, you know between between the abuse at home between being bullied at school by 1 really really um. 44:34.27 Dave Oh goodness. 44:49.10 Cameron Full of himself redhead kid. Yeah, oh yeah, it is isn't it. He's he's he's being typecast. Yeah, he made his way across. Yeah. 44:51.19 Dave Yeah, it's it's the it's the kid from a Christmas story. It's the bully from Christmas story. He made it here gotie ah yeah, it doesn't have his little. Um. 44:59.35 Leonard Um, oh yeah, it's. 45:06.91 Leonard Yeah, but he's got his toadies or at least he has his toies in like 1 scene. 45:07.31 Dave A raccoon hat yeah does have the todies' it's real weird it. Yeah, it's the same kids. It's like they've transported them from the 80 s to here. 45:09.19 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 45:21.11 Cameron Yeah, yeah, is again very ah archetypal stereotypical some might say um, but yeah, but you know it's not good, not going well for poor Lucas with all that um he tears up some of his work and throws it away and his teacher is. 45:38.71 Cameron Finds it just just make sure everything's okay and takes it home and starts piecing together and it's just this sketch of like a circular fanged more with a child huddled up and crying inside it with like the amorphous shape of a face. Around all of that and she's getting really wrapped up in it when her brother comes home. He's the sheriff of this of this small town and he's not having a great time of it. He actually only took the position because basically no one else wanted it. Ah so. 46:08.93 Dave Yeah, he was just running on it I He just like well I just stuck my hand up and whoops I thought I was going to you know thought someone else was going to take it instead. 46:14.90 Cameron Yeah, someone's got to do the job. Yeah, Nope you you got saddled with what to be fair, sounds like an awful job like I'll be I'll be open I'm. 46:30.50 Dave Um I don't think the job sounds that bad except for like this particular instance where it just was really bad. 46:33.98 Cameron So the fair yeah. 46:36.47 Leonard Well, he he does like when he's first introduced. He's like yep I get I have to start work in like 15 and that's me going to somebody's home and evicting them giving them ten or fifteen minutes to pack as much of their stuff as they can and. Get in their car if they have a car like. 46:56.27 Cameron Yeah, yeah, yeah. 46:57.99 Dave Or if they have somewhere to go. He's like yeah no I mean the the job it sucks. But um, he's on like a bunch of medication and stuff. 47:05.78 Leonard And yes, ah, which I think is kind of there's a very interesting ah parallel between him Paul I believe it's Paul Paul ah Paul and his sister. 47:11.65 Cameron Yes. 47:11.94 Dave Yeah, it's Paul. 47:16.35 Leonard Ah, which is ah there are numerous scenes of her in like a drugstore early on in the fill where she is eyeing ah bottles of liquor. Ah very very hard and never buys it and. 47:22.91 Cameron Um, yep. 47:31.91 Leonard Ah, Paul is on this medication and we don't know why we don't know what it's for, but he's taking pills constantly throughout the film. 47:35.79 Cameron Certain. 47:42.64 Cameron Um, yeah, with like the radio in the background going and so on so about the opioid epidemic in the pacific northwest yeah, it's not going well in this small town for anyone. But in particular yeah, Paul's got his own issues. 47:42.82 Dave It. 47:47.45 Leonard Exactly. 47:50.90 Dave Um, yeah, yeah, now it's ah it's a problem. 47:59.21 Dave Well they is they they were both suffering abuse under their father. Um and she personally thinks that she got the worst of it. 47:59.35 Cameron Like yeah, not yeah yeah, yeah. 48:10.61 Cameron M. 48:12.79 Dave I mean it. It was pretty yeah her arm was like shattered and she had to hide under like the kitchen floor and all kinds of it. It was bad. Um, and she's like laying a lot of that and a lot of her her her her guilt. 48:17.32 Cameron It was very bad. Yes. 48:30.20 Cameron Yeah, yeah, so probably. 48:31.77 Dave And because she left her brother there just to take care of their dad who was already abusing them and I think going senile. Ah so she has a lot of guilt for doing that and then coming back and then trying to leave again. Um. 48:52.34 Dave To unpack ah alongside the pdsd and everything and the gall the stuff that she was going through but like not acknowledging that her brother was like doing that he was stuck with it too and he makes a mention that it's like a. 49:03.77 Leonard Right. 49:03.97 Cameron Yeah. 49:09.89 Cameron No yeah. 49:09.97 Dave Ah, that the 1 line where he's just like you. He's not angry. He's just tired like there's not he isn't anything he isn't in despair to like be upset about like to her. Um, he's just resigned and trying to like he's so busy. 49:21.55 Cameron No yeah, yeah. 49:27.35 Dave He's just trying to do his job and his get on each day. Um, he's like you don't know what dad did to me you know and there's so that's implying a lot of things. Um, but that's what he's dealing with and that's I think. 49:35.34 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 49:38.76 Leonard Right. 49:46.60 Dave Part of why he's probably self-medicating the whole old movie is that that that's the point of the movie is not like the monster. Um, but it's not making any of that. The horror itself is not any less effective because it's ah. 49:46.89 Leonard Right. 49:47.34 Cameron Oh for sure. Yes. 50:03.36 Dave Entrenched in like real human tragedy. 50:06.29 Cameron So yes, absolutely yeah, Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, please yeah. 50:08.93 Leonard Yeah, this this falls in line. Sorry just just real quick. This falls in line with um with and I've been worked shopping this term so please don't think that it's something that you need to use or apply to anything but like the quiet desperation horror. 50:22.56 Cameron M. 50:24.22 Leonard Um, in films recently specifically horror films I'm once again thinking like Baba Duke hereditary like like I think of like horror movies from like the 80 s like the slashers and the freddies and all that where it's like. 50:30.79 Cameron Yep. 50:37.80 Dave Um, yeah. 50:39.83 Leonard And everything was fine and then this horror was visited upon these people and these are films where it is people dealing with really awful like tragic lives and tragic situations and then you. Also dump this layer of like horror. Yeah, exactly on them. 50:56.34 Cameron Yeah. 50:56.69 Dave Just make it worse. Yeah, um, so yeah, you mentioned like when you mentioned her I was trying think oh what is this remind me of um, it reminds me of it follows like yeah, visually like the the cinemaography I think is is what's. 51:05.57 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 51:07.39 Leonard Um, yes. 51:14.70 Dave I'm keying in mostly and then like the um, the world is not. It's a vast place but it's not vast with people like like it's very other. 51:26.29 Cameron Na It's very empty. Yeah well. 51:33.35 Dave And um, the the human drama and the things unfolding ah are are bigger because of it because it's like zooming in on that. But then when you step back, You're just seeing like. 51:45.92 Cameron Yeah. 51:46.80 Leonard Better. 51:52.12 Dave But the people don't really matter. So it's real. It's a hard space to like sit in it's making it uncomfortable. Um, because it's It's a weird like it's not like it's hitting close to home. It's more just going. Well, it's just bad like everything is bad like. 51:56.97 Leonard The right. 51:57.27 Cameron Yes, yeah. 52:10.20 Dave Nothing is good for any of these people and they just take you can't even say they take the small pleasures where they can because there isn't any evidence of that like there's no evidence of any of them having something that they use as a coping mechanism. 52:10.94 Cameron No. 52:17.78 Leonard Right? yes. 52:18.36 Cameron Yeah. 52:26.27 Cameron M. 52:28.29 Dave Like with the exception of Lucas who has his music to retreat into but that's not even that's not the function or the function is specifically to like retreat into that's not that's like carving a safe space versus like oh I'm in having an moment of enjoyment or relaxation. It's not. It's like. 52:43.29 Cameron Yeah, absolutely yeah yeah, yeah for sure. Yeah. 52:47.74 Dave Yeah, opposite of that. Yeah, the um or we or yeah I don't I don't think I think there's I think I'm the the one I watch it actually um the Wow all. And and that end or something I didn't name of it escapes me completely. But um, oh ah, um, sleep Hazard house is the movie and it's like an hour- long shot on iphone um basically silent film. 53:12.91 Cameron Ok. 53:18.40 Cameron Oh. So okay, yeah, yeah. 53:25.42 Dave Ah, that's that's in I think it's in the Pacific Northwest It's in the woods but it's that feeling and it's just nature being devoured by outside forces like something beyond and there's no. 53:39.46 Cameron And. 53:43.77 Dave There's no real people. There's no dialogue. There's like a little um text I think in the beginning of the movie and it's the most uncomfortable I mean it's ah it's hour so you're sitting there watching you know a soundless thing for an hour and it'll do like. 53:54.00 Cameron Yeah. 54:03.67 Dave Ah, 5 minute slow Zoom on our waterfall like it takes 5 minutes to zoom in on it. Um, and then when you get up on it. The water is like fractal like it's been filled photo manipulated. 54:05.96 Cameron Yeah. 54:17.49 Cameron Ah, yeah, yeah. 54:20.92 Dave Just weird. It's like that feeling is what this is doing to. It's just so far outside of like people being important. 54:27.57 Cameron Button. 54:35.35 Leonard Yes. 54:35.71 Cameron Yeah, yeah, yeah. 54:38.76 Dave Yes's it's not. It's not anthocentric is what I'm trying to say even though the the mood a tone of the movie or whether what's dealing the subject matter is specifically dealing with people but the horror is like that. Not. 54:45.10 Cameron And. Yeah I think a big part of it is this town is somewhere people just shouldn't be like that. The main reason for people living here was the mine and the mine's been shut down for long enough that the entire population is sort of just falling apart because. 55:10.15 Dave Um, yeah, well it's not only that but they're they're they're the irritant. They're the wrong thing they're like they're only harming it and the the and and in the. 55:10.77 Cameron There's no purpose for them to be there. But. 55:18.80 Cameron Yeah, yes, yeah, absolutely yeah yeah. 55:19.10 Leonard Right. 55:27.93 Dave First people that were there before ah are are there no longer um or their remnants are faded away but they're not gone and are angry. 55:31.94 Cameron M. 55:39.67 Cameron But yes, yeah, um, yeah, it is I think quiet desperation is a good name for like there's that that sense of something just innately wrong that is quietly present through the whole like every single part of this film. Ah, something always feels off and I think I think a lot of it. You're right. Dave is just that there shouldn't be people here like modern civilization has no place in this particular area and the film is doing its best to make it feel clear that. 56:01.38 Leonard Um, in a. 56:13.15 Dave Yeah, and that's what gets tough with this sort of film and if you start like extrapolating on that and then you look at other landscapes and go. But it's the same like this is just this is just an isolated segment. 56:29.90 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 56:30.73 Dave And you go. Oh yeah, this is and you know this should be like untouched wilderness but you start moving around and going well shouldn't that too like what's the difference. So um, that that reaches a different like that's that horror. That's that. 56:35.65 Cameron Ah, yeah, this is. 56:41.85 Cameron Um, ah. 56:46.80 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 56:49.50 Dave Um, Microcosmic because you're like if you're you're zooming in on a thing but then like it's macrocosmic horror without actually meaning the cosmos. 56:53.98 Cameron E. 57:03.46 Leonard Right. 57:05.46 Cameron Yeah, yeah, yeah, you zoom in and see what's wrong here you zoom out and see well you could really apply that to anywhere. Yeah yeah, it's just you know you don't necessarily have the same ah native spirit in other areas that's getting as active. 57:12.23 Dave Um, yeah. 57:21.99 Cameron I guess ah maybe in universe that there's an anteler's universe set of films out there somewhere in the infinite infinity of existence where they just did like 20 of these and it's a different small town in a completely different environment and just a different ancient thing. Yeah. 57:36.44 Dave Well, you just get to the ritual. Ah. 57:39.69 Leonard Yeah, right right? yeah. 57:39.79 Cameron True becomes the ritual at that point I guess ah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Um, but yeah, so you know, um Julie is pretty much convinced. Ah Lucas is being abused because at this point you know. 57:43.38 Dave Because again that that did the same kind of feeling. 57:59.60 Cameron No, no, no one's leaning into the supernatural element of it except Lucas may be knowing roughly what's going on. Ah so after he gets again terribly bullied the next day because he dared to stand up. Um, even somewhat quietly. Ah, by decapitating his stuffed toy and filling it with ah feces and putting it in his bullies bag. Um, she gets him checked out by the nurse and this kid is literally skin and bones like yeah, he he's not been eating well for. 58:28.72 Leonard Yeah. 58:34.76 Cameron At a minimum of three weeks because we know that's the time skip between the mine incident at the start of the film and now. But yeah, oh yeah, he's incredible. Yeah. 58:42.17 Dave Um, yeah, this and the the actor playing Luke yeah, he did such heavy lifting like his this kid's like bringing the movie like you did ah such a good job. 58:53.71 Cameron Ah, Jeremy T Thomas according to Wikipedia which good for him. 58:59.53 Leonard Um, yeah, and I not to make light of this like the sequence and the situation but it was like during the checkup that I was like oh my god this kid looks like little baby Tom York um ah yeah i. 59:12.81 Cameron Yeah I can see it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. 59:13.57 Dave Yeah I can see it. 59:17.44 Leonard And so I found that a little distracting for the rest of the runtime. Um, but yeah it it was very depressing to see that kid shirtless like it was it felt it gave me the same feeling as um, what's his name? Yes, exactly that's. 59:27.53 Cameron M. 59:31.80 Dave Think the machinist. Yeah yeah I mean he was mountain. He just like mountain or malnoured and like was all scratched up. 59:34.19 Cameron Yeah, so. 59:36.61 Leonard Yeah, right? yeah. 59:41.24 Cameron Yeah, yeah, yeah, so he's he's clearly been living it pretty rough and also he doesn't take the bus to and from school he walks and like his house is outside of town like up in the hills overlooking the the actual town itself. This this kid is you know, walking several miles each way to and from school every day. Um, so Julia follows him as he as he sort of walks through town towards the edge of town and as they pass by an ice cream store which is. Next to a rehab center with a line that goes around the block. Ah, which again the the town itself is just full of people in the exact same situation as everyone else we see in this film. We just don't focus on them. Um, yeah, she she invites him in to have some ice cream and. 01:00:31.56 Leonard Right. 01:00:38.69 Cameron We get? What is probably the one of the lighter least least awfulmos in the film which is Lucas gets to sit down and actually enjoy some ice cream and a relatively light conversation. Um I mean the subject of his dead mother does still get brought up. 01:00:52.66 Dave The the most like probing question conversation. No. 01:00:57.93 Cameron Yeah, better than the rest of the film for him. 01:00:58.33 Leonard I I do have to say that I actually really like Harry Russell in this film I like generally think that the acting in this film is good all around as well. Right. 01:01:04.32 Cameron M m. 01:01:10.63 Dave She's she's always done a really good job. She just actually doesn't get too many roles. 01:01:12.88 Cameron So yeah. 01:01:16.59 Leonard Um, and she comes off as like really like yes they're They're the most probing questions humanly possible but there is like a legitimate like warmth and concern that like her performance radiates when she's doing this that it's like not just to like like. 01:01:22.46 Cameron M. 01:01:30.33 Cameron M. 01:01:35.83 Leonard Her concern is actually Lucas and she wants to make sure that this this kid's okay and you know she's doing the thing where it's like ah I'm you know she is a a victim of of abuse and and trauma. 01:01:41.46 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 01:01:53.88 Leonard And is trying to like spare someone else of that. Um, and she can see the signs of that taking place. 01:01:57.62 Cameron Yeah, yeah, absolutely she is She is one of the the most open openly caring protagonists I think we've had in a lot of the horror films of recent memory like and and and. 01:02:11.54 Dave There. 01:02:15.24 Leonard Um. 01:02:16.95 Cameron It is a kind of refreshing because there's there's a lot of a lot of horror films sort of lean into the the woman in the sort of motherly role being obsessive and domineering and compulsive in that being necessarily not always portrayed. In the best lightlight they amp those up but here she's very focused on it. But it's clear that all she wants is for Lucas to be safe. Um, and you know make make sure the kid's all right and just don't want anything going going wrong like it did for me where say in hereditary. Another stunning performance of someone in that sort of similar role that then continues to devolve and that becomes a lot of the focal point of the horror whereas here. She's just allowed to be a caring person and the horror is everything going on around them rather than what they could have done where this could have turned into. 01:03:02.17 Leonard There. 01:03:14.99 Cameron Another sort of monster thing here. Um yeah. 01:03:18.22 Dave Yeah, and what's what's nice if not nice, but they um, both films as a comparison deal specifically with like generational trauma and horror like like things things done by the parents. Um. 01:03:23.30 Cameron And. Yes, yeah. 01:03:35.50 Dave Not only are visited upon their children but the but the potential for those children to repeat or just become their parents is like the ah the word that the the very visible um and like. 01:03:38.14 Cameron But. 01:03:45.66 Cameron Yes, yeah. 01:03:52.58 Cameron So yeah, yeah, absolutely. Ah, but yeah, she she lets Lucas walk his way home and in the meantime just drives up to his house to check it out because she knows he's not going to be there for like another hour or two probably um, you know the. 01:03:53.31 Dave Brought up worry. 01:04:02.77 Leonard Pitch. Yeah. 01:04:09.74 Leonard So but specifically after Lucas was like don't follow me again right? I'm just breaking into your house I'm just doing a b and e on your house while you walk home. 01:04:15.89 Cameron Like yeah I'm not following you I just know where you live It's in the records. Ah well, very very specifically. She didn't break an in or anything she walked up to the door. 01:04:20.81 Dave Get to home visit. 01:04:28.70 Cameron And it spookily opened itself. As soon as she got within five feet of it because let let's talk about moz. Yeah yeah, normal normal person thing. Yeah. 01:04:33.17 Leonard Um, ah. 01:04:34.86 Dave We can say that at least she does the most human thing and like or not human, but ah, um, normal rational. 01:04:41.71 Leonard Rational. 01:04:46.49 Dave Thing that you should do when something weird happens is you just leave. 01:04:47.66 Cameron E Yeah yeah, she she walks out of the Spook House looks the car hasn't been driven in weeks. The house is like in complete disrepair walks up to the front door the front door opens on its owner. She hears like a thudding growling sound from the attic and just leaves. 01:04:51.63 Leonard Yep. 01:05:06.44 Leonard Yep, oh man look at that look at that look how I know look at look oh man that was like the most refreshing thing which I think is really hilarious because then they just have somebody else do the dumb thing later. 01:05:07.11 Cameron She just goes away look at the time. 01:05:19.91 Dave Yeah. 01:05:22.70 Cameron It's the isn't look. It's the police's job to go into spooky buildings and horror movies. 01:05:25.15 Leonard Oh man I had um I I So I I spent a while watching this movie because I do really like it. But I've got some problems with it and I I One of them was just like oh man they're doing the dumbmp thing where the person causes the problem and like man. Um. 01:05:31.14 Cameron Yeah. 01:05:38.90 Cameron E. 01:05:42.17 Leonard Just imagine if the police had shown up then the second half of the movie wouldn't have opened or happened and I'm like I I don't think that that would have necessarily have been a bad thing. Um part of me like coming off of ah cabinet of curiosities. 01:05:53.74 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 01:05:59.85 Cameron And. 01:06:01.65 Leonard Part of me kind of wishes that this was in a shorter cabinet of Curiosities format. 01:06:06.74 Cameron I I could see that button. 01:06:09.80 Dave Um I could see that or a masters of horror like just make it a shorter movie it I don't know that it would benefit completely from that because a lot of the of the the strength of this movie is the characterization of the town. 01:06:16.20 Leonard Ah. 01:06:23.46 Leonard Um, yes. 01:06:25.00 Cameron In. 01:06:27.30 Dave Um, and just the lingering long panning shot like they're good and I don't think that cutting though could do what else are you going to cut out like yeah. 01:06:33.14 Leonard Ah. 01:06:37.29 Leonard Of the police procedural stuff where the police don't know what's going on but the audience does and it's the most boring thing in horror movies ever? Yeah I mean they're written the the. 01:06:42.13 Cameron Yeah. 01:06:47.20 Dave I Liked the lights though I liked all those meanings I wanted to see the I wanted more of the corner use. Fun. Yeah yeah, that was a doctor I liked him too I liked everybody in this movie. We just did a really. 01:06:48.40 Cameron Ah, yeah, yeah, lights are good. Yeah yeah. 01:06:56.70 Leonard Yeah, oh you mean like literal doctor egg Man Coroner or oh no, that was the doctor. But yeah, yes. 01:07:05.53 Dave They're fun to see on screen. 01:07:06.92 Cameron Oh yeah, Absolutely Yeah. Um, but yeah I Really like this bit partly because yeah, it plays into sometimes people can be smart in horror films and just get themselves out of a bad situation. Ah, but also in a lot of popular modern interpretations. The wendigo is just kind of a monster. It's just it's just a physical thing that's out there whereas this film sticks a lot more to the traditional native ah law about it which is the actual monster is the spirit that possesses a person who becomes the the physical. 01:07:28.75 Leonard Um. 01:07:44.28 Cameron Monster and so the the haunted house ghost stuff is the we to go spirit doing its best to engineer a situation where the physical monster can be created. It's it's luring people as much as it can and sort of making access to itself easier. 01:07:56.57 Dave Um, yeah. 01:08:02.61 Cameron While still being mostly incorporeal throughout like this full first half of the film. It's just honor just come on in guys you you bring in dinner. Um, ah, but yeah, ah Julia then the next day sort of presents. 01:08:02.68 Leonard Ah. 01:08:07.89 Leonard Yeah. 01:08:08.15 Dave Um, oh it's just hungry. 01:08:20.68 Cameron This mountain of evidence of clear abuse to the Principal of the school is like ah well it could be worse. You know at least he's coming to school which I kind of get her point on that she lays out very clearly like a lot of the kids in the town are homeschooled specifically because. 01:08:27.29 Leonard Right. 01:08:38.15 Cameron Their parents use them to distribute the drugs they produce or to stop school workers from noticing like methamphetamine just on their shirts and stuff which is rough but it's again the grim reality of this town. Um, but obviously. 01:08:45.97 Leonard Right. 01:08:55.75 Cameron He's coming to school isn't that enough is not going to be enough for an abuse survivor trying to help someone else who's clearly going through abuse. Um so Julia pressure pressures the principal into looking into things further she says she'll you know she'll talk with Frank Weaver I'll talk with his dad. Um, that's. 01:09:12.60 Leonard Yes, the the the the the Meth cooker I'm going to talk with the Meth cooker and have a reasonable discussion because it's not because it's not like she doesn't know once again, it's a small town. Everybody knows everything about everyone. So it's just like nuts that she. 01:09:14.88 Cameron Good as you're going to get Unfortunately, yeah, it'll be fine. Oh yeah, yeah. 01:09:31.26 Leonard Like it if she it feels really weird and cavalier like once it's once again, it's just like a ah ah like quiet resignation of like this is how things are and this is what I can do. 01:09:34.39 Cameron M. 01:09:45.10 Cameron Um, yeah, she's she's sort of desensitized to the idea of having to talk to a parent who's potentially dangerous because a bunch of the parents in town are exactly the same as this guy as far as she knows. Um. And just what she has to deal with at this point to do her job I guess is go like hey why is your kid not coming to school. Oh you're using him to sell meth good to know I can't really put that on official record, please send your kid to school great conversation I'm leaving. I assume is a bunch of her home visit stuff that she has to do every now and then um, but yeah, unfortunately this is obviously all in the interest of this actually becoming a monster film in the second half and very sadly principal ellen booth up she goes to. Weaver house up in the Hills Parks a car heads inside and hears some noise up in the attic sees a very locked door and does to be fair, the the very normal human interpretation of that thing's really locked up better see what's behind there and immediately unlocks it she does. Pick up the medicine bag which looks good for her. Um a modicum of horror sense there heads inside and sees Aidan Lucas's little brother just this completely malnourished completely starved little kid sitting shirtless in the middle of the attic. 01:11:16.56 Cameron Um, ah, yeah, ah immediately runs over goes is trying to start to take care of him and gets ambushed by Frank who. At this point has gone through a lot of degeneration physically like we've we've seen little flashes of him here and there he's he's. Severely malnourished. He's losing hair. His skin is sort of both greasing up and also potentially becoming more translucent but at this point he is physically glowing from within like you can see his rib cage illuminated by like. Literally he's got an led for a heart basically um and he he jumps the principal takes it a big old bite and ah ends up killing her and that's that the the monster is out of the box. Um the box being Frank Weaver's entire body. As he sort of stands up and antlers begin to burst out of his mouth. Ah it. It's it's a pretty good ah partial transformation sequence. We don't see the whole thing but we do then get to see the aftermath of it. Um, because pretty soon after the principal's husband calls in a missing person report Julia mentions to her brother Paul that she had asked her to speak to Frank Weaver They put 2 and 2 together and the police go up to the house and they don't find Aidan they do find the principals. 01:12:49.98 Cameron Body and then they find the hollowed out corpse of Frank is like something literally burst him open like a cocoon which it's a great piece of um, practical effect. It's really good. 01:12:57.15 Leonard Yeah, he's. 01:13:04.33 Leonard Ah I actually wanted to bring up and because I don't think we've talked about Frank's partner but that practical effect that like that like I was I watched it a couple of times and I'm like oh this is like a really good like. 01:13:07.87 Cameron Yes, tared. 01:13:20.48 Leonard Use of like practical effects and like it's clear from like the upper and not his torso because it's separate but like the upper half of his torso is like composited in of the actual actor. Um, ah. 01:13:28.75 Cameron Um, yes, yeah. 01:13:38.34 Leonard So it's it's a really effective effect of like this partially eaten completely torn in half body and then like the actual actor like so the face doesn't look weird or goofy um in in the shot and it's. 01:13:45.69 Cameron Yeah. 01:13:54.23 Cameron Um, yeah. 01:13:56.12 Leonard Super effective and I was super impressed by like all the practical effects in this film. 01:14:01.00 Dave Yeah. 01:14:03.51 Cameron Yeah, yeah, absolutely they are just really really good. Um, and like there's a lot of that standard blood and gore stuff and then then there's the hollowed human cocoon which has that again that really. 01:14:13.52 Leonard Yeah. 01:14:19.41 Cameron Almost like papery translucent quality which it look they make use of because they like hold it up with a light shining from the other side a few times and things and it's really really freaky to look at um and we get the the everimportant bit of info which is it's. 01:14:27.34 Leonard And. 01:14:37.87 Cameron Charred on the interior. Um, which right at the beginning of the film when the monster first made its appearance. There were embers floating in the air which seemed to be the the sort of um point of reference here which I found to be an interesting take um traditionally. 01:14:45.89 Leonard Yes. 01:14:56.34 Cameron The heart of the wendigo is an important part of the myth because you have to melt the heart which is normally a big block of ice in order to destroy the physical body of the creature. But then the spirit just gets loose again. But in this case, it's like the other way Round. It is a. Burning Heart that must be extinguished which I thought was interesting I guess they might have just gone with that because it was a more interesting practical effect to be able to show like the glowing fires within um or it could be a a regional variation on the myth I don't know. 01:15:14.33 Leonard And. 01:15:33.56 Cameron I'm not qualified enough to say if yeah, yeah, it's It's pretty broad. Yeah yeah, ah happy to learn either way if someone knows just let us know. 01:15:34.15 Dave Um, it's probably regional. Um, the windowgo myth was in like all the Algonquin speaking peoples and it's it's it's multiple tribes. 01:15:52.90 Cameron Um, but yeah, ah, at this point you know it actually more or less becomes a standard monster movie. But it's done pretty nicely. Um Lucas is walking home from school along the railroad tracks as you do when his bully. Ambushes him and is in turn himself ambushed and we get our first sort of it's interesting that our first real momentary look at the creature is a broad daylight one it sort sort of defies. The horror expectation of monsters strike in the dark which I really like the thing is just. 01:16:25.93 Leonard Ah. 01:16:32.51 Cameron Active in the community. At this point. Um, but yeah, it's been following Lucas from up in the canopy in the trees in the woods that the railroad track runs through and then as soon as the bully shows itself. It just leaps down from branch and it is this sort of live. Very skinny because it's literally physically malnourished thing you see like a crown of antlers and a sort of ah a feathery name more or less. That's all you really get out of this brief look ah and off they go Julia and um. 01:17:10.98 Cameron Oh good lord Julian Paula talking to Paul gets a call about a body on the tracks and they find they find this this young man Clint I believe is the bully's name. Um, they they find him on the tracks and the the only reaction Paul has is please tell me this was a train. 01:17:22.31 Dave Yeah, um. 01:17:30.50 Cameron And again the coroners here still doing it. Great job like this this boy was eaten in half which is a thing to say. Um, yeah, they don't that' would show the body here but they imply enough to give you a pretty good idea of what's going on there and um. 01:17:34.38 Leonard Yeah. 01:17:49.40 Cameron Yeah, this is just a very brutal creature. At this point it's it's being very clear about it just devouring everything it can um they don't have many things to go on here. They don't really have anyone else to go to so they go to the former sheriff. Ah. Carrie Stokes I think it was Warren Stokes who is actually native american um, and with the Lucas Drawings and the reports of what's going on with the killings he draws the conclusion that it's a when to go. Um this this. 01:18:23.20 Dave Are. 01:18:27.73 Cameron A morphous spirit that can inhabit a body and once they commit cannibalism transform them into a monster. Very importantly to kill it. You have to extinguish its heart but you can only do that immediately after it's fed because feeding makes it hungrier which makes it weaker as it's. Presumably just for for a time racked with hunger pains until it stops eating and goes on the hunt again which again is an interesting take.. There's um, again in sort of traditional where to go Stuff. There's a bunch of stuff around that sometimes the more it eats the bigger it grows again. This is. Probably given how accurate they want to be with a lot of the the stuff surrounding us so far probably another variation here traditionally of once it's eaten. It's weak for a while. Um, but you know they have to give a monster a weakness in a movie. Otherwise it would just be. The back half of the movies. The invincible Wedigo kills the whole town of Cyprus Falls. Um, which wouldn't be as interesting. 01:19:36.40 Leonard Paul does the annoying there's got to be a logical explanation and I'm like I'm like you found you've you've discovered like you found 3 partially cannibalized bodies within as many days you found the burnt corpse of a meth cooker. 01:19:38.26 Cameron Um, yep, yep. 01:19:52.74 Cameron Um, yeah. 01:19:55.74 Leonard That has been flayed open like either. It's a monster or there is a crazy cult doing crazy cult shit in your town. Um, and you either 1 is not a particularly good option or is. Rational either and I'm just like I'm yeah, what's again like I really like I do really like this movie but every single time like the police like every single time the trophy stuff comes out I'm just like I'm just wait I I need the scene to be over because it's driving me and say. 01:20:13.31 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 01:20:24.75 Cameron Um, yeah. 01:20:32.33 Cameron Yeah, well you know Paul will get us come up. It's eventually um, they they do find Lucas I believe back at his house and take him into the hospital because good god that boy needs help and we do get. 01:20:34.81 Leonard Death. Yeah. 01:20:49.17 Cameron As you mentioned earlier the Eggman Doctor who I do I I really love that guy. He's got a sort of a very warm and caring disposition and he's just sort of friend shaped. Overall it. It's like the it is the friendliest old man I've ever seen in scrubs. 01:20:51.90 Leonard Um, yeah I Love that guy. 01:20:59.63 Leonard Yes, yes. 01:21:07.83 Cameron Um, and yeah, it does the whole thing of you know he's severely malnourished. He's severely dehydrated and I probably don't have to tell you he's definitely been abused Talk to him tomorrow. Don't talk to him tonight. Let the kid rest. 01:21:19.40 Leonard Yeah, yeah, Paul does the like when can I interview him I'm like oh man I want you to stop saying things and and like go away. Please sir. 01:21:27.39 Cameron Um, yeah, sir enough? Um, yeah, ah sort of after this point ah Julia Reaches and is very firm on the decision that Lucas. Doesn't have any living relatives anymore clearly cps child protective services is not really active in this town because they had previously made the decision that frank is good enough of a guardian for Lucas and aden after he had lost his job and had been. 01:21:52.70 Leonard Um, yeah. 01:22:05.34 Cameron Multiple times ah cited for meth dealing and revived with nac and by Paul like multiple multiple times like ah we did what we could and the court said he was a fit enough guardian so there's no one else who'll take him so Julia comes to the conclusion. Well we have to take. 01:22:07.82 Leonard Um, yeah. 01:22:23.84 Cameron Lu is in now. Um, yeah, they they they get him to their house. Ah Paul has one of his deputies sort of on watch ahead ahead of time around the house while he's out looking for a killer because again got to look for. For a regular interpretation for this clearly horrific and probably supernatural series of events and there's some movement out by the shed Dan the deputy moves into investigate and finds a half naked young boy hiding in a box in the shed. Clearly acting for like the third time in this film as bait this this this is a group effort. This is team hunting as the we togo uses aid and as bait and then just walks up behind Dan and gores him to death with the antlers. Ah, which hey. 01:23:12.52 Leonard Um, yep. 01:23:17.58 Cameron Make make prime use of those. That's what those are for yeah. 01:23:22.17 Leonard So this entire sequence like bugs me from an editing perspective because a lot of it doesn't make sense to me. Um Dan doesn't announce himself ah to to anybody at the house even though he knows that. 01:23:35.23 Cameron No. 01:23:40.26 Leonard Um, that Julie and and Lucas are there so but he does let Paul know he's like I met your house but he never like knocks on the door. He never's like hey your brother just wanted me to like make sure that the 2 of you are okay like you know, reasonable stuff that you'd expect a police officer to do. Um. 01:23:42.48 Cameron And. 01:23:55.40 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah. 01:24:00.24 Leonard Then we get the of the the sequence where Lucas ah basically spells out what's going on without spelling it out like the the creepies kid ah story. Ah, ah, trailer explanation and then there's a how and then they super react like something like. 01:24:06.54 Cameron E Yeah yeah. 01:24:19.81 Leonard Horrible happened and I'm like no wait shouldn't the reaction be to like Dan being gored and murdered like it feels like this like it's this is edited out of sequence because there's also like they run out of the living room and. 01:24:20.90 Cameron Yeah, um. 01:24:38.28 Cameron M. 01:24:38.49 Leonard Her phone is ringing but she doesn't grab it and I'm like what what is going on like I I I as as an editor I thought I was going crazy during this sequence until Paul actually shows up ah at the house because it it like. 01:24:50.35 Cameron Yeah. 01:24:55.43 Leonard Doesn't make any logical sense like the way that these events are are presented like once again, they're shot really well and they're really tens but I'm just like I Really just like I I want to like take the sequence and recut it. 01:24:59.28 Cameron Um, yeah. 01:25:08.98 Cameron Yeah, it it. Yeah, it could use like a 5 second insert the scene before where Paul says I'll have Dan sit outside in the car or something. Yeah, yeah. 01:25:11.57 Leonard So that it like makes more temporal sense. 01:25:20.30 Leonard Yes, yes, anything literally it anything other than nothing would have been better. 01:25:29.20 Cameron Yeah I will pay 1 major thing out of this scene though. Um, so ah, the the screaming and the and the and the howling starts happening outside and Julia immediately goes to a cabinet full of guns and grabs one and says. 01:25:42.34 Leonard Yes. 01:25:46.17 Cameron Shit these are all locked and Paul has the key I like hey plus one point gun safety terrible time for it but actually having a bunch of easily accessible firearms in the house be safely secured well done. He's actually showing somewhat responsibility in his role as the sheriff. 01:25:46.46 Leonard Um, yeah, right. 01:26:06.39 Cameron Is this like the um, you know what is he's the opposite of um, what's his name. The the guy from stranger things who plays the sheriff. Yeah, he's he's the opposite of yeah ah yeah, hoop hos I Forget the character Ne hooper. Yeah yeah. 01:26:11.46 Leonard Out A hoover. 01:26:13.97 Dave Um, no hobbs or whatever hoot Hooper Hooper yeah 01:26:22.58 Cameron And I just I just distinctly remember 1 scene where he wakes up and immediately grabs a loaded gun off the bedside table I go that's not a good example to be setting as the head of law enforcement in this town. Um, but yeah, a point there for paul good job Paul you knew there was going to be a child in the house or you just knew in general. 01:26:28.00 Leonard Um, in this way. 01:26:41.19 Cameron Were people who were maybe not the most stable in the house yourself included and you took proper steps doesn't work when there's a monster around unfortunately. Um Paul quickly arrives on the scene himself sees sees Dan just lying in the entrance to the shed not moving heads over and. 01:27:01.54 Cameron Yeah I found this very funny because for me this is what I would do in a stealth game is I would leave a body in a very obvious position. So I could then sneak up on someone when they're going to inspect it. Ah and it's exactly what the Wedigo does it. 01:27:12.89 Leonard Yep. 01:27:16.00 Cameron It sees Paul ah walking up to check on Dan and then immediately gauze Paul from behind it throws him into the shed and then paces around to some spooky stuff and then it's making proper use of its physical size and strength the shed is a flimsy wooden building. It just sort of bust down the wall and. Ah, Paul gets an antler right through the shoulder which essentially puts him out of the fight for the rest of the film. He's not doing anything important from this point onwards? Um, ah yeah, ah, the the wendigo then takes aid and and retrieves Lucas. As well. Ah, and takes them out to the mine which is where Lucas was pretty sure they'd be Julia is not going to lose this kid after she's invested so much in making sure he's happy and safe and. Drives herself and Paul over the mine paul can't make it inside so Julia goes in with a handgun and ah a flareir I'm pretty sure or Torch 1 of the 2 a lighting solution. Um, and we get sort of the not her phone. No no, why would you have your phone. 01:28:22.50 Dave Can Not not her phone. 01:28:27.29 Leonard Not her phone. Ah yeah, she she in fact, uses the police in in a clearly eighty yard line she clearly uses ah Paul's police ah her radio to call an ambulance for all. 01:28:30.65 Cameron He. 01:28:36.20 Cameron Um, yes, yes, yeah, that was fun. Um, yeah, ah heads heads into the mine and quickly finds. Ah Lucas just hiding behind. Stacks of sheet metal and he's begging her to be quiet and just leave and she pans the light over to the right and there is just a dead bear in the middle of being devoured by the window. We finally get a proper full shot of it. Ah, this is a great looking monster. 01:29:09.64 Leonard Um, it is. 01:29:12.72 Cameron Now that we get to see it in all its glory. Oh yeah, ah man oh yeah, this entire time and probably the reason Lucas is convinced. It's still his dad is. It's wearing his dad's face like a cheap Halloween mask. 01:29:12.91 Dave Um, and and the worst like turn around and look at the light reveal. 01:29:30.82 Leonard Yeah, ah, which is once it's a fantastic reveal but it drives me insane because the continuity doesn't work on it because his face was literally split and half. So so I'm just. 01:29:34.54 Cameron Yeah, yeah, is it's not quite right? It's not quite right. 01:29:47.79 Dave Well I think it burst through and then split the the rest of the head because the the the husk they found was peeled open like a flower and it may have just like popped off the front bit. 01:29:48.37 Leonard So I'm just like I'm like oh man, that's. 01:29:51.70 Cameron Through maybe. 01:30:00.19 Leonard Right? maybe but I did go back and look because like the skin on his like jaw rips when the antlers bust through and I'm like. 01:30:00.36 Cameron Potentially yeah. 01:30:13.27 Dave Yeah I mean his its does his teeth in it because they were like oh we can identify it by the teeth. 01:30:17.55 Leonard By his teeth. Yeah so I'm just so yeah, so I'm just like a man. It's really cool but I'm almost positive that that doesn't line up with the continuity that you've already established in your film but I still really like it. 01:30:20.90 Cameron Um, with the teeth wolf. Yeah, the around me. 01:30:22.39 Dave Yeah. 01:30:31.90 Dave I mean they could have just like left the jaw off like that they had the little terrible mustache and the forehead that they thought you would need but they were maybe like maybe that would look funny so they didn't do it that way. 01:30:32.52 Cameron Yeah, and yeah, the facial hair's got to be there now. No, you need that. But it yeah it it. It was. 01:30:36.65 Leonard Yeah. 01:30:42.56 Leonard Um, if if. 01:30:47.83 Leonard Um. 01:30:49.12 Cameron It was probably partially that and they wanted it to be as recognizable as possible figure you you know there'd be someone who wasn't paying attention the first five minutes went wait whose face is that um make making it make it pretty cold. 01:31:01.18 Leonard Ah, all all I'm saying filmmakers is hey if you want somebody to to keep an eye on your horrible bodily mutilation ah continuity in your films. 01:31:04.29 Dave Um. 01:31:11.48 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah, it's in your pocket very convenient. Um, ah but yeah, no, this is this is a really great design. It is this massively tall. But so. 01:31:11.54 Leonard Just look me up I've got an eye for I've got an eye for it. Ah. 01:31:28.68 Cameron Cadaverous and malnourished like it is itself more or less skin and bones. Um like the the only thing of substance about it is this enormous crown rack of antlers. 01:31:33.50 Leonard E. 01:31:42.18 Leonard And. 01:31:44.64 Cameron That look like it looks like it should make up like half its body weight just based on the volume of the antlers itself. Um, and yeah, yeah, once again, you see that burning heart ah visible through the ribs and has again everything about it is it. It is sort of famine personified here. It is. Tightly drawn skin like you can see the the tops of the hip bones like jutting out and contracted in the stomach has actually a little pad to it because in in hey in final stages malnourishment your stomach begins to blote as your body eats itself. Fun facts kids. Um, it it. Everything about it screams terribly wrong supernatural manifestation of hunger and I love it and also it's at its weakest right now which is why it doesn't just instantly kill Choya like it did with everyone else because it was literally just eating. 01:32:36.81 Leonard Yes. 01:32:43.10 Cameron Ah, so she has a fighting chance gets off a few shots with her gun and it just backs it out of her hands and it it comes down to the handto hand as it were she she's in a mind so she's fighting it with a sharpened steel pipe off cut and. 01:32:58.45 Cameron I will I'll see this hey Hark harkeking back to humanity's oldest weapon I love the spear spear is good. Love a good spear scene. Um, yeah, yes, yeah. 01:33:05.91 Dave It's well spear and fire. She has like the torch and it's or it's a flare I Love There's ah this fantastic like juxtaposition between she's stabbed it like I think twice out to the the thing sticking in its out of its ribs. 01:33:06.93 Leonard Yeah, she like Grabs a flare. Yeah. 01:33:18.81 Cameron Um, yes, yeah, yeah, it's worn out. 01:33:23.71 Dave But it it falls back and it's it's tired and so it's just it's just kind of sitting there panting but then she's tired so she's just sitting there. They're both just panting and worn out from this fight. 01:33:31.60 Leonard A. 01:33:37.29 Cameron Yeah, it's really good like the thing is still incredibly scary, but they sort of sell that this is the 1 times a human could potentially reasonably beat it. Um, although again, not 1 human. 01:33:46.42 Leonard Right. 01:33:52.27 Cameron Tag team just when all hope appears lost. It's Lucas coming in hot with the pocket knife and stabbing it in the back bridge some sort of gets it gets its last gasp out of it as it were and then Julia flips it over and very aggressively. Pulls its rib cage open and gets that heart out because she remembers from ah from Warren Stokakes got to extinguish the heart which does physically burn her hands. It's it's really is is this orb of it looks like somewhat hot iron. It's got that orange hue to it. 01:34:19.24 Leonard Yes. 01:34:29.50 Cameron But it has like these brambles and bracken growing over it. It's It's very clear like it's a manufactured nature spirity body thing. It's not like naturally biological in any way it is definitely beyond Beyond doubt any Doubt supernatural. 01:34:30.24 Leonard And. 01:34:49.30 Cameron Um, I kind of love how that looks. But then we have a brief moment of Triumph and then we hit the the real moment of tragedy which is because the monster is an amor for spirit and not the physical creature itself. The spirit. Ghosts its way fifteen feet across the cave over to aden and immediately possesses him and he starts glowing and screeching to high heaven because now it's in his body just waiting for the chance to chow down which is very unfortunate. Um. We get. We get sort of a very impassioned pleas from Lucas who obviously went through all of this more or less to protect his little brother and his dad and has just given up on his father because he sort of came to terms with fact that he's not in the monster anymore. And doesn't want to lose his brother and Julia makes the the very clear point that well he's not going to get better ever. It's better to put him out of his misery um look this might be un intentional little rough reading on a film that's mostly about trauma and abuse saying. 01:36:00.29 Leonard Yeah. 01:36:00.71 Cameron Sometimes it's too bad. You just got to put you just got to put them down I'm not the perfect perfect note to end on there but definitely hitting the the tragedy note that sort of overshadows this whole town. But maybe you could have stated that better. Yeah. 01:36:11.63 Dave Well, it's it's not only that but she's having to sell it to Lucas and going I need you to understand that we can't fix him because Lucas's whole thing is oh he's sick. He'll get better. 01:36:18.47 Cameron Yeah, um, he's yeah, which is a good and healthy attitude to have yeah. 01:36:29.94 Dave And that was that was also the really rough part. Ah because when when he had returned from the mine. Um, the 2 boys were just like that their dad hadn't had just the last vestiges of himself that he built those locks and locked. He's like. 01:36:45.27 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah, and yeah, but he he he held on. Yeah yeah. 01:36:46.67 Dave You boys lock me in here and then you know, no matter what don't let me out but he's he's already like just all messed up and and the boy is sick. Um, probably from the Meth fumes is what I'm thinking because he went into the mine. 01:37:01.90 Cameron Um, partially at least? yeah yeah, yeah, it's yeah yeah, ah like the the running thing throughout the film seems to be that the spirit can possess you if you're. 01:37:04.83 Dave To go find an ad and they're in an area where you have to have those masks on. 01:37:19.43 Cameron Physically injured by the monster. So I guess the implication is or an arigli week site. Yeah yeah, because like at the beginning of the film clearly Frank got injured by the wendago when he fought it in the mines. 01:37:21.26 Dave Or just at a really weak state I think might be the case. 01:37:36.86 Cameron And then we had those same embers in the air as Aidan stepped into the mind of himself. So it's potentially implied. It also just sort of attacked him before frank managed to fight it off and get them both home. Ah, or yeah, he he was just physically or spiritual I don't know weak enough that. He became sort of the next host in line at some point but Frank hey got to say this terrible father really held it together for his kids right at the end like for the for the last month of physically starving to death only able to eat raw meat and roadkill. 01:38:04.67 Leonard Yeah. 01:38:14.46 Cameron Still throughout the film up until the principal came in recognized Lucas when he came into the attic and kept back enough to make sure he wouldn't hurt him and obviously didn't hurt Aidan because Aidan's the next host. But you know like he. Held it together for his boys for a long time in the end under what I would call unbearable situations. Ah, it must not feel great. 01:38:41.10 Dave Um, yeah I thought now and one of my what will my ah the the worst parts I felt was when Lucas is trying to like keep the whole thing together and it's just him and his brother and but aan's getting real sick and so he. 01:38:49.75 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 01:38:58.90 Dave Ghost to try to tell his dad who's you know is just his dad to him. Um, but his dad is already way too far gone. He opens the door and he's like hey a didn't sit and then his dad just like yanks him into the thing and shuts the door. It's like oh yeah, that's terrible. 01:39:06.18 Cameron And. 01:39:11.96 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah, it doesn't doesn't have the capacity to explain anymore is just going to do what needs to be done. Yeah yeah. 01:39:18.39 Dave So yeah, and and until it because that was like a little flashback bit. Um, but until that point I had thought that Aidan was dead and Lucas was just seeing his like little when to go ghost. 01:39:31.10 Cameron Ah, yeah, okay, okay yeah I can see it. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 01:39:36.78 Dave Because he because you know he's just up in the attic with the dad. So why wasn't he being eaten. It was ah you know there's no wasn't explaining it at that point but he kept bringing him candies and you know actual food as opposed to just roadkill but his brother eventually couldn't even eat that. 01:39:49.21 Cameron Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, eventually sort of spilled over that same edge of physical corruption. Um, yeah. 01:39:59.52 Dave Yeah I mean he he was already. Um, so the thing that's we is like I wonder if there's just more than 1 window to go spirit because even when the window go was already um in frank. 01:40:08.55 Cameron Um, yeah. 01:40:13.95 Cameron So yeah, yeah. 01:40:16.21 Dave Like it already had manifested. Um, when when Lucas went to go give Aidan like the candy or the thing he was giving him ah Lucas is like bleeding out of his eyes with that the tar kind of blood. 01:40:21.45 Cameron And. 01:40:30.64 Cameron Yeah, yeah, ah, it's reasonable to think that because I think it's entirely possible because first off there, there was 1 initial physical creature in the mind at the beginning that is never wrapped up. 01:40:40.64 Leonard Right. 01:40:46.60 Cameron whether whether frank managed to kill it when it attacked him and Aidan or whether it got out and that's the reason half of Carey's body was out in the woods like a couple miles out from the mine or you know an animal could have also just pulled it out there. Whatever but. 01:40:55.18 Leonard In her. 01:41:04.80 Cameron It's the film sort of leaves that untouched which I think looping back to that thing you said a while earlier lenard about this could be a shorter film. You could definitely have done a sort of 40 minute version of this film that ends with instead of the principal going into the house. The police going into the house and taking out. 01:41:21.97 Leonard Exactly yep. 01:41:23.39 Cameron Frank before he transforms but still having the open possibility of all but where's the original monster because it was not dealt with in the mind we never found it in there. So It's just out in the woods now. Um and leave leave that open for. Sqls or whatever you want to do or longer forms but it could have worked like that. Definitely um, but yeah. 01:41:45.86 Dave Um, yeah, well and then um Lucas when he's drawing all of his pictures. Ah, it's it's of Frank and Aidan but they're both when to go. 01:41:52.50 Cameron Um. 01:41:56.86 Cameron Yes, yeah, they're they're both messed up. yeah yeah yeah I could absolutely believe an interpretation of this where there are 2 or more spirits going around which. 01:42:00.70 Dave Like they both have that there's a big horned and a little horned guy. 01:42:14.71 Cameron Ah, until dawnny is like oh there's only one once a psych. There's like 9 running around. Um yeah, but you know in the end of it Julia Stabs ah stabs an eight year old to death. 01:42:17.30 Dave Um, yeah. 01:42:30.91 Cameron Before he can turn into a real literal horror movie monster and that's surely not good for her own progress on her past trauma. But at least they're all still alive. She and Paul are taking care of Lucas. Formally I guess at this point they presumably adopted him or got guardianship or something. Um, but the the film ends with them sort of out on the rocky shore of the lake there um of the ocean I can't tell it's it's a big water and it's a lake I do. 01:43:03.91 Leonard Oh it's a it's a lake It is like. 01:43:05.47 Dave Well. 01:43:08.63 Cameron I don't I don't know american geography I don't know what's up in Oregon um, yeah, they're they're out sort of walking with Lucas there Paul has his arm all slung up because he's been terribly injured and he and Julia are talking about. You know you know, eventually what if this happens to. Lucas as well. He's like it's like raising a tiger in your house and could you kill something you love so like this it's going to be fine and she goes to take care of Lucas Wipes a little schmutz off his face which is it just chocolate has he been secretly leaking goo. Um. And ah Paul who is injured by the wendergo's physical form in the background starts having a bit of a coughing fit and starts coughing up the tar and has a little leaking out of his eyes as this this saga is clearly not permanently dealt with because. 01:44:06.60 Dave Um, um, you you can't so when um when the old sheriff is telling them what's going on. Ah, he's like you the best you can do is tear out. 01:44:06.36 Cameron I Guess to to deal with the way when to go you need to do a perfect, no hit run. Um, yeah, um. 01:44:11.25 Leonard Right. 01:44:23.41 Cameron Yeah, yeah. 01:44:24.30 Dave Heart but that just frees it up to go find another host so when she when she killed Aidan it's just she just set it free again. It's it's like um, what is that fallen. 01:44:25.62 Leonard Right? so. 01:44:32.49 Cameron Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah I mean again, hewing hewing close to the law there and I get ah I kind of like the contrast with this and until dawn where in until dawn. The solution was just. 01:44:39.51 Leonard Um, yes, with Denzel Washington star starring Denzel Washington 01:44:40.86 Dave Yes, yes. 01:44:56.88 Cameron Get people infected and then lock the moms like but we can't let them suffer so we're going to kill them and you know and in the moment compassionate compassionate decision is probably not the best 1 in the situation. But ah, it's what they've got and so it ends on that sort of hook of polls definitely going to turn eventually. Sometime in the relatively near future. This town is probably just as doomed as as it as it would have been if they didn't start reopening the mines anyway and that's that's our lovely little slice of depressing hell. 01:45:30.27 Leonard Yep, that's antlers that yeah, it's It's a it's a bummer like I said like I I am I have become a a a huge proponent of the ah quiet desperation horror film. 01:45:34.82 Cameron Mmm. 01:45:44.96 Leonard Um, those seem to be the ones that resonate with me the most like I had my fun with like Freddie and Jason and your slashers and all that nonsense when I was a kid but as an adult like this is like like oh no like the supernatural is just like and like. 01:45:49.67 Cameron Um. 01:45:51.97 Cameron Yeah. 01:46:02.50 Leonard Gravy on top of like the misery ah pot pie that is these people's lives beforehand. 01:46:06.72 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah, exactly it's it was already a terrible place to live and now we've just got a famine monster walking around every 2 to six weeks it's fine this is just the quiet desperate situation. We live in but no, 1 ne's got a job. Everyone's dealing meth and also there's a monster out in the mines that yeah yeah, yeah. 01:46:25.74 Leonard The bright. 01:46:31.18 Leonard Like then a ghost a spirit does. Yeah. 01:46:39.33 Cameron The the ghost of mother nature objecting to the coal industry. Yeah um, and cannibal isn't a That's just bad. Don't do it? Um, it does gives you the jitters. Oh. 01:46:40.80 Leonard Right. 01:46:42.67 Dave And cannibalism. 01:46:48.24 Leonard Makes a stink. 01:46:57.57 Cameron Speaking of canniism my cat is attempting to eat my hand. Oh um, stop to out. You've been behaving all recording. She's family accounts. It's it's societal cannibalism If it's even if it's not species based. 01:47:03.19 Leonard Cameron Cameron is a cat confirmed here on this podcast. Thank you. 01:47:03.69 Dave Yes. 01:47:16.96 Cameron Ah, but yeah I really liked this film I waited a long time to watch it between knowing it was coming and then the extra year and a half waiting for it to actually come out. Ah but I really enjoyed it. It's it's good to have Obama horror every now and then and it had. Ah, really great creature design. It touched on a lot of deeper themes than a lot of horror movies. Do a lot of monster movies are just here's the monster you could potentially interpret as being about whatever. But really, it's a monster whereas here. It's very clearly. Tied into what is going on in the town and the main character's own particular traumas ah it was it was a lot of fun for me. What do you guys? think so. 01:48:03.51 Dave Um, yeah I I enjoyed this so I hadn't heard anything about I Just missed the boat on this one? Um, so this was the first mention of it I mean I think I saw the little um preview on. 01:48:09.74 Cameron 6 01:48:19.75 Dave Ah, Hulu or is where I watched it? Um, but like little blurb and was like oh it's probably should be my watch list but hadn't um, read into what it was and so I was pleasantly surprised and just really I mean. 01:48:19.80 Cameron Yeah, so. 01:48:25.81 Cameron Yeah. 01:48:38.44 Dave I Really enjoyed the atmosphere and the the cinematography I but I liked that more than anything else. But um, yeah, again soccer for practical effects and I thought those was just a really fun ah version of the window go like the actual monster. 01:48:41.82 Cameron Mm. 01:48:53.97 Leonard And. 01:48:55.79 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah, yeah, it was pretty good. Um and landed your thoughts. Besides why desperation being good. 01:49:01.99 Leonard Yeah, one. Ah he Yes, once again, ah to Echo Dave Um, really what loved Cinematography the mood the tone like how long they hold on shots I think the acting was Fantastic. I I Do in fact, like I I know I've I've nit picked a little um but I did really enjoy this monster Our monster I did enjoy the monster but I also enjoyed the movie. Um, it is when it like gets into like the very. 01:49:28.92 Cameron Um. 01:49:33.18 Leonard Trophy Horror movie stuff where that I kind of like roll my eyes and wait for the sequence to be over but that's not too much of it. Um, yeah so I do have to agree like this is ah it was a surprise. Um because I had heard about it and then I didn't hear anything else about it. 01:49:35.49 Cameron Um, yeah, yeah. 01:49:52.62 Leonard Um, so I it was nice to have a like a nice little surprise like this and one of the things I like aside from the film itself I think like I really appreciate. Ah. Gimma de toros ah use of of his producer status for films like this because like it feels like he's fostering talent by allowing films like like because you know we've got this. There was like Mama so many years ago. Um. 01:50:12.22 Cameron M. Yeah, yeah. 01:50:24.82 Cameron M. 01:50:27.76 Leonard That you know wasn't great but still had some interesting ideas and had like interesting visuals and act that it like interesting execution and stuff So I like appreciate like the fostering of this creative talent more than anything else. So I'm I'm happy that this movie Exists. And I Also think that it's really good. 01:50:50.40 Cameron Excellent and glad to hear it all right? Well, that's that go watch antlers. We've told you the whole story but it is visually with the cinematography and this and the practical effects. It is really worth a watch even if you spoil on how it goes. Ah. And we'll get into some ad men so you can find the show surprisingly still on Twitter at Mon Underscore demonster where we give updates when episodes come out and if you want to send us any feedback you can send it to us through there. Um, you can find. Me surprisingly also still on Twitter at night unscored Twitter this night without the k if you want to see my cat giving the signature look of superiority that is now up there because she gave me some very good shots earlier today. Ah Dave where can we find you online. 01:51:45.39 Dave I am on Twitter at senting on underscore plus which will be in the show notes as always and Twitter is is kind is still working so I'm still there. Ah Leonard how about yourself. 01:51:53.77 Cameron So yeah. 01:51:57.15 Leonard Yes, you can also find me on Twitter because I will anchor my body to that stupid hell site until it no longer exists I refuse I actively refuse and you can find me at Dr Faustus Dead you can also find me. 01:52:05.96 Cameron Um, yeah. 01:52:16.60 Leonard At umbranots productions. Ah but more importantly, ah you can also find ah my video essay and just general video work on Youtube by searching Dr Faust is dead or umbranot's productions and cameron wait. You already did yours. 01:52:23.37 Cameron So. 01:52:31.26 Cameron Yes, yeah I already went. Yeah I tricked you Oh God no. 01:52:34.50 Dave Is recursive. We're just gonna fractal into infinity. Yeah, we got you got too close now you know that it's just a loop. Yeah. 01:52:35.24 Leonard You all? Wow I Almost think. 01:52:40.19 Leonard Yeah, we've we've become that fractal waterfall. It'll be. 01:52:47.89 Cameron Oh no, all right? Well thank you so much for listening. We hope you've enjoyed this one and we'll catch you on the next episode Bye everybody. 01:52:56.91 Dave But mebye folks. 01:53:00.32 Leonard Goodbye.