mergeconflict395-1
===

[00:00:00] James: Welcome back everyone to Merge Conflict, your weekly developer podcast, where we talk about spatial devices, such as the Apple Vision Pro every single week. And, uh, the day came, the day went. In fact, it's been over a week since the last podcast, technically. Like the fun, funny part is technically it released like last, last week, but we're recording this podcast.

And since then, Frank and I haven't talked between when. We've talked about pre ordering the Apple vision pro and Frank may be ordering one. Me may be ordering one. And then us recording this podcast, but by the time this podcast comes out, it'll have been like 10 days and then no one really cares anymore.

But Frank Krueger, before we get into today's topic, let's just do a little Apple vision pro update. How was your buy one? What 

[00:00:51] Frank: happened? Yeah, I did buy one. I got very angry at like 4 30 AM when my alarm went off. I'm like, who set an alarm in this house? Oh, I did. Oh, it's the gift that keeps on giving. Yeah.

So, after all my hemming and hawing, I decided, well, I, I really am into this spatial world and I at least got to give it a try, you know, if I hate it, if it is the worst device I've ever used. Probably, maybe, return it, but I'm going to give it a shot, at least. Um, I wanted to try it. I should say they asked way too many questions in the purchasing thing.

So, like, and I had a little bit of indecision while I was buying it. And, uh, I decided not to get any lenses for my eyes because I didn't want the complication. Then I couldn't decide if I was going to pick it up at the store or have it delivered. And then every appointment I kept picking for the store kept shifting.

Uh, it was, uh, it was, it was hard buying my overpriced Apple shiny device. 

[00:02:00] James: Yeah, I was going to ask you about that. So. Now, you have contacts currently in 

[00:02:05] Frank: your eyeballs? I, I put contacts in my eyeballs. Uh, normally I do wear contacts. Uh, I, I was just going on a little bit of a hiatus wearing glasses for a while there.

Um, I, my glasses are super old and I hate them and so I much prefer contacts. But, um, my contact prescription, uh, had expired. But, I didn't know a fancy thing. Have you heard of this thing called the 

[00:02:30] James: internet? Uh, I have not heard of it. What kind of newfangled technology is this, Frank? And what can you possibly do if you use your phone 

[00:02:37] Frank: line with a modem and you dial up into a service, perhaps CompuServe or AOL, you can get an online eye exam.

What? 

[00:02:49] James: Shut your face. 

[00:02:50] Frank: It's hilarious. So like there's a little slider and you make it, you, you resize the webpage to the size of your credit card. And then you're supposed to get a tape measure, and you measure out 10 feet, and you don't cheat, and then cheat, and you put your toes behind 10 feet, and then you cover up one eye, and you take a little test, it, it, um, it links with your phone, and so on your phone, you're answering things that are being displayed on your computer monitor device.

And through that, I feel like I failed the test miserably, but, um, they let me keep using my old prescription. Uh, what it really made me feel like is I should probably go and get a real eye exam, but for 15, I can highly recommend online eye exams. Worked out great for me. 

[00:03:37] James: That's crazy. Wow. I did not know that.

That is wild. What will they think of next? What, soon you'll be able to order socks and underwear through the internet. They'll show up in your door in under 24 hours. Shut up. Wow. 

[00:03:48] Frank: Yeah. Yeah, it was, it was tricky when buying the Pro because they really ask you, like, do you wear corrective lenses? Do you want to do any of this stuff?

And I just like, Oh, I really don't want to go down this path. And then if I ever do have friends that want to use the device, I don't want to force it into my eyes only. So 

[00:04:08] James: yeah, take the lenses in and out and all this stuff. I guess also the question is you, if you use other devices with your contacts in, has it been okay?

[00:04:19] Frank: Oh, yeah. Contacts are absolutely fine. And the other devices, honestly, with the other devices, I just smash them in with my glasses on and it's fine, too. It's just, it's probably not the Apple thing of having, uh, zero light leakage. We'll see how good these things actually are. But, um, did you do the face scan or did you not?

[00:04:40] James: Okay, so. I would say that this is one of the hardest decisions for devices I've had to make. Uh, Heather and I had many discussions that she probably did not care to have with me about my angst over purchasing or not purchasing. We talked about you a lot. We talked about app development a lot. We talked about how.

It would work where I would use it. Could she use it? This, that. Then we also came to the conclusion that this device is the same price as the car that I drive. And that is always something that's fascinating. And that's like, but it could be a. Business write off. I'm like, that's true, but you know, you know, so we went back and forth.

I decided not to get it. Mm-Hmm. . Um, it was very much like up until Thursday night and I had the alarm set, I had everything. Yeah. And went back and forth a lot and. I think that it is because, one, to basically try yours, I think, and I don't really have any other devices and the ones that I've tried, I haven't really enjoyed that much.

And I was trying to think of use cases, and I think the thing. That got me, um, was, was there actually something I would like to develop in the next one to six months? And I can't really think of that or have the time for it compared to that was one of the, your main reasons that you were buying it besides that your early adopter and business and stuff, but you actually had app ideas.

And then the second part was, there was a lot of news last week and this week, just about. What apps were going to be supported and not supported and what experiences were going to be supported on it day one, even though Apple has been claiming 1 million apps at launch, that was in their documentation.

Uh, there, however, you know, it's like. Netflix isn't going to have an app and Spotify is not going to happen. YouTube's not going to have an app. And I read an entire article that the killer app that has to be perfect is Safari, and if it's not, then there's going to be a lot of issues. So I went back and forth and I think Heather and I talked about, you know, if I did try and it was amazing, then maybe, but maybe it's seeming like with the battery with other stuff, is it.

You know, a wait till gen two, gen three type of thing. However, the one thing I did really want to do is the crazy facial sans stuff that you had to go through. How was that experience? 

[00:07:17] Frank: Oh, what a segue going from all that. Um, the scanning was fine. Um, it felt like setting up face ID. You just put your head and you, you rotate it around.

And I think it decided I'm a medium. I don't know if it was just deciding small, medium or large. I could have told him I'm always a medium. I'm a medium and everything. Um, But they scanned me instead. Yeah. Uh, to your point, I think it's still a giant mystery box. I don't, I don't know if it's a cool device or not because, um, yeah, the, the previous VR headsets I've had before were always fun for a week or two, and then they don't, aren't fun after that.

And so it's a real question of, is this thing going to break the mold or not? Um, it, it, it's whether. It's whether you can do anything other than just games in it, because I don't want a 3, 500 gaming device. And it is tricky as an app developer, though, like, we've talked about it on the show a million times, but I've had like, four or five okay ish app ideas for it, and each one that I've tried to implement With the APIs Apple provides us has been very hard and rough.

The apps haven't come out as good as I want them to come out. And so it's, it's a, it's a tricky, scary device for me, but, um, I've decided to just throw a little bit of caution to the wind and just give her a 

[00:08:46] James: try. I mean, I, you know, this first round I was in that many devices, it's going to be early adopters.

You know, I think that it'll evolve, continue to evolve, you know, and pricing will come down, give it another five, whatever, three, two, three, whatever years is my assumption, right? There'll be a non proto device and all this other things that will be out there. And maybe if it's lighter and smaller, maybe that's something that'll get me.

I think the other part was, I wasn't really sure, like the interchangeability of. You know, do Heather and I both need one in the house? Mm-Hmm. Is it weird if only one of us has a house? Can she use my device? Does she have her own device? You know, is there a difference of if we're just watching tv, like we already have a tv, like, you know, I don't need a tv.

But you know, would it be weird if like, I'm watching Netflix and then like she's watching tv. Like, can she hear my show? Like I don't, you know, a lot of unknown questions and I think the thing that reconfirm my decision. And I'll be really fascinated once you get it. Are you a February 2nd person? 

[00:09:44] Frank: Oh, I'm not because I had to do delivery.

And because I live on an island, I don't get February 2nd. Um, but it was funny, even if I did store pickup, the February 2nd dates went by faster than I could make up my mind. I'm what? Time slot to go into. Oh no. I kept missing, like I'd made up my mind, like, Oh, I'm going to drive down to Seattle and get my February 2nd shipment.

Like, no, that the dates had slid already already to the fourth. So I was like, Oh, I get it. If I'm on the fourth, I'll just have it delivered. 

[00:10:14] James: Yeah. That makes sense. I'm just going to have it delivered. Well, I watched the, uh, uh, that Friday Apple or Saturday, Apple put out a bunch of videos on YouTube and on.

That the vision pro thing, which was walkthroughs and they did a video, which was. Introducing the Apple vision pro to someone that's never even heard of the Apple vision pro or seen it ever in their life actor. Uh, and you know, they kind of walked through the same demo. I think that you get in the store and also what we talked about last week from the reporters that were on it.

And it was very beautiful, right? They did the whole thing where you can see what they're seeing and all the things like very, very beautiful. A good walkthrough is very orchestrated and. Because I don't have an app idea, right. It needs app ideas because everything that I saw was like, yeah, you know, I wasn't sold and it's hard because a lot of what I read in the news and listened in the news was what is the killer app?

Right. Like. If they're not trying to make it games or trying to make it entertainment, what are the, what are the things that it's trying to do? And that was the problem for it, right? I think we talked about this, you know, when there's a new Nintendo system, it's either like a new Mario game or a new Zelda game.

I need it. I need it right now. Like the Xbox come out, it's going to be like a new Halo or a new Forza. You know what I mean? Like, Oh, well, I need it right now. You know, what is this? It's a killer app thing that I need and I know it will come like for for for Quest. Right, it was Beat Saber, like just yeah, it'd be like, like a no brainer.

Like, okay, Beat Saber. That's cool. Right. Uh, and I don't know. It's like de facto, but like. You could be like, Oh wow, like I get it. Like I put this thing on, like I'm, I'm doing this thing. Like, cool. I get it. Right. And I think that was exactly when you saw the Nintendo Wii, right. Way back in the day. Like it had this, you know, little Wiimote and your sensors and it was Wii sports.

You're like. Oh my gosh, I get it. I'm like hitting a golf ball. I'm hitting the tennis. And that's like the Wii U came out and they couldn't really unlock. And it wasn't like, what's the killer app for this functionality? And then I think when the switch came out, there's a lot built in there, but it was really the docking then they had the killer game for the killer portability at the perfect time.

So that it really speaks to just software that's important. And I'm a little surprised. From the jump that there isn't something just a little bit more, or maybe it's just hard to, maybe it's there and maybe it's just hard to demo and see it without putting it on your face. And I'm not positive. 

[00:12:58] Frank: Yeah. I don't know.

Yeah. You know, a lot of the AR app ideas, I think I complained about when it was, when the SDK first came out is they're, they're not giving a lot of access to. Developers of like the video feed from it. So here is an augmented reality device. where apps can't see the world. Like, how, how am I supposed to augment the world?

And you're, you, the only things that you have are the tiny droplets of data that Apple is going to give you. And none of those droplets even work in the simulator. So it's almost like. Even to know if my terrible idea I don't even know if I can write my idea until I have this device almost, because there are just so many missing APIs from the simulator and everything that I haven't been able to demo a lot of my ideas.

And so I almost just want the device to just prove to myself, okay, is this terrible sword game I have in my head, is, is that viable? Or is it like a six month game and I don't want to write a six month game because those take forever. Um, versus is Apple just going to release a lot of 2D apps that, Happen to be spatial computing because you can dock them to walls around your house.

Maybe that's all the device will be is docking apps to walls around your house, but maybe that'll be enough too. We'll find out. I think 

[00:14:26] James: that was the one thing I wanted to dive deeper in because like you've played around with the simulator a lot and you just talked about like your need and want for the device, I guess, you know, first question is did Apple somehow make a mistake by not having.

A developer program for this device of some sort. I mean, I know that you could go to Cupertino and do this stuff, but do you think that that is something that they should have offered up or no, I don't know. It's a tricky one. 

[00:15:02] Frank: Uh, I, I, I. I can see why they didn't as a company, because they didn't want press coming out about this whole new device, and it'd be developers that are saying the press, because even the strongest NDA, we would all talk about it.

Oh yeah. We'd use obtuse language, but we would talk about it. Yeah. Um, but as a developer, absolutely, they made a mistake. They should have released it to us because, uh. I was hoping to have some day one apps, but as I was complaining last week, there's probably no way I'm going to have a day one app on this thing, just because even though I have one or two apps that seem somewhat stable in the simulator, I still have no idea how they feel or how they actually look in the real world, and to even release like a little 5 app, I have got to at least try it on my own device before I'm going to charge 5 for it.

Even if it's a simple, small app, I just, I can't charge without actually seeing it run on the real thing. Um, so yeah, I, I think a lot of developers were left behind or day one's not going to be great because I don't know anyone who got to go to Cupertino this time. Um, I didn't get to go, but, uh, I don't know, no one on Twitter has been bragging that they went and they have the best.

App out there. 

[00:16:29] James: Yeah, I think it's super valid. It's, it's really hard. I mean, I think you're right from a Apple perspective of, of, of this new hardware. And then on the developer's perspective, obviously they did pair up with certain companies because there are experiences built for it, you know, internally, externally, et cetera.

Uh, which is great. However, it doesn't really seem like at mass, like even a lot of the applications they showed, like, okay, here's the mail app. And it's kind of like the mail app. I don't know. It's just the iPad app, uh, that's there. And that to me is hard because. If it was just another similar device, you know, let's say that they came out with a foldable iPhone or a trifold iPhone or something like that.

We can envision with the simulator and with our current app, we talked about this before, how our app is going to run their problem with this is. We can envision somewhat of how our 2d app is going to be there. But what thing that you're talking about is I want to create a, they're now calling native vision pro apps, right?

So this is, this is the new, this is the buzzword is, are you creating a native vision, vision OS app? And. To be able to do that, to get those additional APIs and to create this type of experience, you're going to need to tap in somewhat into the Vision OS SDK and experience that you're bundling up. And obviously not a lot of people have had access to that.

So I think the question then is from your perspective of someone that runs a business, owns a business, wants to make money as a business, there's two things that you can be doing now is one, trying to build an app for this device. And the other part is having your existing apps. Run on this device. Now, Apple defaulted every single application in, it's in and baby, you know, and now I forget if they did this for Mac or for the Mac catalyst stuff, but I'm pretty sure they did when, uh, the M1 Macs came out and they could run iOS apps.

I think they're all just on now these companies. Other companies, some app developers, Netflix is of the world. The YouTube is of the world. So, uh, Spotify, the world, the ones that have come out and said, Hey, you have to use our app through the browser. Uh, they were not even allowing their iPad app. That means they went in and unchecked that box.

So technically, because we're iOS developers, I guess we're vision OS developers and Mac developers as well with one little checkbox. But my question to you is because Frank Krueger cares about quality and experience, and it's not like you're able to actually, if you test on the same, it's not the same.

You're not. Doing the pinching and the looking with your eyes. That was actually kind of cool. You could look at your eyes and you can just like, do stuff like you're not manipulating circuits with your eyes inside the simulator. So the question I have for you is And we know that the angst about building an actual experience, but what about your existing experiences?

How do you feel about putting iCircuit or Kalka or, uh, Continuous, you know, first IDE, Envision Pro OS, um, on this device without being able to test beyond that? Can you even test those devices on a simulator? 

[00:19:51] Frank: Uh, I'm sure if you were more clever than I, you could probably get it to, you could figure out the install service used to get it into the simulator and all of that.

I haven't been able to figure it out, so I haven't been able to test mine on the simulator, but it's a great open question of how do iOS apps run on this thing, because there's stuff I've struggled with doing in the Vision Simulator, like, Pinch to zoom, which is a huge natural operation in iOS. All our apps support it.

Well, I should say, Kalka and Continuous are a little tricky because they're very text heavy apps. So I'm really curious to see how good that keyboard is in there because this is supposed to be like a spatial computing productivity device. If you think about it, it should be like Infinite monitors, 360 degrees of monitors, how much computing could I could have a window here, and a window there, and a window there is going to be the ultimate workstation and all that.

And so I do hope that we can have things like IDEs and text heavy apps because those are about. Those are a part of computing. That said, I'm not sure how well they're going to translate over, so I'm, I want to see what they're going to be like. Um, for circuits, that one, that one is a little bit more natural where there's, um, it's, it's basically a drawing program.

You could look at it that way where you're zooming in, zooming out, panning around, drawing lines, moving shapes around. That stuff took forever to get right on iOS in the beginning, you know. Panning versus dragging objects. It doesn't sound hard, but go write a drawing app and you'll run into which one did the user intend to do problem or did they want to draw a lasso, a selection thing, you know, like these are all operations that could just be drag.

You know, there's three different things, three different ways to drag. And that took, honestly, a good couple years of iCircuit's early days on iOS to get all that stuff just right. So I'm really curious how it's gonna run in the vision world. And it's always gutsy of Apple to have that default on thing.

I'm thankful for sure the big name brands, they're going to be their big name brands, but I'll be able to play my favorite video games and things like that in VR. And that, that makes me happy, especially, sorry, I'm on a little bit all over the place. Um, one of the biggest drawbacks, I don't know if I've made this clear enough is like, I have always wanted to develop for the Quest and they made releasing apps for it super hard.

I could never just. Release an app for it. And so it's really cool that yes, this is a ridiculously high priced device, but finally I'll be able to easily write an app and release it to the store. And so it's cool that Apple is throwing in all those iOS apps because yes, um, the store will be full of cool indie dev kind of stuff, even if it's not the native look.

[00:22:56] James: And I, I definitely do want that native look though. Are you, so you're keeping the checkbox checked? 

[00:23:03] Frank: Yes, for all of them that I'm willing to do. If Apple's confident, I'm confident, but a hundred percent on day one, the moment it's out of the box, we're going to be drawing some circuits and seeing what things look like because, okay, well, it's, it's iCircuit3D that's the one, like, I have no idea how that one's going to render because it's, it's a 2D.

Visualization of a 3D world running in a virtual 3D world. That should be hilarious. I can't wait to see how it runs. 

[00:23:36] James: Yeah, and ideally, is it, will it be, like, will it be in 3D then? Ideally, what you'd want And this is, this is the, the native versus non native, right? Is I would want to take iCircuit3D and I would say, here's my desk.

Let's say I have like a little desk in front of me and I want to take my Vision Pro and I want to be like, put the iCircuit mat on my desk. And then I would want to, from your little. Selection. I want to pick the battery and I want to pick the thing, the board, and I would want to take the wire and actually wire it up, but even though your application is 3d, you're saying it's not, it's going to still just be like a thing, it's going to be, it's just going to be like a big iPad on the wall.

Right. Sad 

[00:24:26] Frank: trombone. Um, yeah, yeah. This is, this is not my fault. This is Apple's fault. I, I wrote it as a SceneKit app. Apple's premier 3D API. They decided not to support SceneKit on the Vision Pro. Ah, it's just frustrating. Sometimes you back the wrong horse, James. Every so often. And yeah, so in order to do a native UI, on, um, the vision.

Well, if, if you go virtual reality, you can just write a game, like you can write a metal game, but you are not taking advantage of the spatial computing and the augmented reality and all that kind of stuff. To do 3D in those worlds, you have to program the Reality Kit APIs, which are interesting, if not very terribly basic.

[00:25:18] James: So what this would have to mean then, and To make it pretty clear as to why it would have maybe been beneficial, not just to test existing apps, but you at this point to get a premier, a iCircuit 3D Pro, for example, Vision Pro, spatial, spatial, iCircuit spatial. Yeah. Cause you had iCircuit 3D, that's iCircuit spatial.

Okay. You're going to have to reprogram it, basically. You're basically going to have to rewrite that, for the most part. Wonderful, huh? 

[00:25:55] Frank: Yeah. Yeah, and it's, it's, it's sad because, um, not to get too deep into my own architecture and all that kind of stuff, but I coded it pretty hard against the SceneKit API.

Like, I didn't add abstraction levels or anything like that. And it's funny, normally you do abstract things like that. We all love writing abstractions between our database layers and all that kind of stuff. But, um, it was such a big app to write in the first place. And I was trying to pull off a lot of tricks that I didn't want to deal with an abstraction layer that was just going to be a lot of extra coding, um, bites in the butt later.

Now, yeah, but, you know, the worst part is they're different APIs, but they're similar in the end. I mean, it's a graphics API. These things haven't changed since the late 90s. So, it's, it's just frustrating to translate it to yet another graphics 

[00:26:52] James: API. That makes sense. Well, I'm excited to try yours when you come and visit me once you get it.

Uh, and put it on my face whole and see what it's like. You know, cause I had talked about before that, uh, my friend had had one of my more premier experiences with, uh, VR was with HTC Vive and he had one and he like kind of had his living room sort of set up for the experience, right? So it was a big open space, all this stuff.

And it was really cool to, to, to do. I think that I am interested in seeing how I've worn the HoloLens. And I've worn some of the other ones for a short amount of times. I'm interested to see how this works and also, you know, how it works with other people in the room. Because I think when you put on those other devices, like the Quest and the vibe, vibe, like You know, okay.

That person is wearing this thing. And the video that Apple created, they're like, they're like, he's like, Whoa, I can see you. Right. And then, and she's like, the best part is like, I can see you and like, I can see your eyes, there's like really cheesy, but it'd be very fascinating to see what that experience is like.

Um, but I'm also not sure. The experience, obviously today, and this is kind of the point of it, the experience and the developer experience and the app developer experience day one is going to be so dramatically different if we're talking about this a year from now, six months from now, three years from now, how it will evolve, because I'm going to have to imagine that.

Because no one has their hands on it and they're just in the simulator, this thing will evolve relatively rapidly, um, for not only what apps are those native apps, but maybe even the app developer experience or what Apple does at WWDC, right? It's like they have Vision OS and SDKs, but You know, will they come out with some newer ways to make some new type of experiences easier than having to be like, Oh, everyone's got to use Reality Kit, right?

Or something like that. 

[00:28:51] Frank: Yeah. And, and, and it's a big question of exactly how other people will use it. You're talking about two people in the same room and it's funny app. I've been reading through every single one of Apple sample apps and they push. What do they call it? Share play? Share something? I'm sorry, some framework inside the SDK.

And it's a way to create multiplayer games, multi user experiences. And it's really just a synchronization system, but it's all built in there. They have lobbies built in so that you can connect with people. With one interesting caveat. It all seems to work through FaceTime, so the way that you join up with friends, the way you discover friends, or not discover friends, you know, contact your friends and get together into a group activity, and I think that's actually what it's called, it's a group activity, it's all done through FaceTime, which I'm really curious to find out, like, NET Is that going to be used?

Are people going to use that? Like, when two people are in a room, will they do that? I don't think they're going to want to, unless, unless you have like, eight kids, all with 3, 500 devices on their heads. Then like, um, maybe across the internet. So, Now more interesting things where you're talking across continents or something like that, and you're doing a real, um, projected experience of yourself.

I think that could be interesting, but I'm really curious to see, like, does any of that take off? Do people do any of that? And also, this is my plea, uh, if you're listening to this, Um, and you bought a vision pro also say hi on Twitter. We need to be friends because I don't have anyone else to do all this face timing.

[00:30:47] James: Sorry, Frank. I'm sorry. I abandoned you. I abandoned you. You 

[00:30:50] Frank: were my test subject. I'm like, how am I going to learn these APIs? Unless I have friends. 

[00:30:56] James: Half of the, half of the debate that I was having too, as I was like, well, if Frank has one, then I have one that like we, you know, we could play games or do face.

I'm like, check it out together and experience it. And I was like, Actually half the battle, because if you weren't going to get one, even though I know you were, but like, if we weren't doing this podcast, like, I don't know anybody else. Besides Miguel. Yeah. Maybe that's getting one. And that's it. Yeah. 

[00:31:18] Frank: So we're just gonna have to be buddies.

I'm gonna have to use his, uh, Miguel's gonna have that, um, shell app. I think it's, it's like a shell, like where you can remote into things. Oh, yeah. 

[00:31:29] James: I think, uh, Lotterminal. Lotterminal. 

[00:31:33] Frank: I believe Lotterminal is going to be out on the Visual Pro, Lotterminal 

[00:31:37] James: Pro, perhaps. I think so. So, uh. 

[00:31:40] Frank: Another, uh, text and keyboard based app.

We're, we're such nerds. We have all these text and keyboard based apps. Ugh. Visual. I'm, I'm hoping. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. You know, you know what the, the worst thing is? Whenever there's a new platform, we all have our first apps that we all write for a new platform. Um, well, you said you don't have any app ideas, but like, you're given a new piece of hardware and it has a screen on it.

What app do you write? You must have a favorite. 

[00:32:09] James: Uh, well, I mean, as long as it has, like, numbers that are counting down on the screen. You know, the one thing that would be really cool, if, like, the first app I would build would maybe be, like, A countdown to New Year's app, like a countdown to something that does like 3d celebrations around you, like fireworks.

Like, you know, that'd be kind of cool, uh, to, to do, that'd be, that'd be something I would, I could think of doing, you know, cause you know, like, you know, when new year's happens, like you look at your Apple watch and like Apple's like one time a year, it happens like happy new year's. And there's like little fireworks on your watch.

That would be kind of cool to do inside of Apple vision. Pro in general, but for any occasion, you could have some priests like the ones like birthday or, you know, anniversary or something 

[00:32:50] Frank: and see you have ideas. Okay, there we go. I was just going to complain that every time I'm given a new platform, I write a map app.

I write maps. I just like to write maps. And so I've already written a map app for, um, the Vision Pro, but I have no idea if it looks any good. So I have to spend the money so I can see if my. Funny map app, because I love to write map apps, 

[00:33:13] James: looks any good. All maps would just be monkeys. So lots of monkeys and that's all they would be.

So, yeah, yeah. I'll be fascinated to see how it goes. Um, and for your experience as well. So yeah, 

[00:33:26] Frank: it's, it's, it's seeing, I'm just curious. I'm going to keep my eyes on those top charts too, in the, uh, 

[00:33:33] James: app store. Well, we're only, we're only like a few weeks away, which is kind of wild. So if you're listening to this on the 29th, we're only.

A few days away from Frank getting it, so. We will let you know how it goes in just a few weeks. And if you are getting one, go ahead and drop us comments on our merge conflict page on our Patrion page. If you're a Patrion, you can do it on our Twitter account, on our YouTube account, if you're watching this as well, let us know if you're going to get a vision pro or ordered one, or maybe you're in the March timeframe.

Uh, we'll see. But, uh, I think that's going to do it. Oh, final question. How much memory did you buy? 

[00:34:09] Frank: Oh, I, I, I cheaped out in the end. I got the 256. Who's going to, I'm going to play one game at a time. You know, you uninstall the game if you're not playing 

[00:34:20] James: it. That's the rule. Okay. All right. Well, on that note, it's going to be a pretty sweet Smirch Conflict.

So until next time, I'm James Montemagno. And I'm Frank 

[00:34:28] Frank: Krueger. Thanks for watching and listening. 

[00:34:31] James: Peace.