Kaitlin and Sarah === Vince: [00:00:00] Have you ever seen you guys watch YouTube much Kaitlin: workout videos? Daniel: I like YouTube. What's YouTube? Vince: Have you ever heard of hot ones? No, no, Daniel: no. Vince: So this, uh, guy Sean, not Chris, right? You got this now? I botched his name on, on air. Um, he's not watching our stuff. We are recording. Just watch, just Daniel: watch the one comment we ever get on a video. It's gonna be, Vince: my Daniel: name's Sean. Vince: He's from Chicago originally. Anyway, he has this, he has this podcast or is it considered a podcast? Daniel: It's it, I mean, no, it's a video series. Yeah. Yeah. Vince: But he has guests on, and now he has like a-listers every. Every episode is, is topnotch a-listers. Um, but it would be like if you had a row of 10 chicken wings in front of you and we had the same, and it starts out real mild mm-hmm. And works its way to like, just Sure. Stupid hot. Yeah. Yeah. But it's kind of a interesting, because he's, he's, he's on point, super prepared, lots of questions and just [00:01:00] watching them interact and answering the questions as it progressively gets hotter Kaitlin: Oh, that's funny. Vince: Is very interesting. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: Oh, that would be really fair. Vince: And some guests obviously get through all 10 wings. Some are like, they get to the sixth one, they're like, I'm out. I'm, I'm done. I'm done. That's, it's very entertaining Kaitlin: if you, you have it. I feel like we had potential to do something similar. If I would've known when I was at Total Wine, I could have prepared a little bit better, like, could have had like a flight, Daniel: a shot Vince: list Daniel: in front of us. Vince: Well, yeah. As we talked about, and I, I, I think I said this to you and maybe Chris, but I'm glad this somehow that just triggered our memory. Shocking. Um, Kaitlin: shots, Mike, Vince: we're doing, we're doing a net, we're doing a series, right? Yes. Then we talked about we're gonna do, we're gonna do a series. So collectively, let's think about what this one, probably, let's do a four part series, one a quarter. So let's, I think this one will be like the intro. Let's, it's more about introducing you guys, what you're doing and, and with the business, with the cancer rehab group, and then we'll, we'll [00:02:00] plot out the second, third, and fourth, but this is. The starting point for those and that we'll now have to step it up. It's okay. So is it a wine tasting slash Daniel: Oh, there we go. Oh yeah. That how we, I Kaitlin: think it Daniel: go through. It Kaitlin: should be, Vince: yeah. Just saying, folks, this is Friday afternoon, so just bear with us. Daniel: Four o'clock. I, I think, um, did we, do we offer produ, producer, Chris, anything to drink? Oh, Chris, do you want some Monkey 47? He, Vince: he, uh, Chris, do you drink? Do you drink gin? Daniel: Not really. Vince: You can use, you can use the fancy, uh, intercom we have and not just, Daniel: I think it's not connected at the moment. Vince: Oh. Kaitlin: Do you drink red wine? 'cause we Vince: also have Kaitlin: that. Vince: I'm good. Okay. Yeah, we have some Do you want some pinot? Same answer. It's still good. All right. Fair enough. Daniel: Oh my Vince: God. Well great. We'll get a juice box next time. Yeah. Pour some Tito's in. Um, actually he likes, [00:03:00] uh, Tito's. Was it lemon slices or just lemon juice? And then, um, Topo Chico. Daniel: What's that? Vince: It's like a, just a seltzer of water. Daniel: I'm waiting for Chris to put the menu up on the, Vince: on Daniel: the, or Vince: it just yellow around the Daniel: corner. Topo Chico. Limes. Yeah. Vodka. Vince: Oh, limes. My bad. Okay. Daniel: That's pretty solid. Vince: That's a good one. Yeah. I think you spelled, you misspelled Topo Chico, by the way. Daniel: That's okay. Auto Crick. Get Vince: it. The next one it'll be a middle. Middle finger. Jif. Yeah. Daniel: Wait for it. Vince: Which is Daniel: appropriate? Remote. Just the middle finger. Vince: It'd only be like the third one I've got in the day. It's cool. Oh Kaitlin: my God, Vince: that's Daniel: a low count for you on a, a Friday. Vince: It's a I know. And I've only sent out. Yeah, I've sent out a couple. Daniel: It was been a good day. Vince: Um, did Kaitlin: you have a good day, Sarah? Vince: Yeah, Kaitlin: I've had a great day. Vince: How was your. Yep. What's wrong? Daniel: Oh, there you go. Kaitlin: I'm trying. Vince: Oh, Kaitlin: there it's, Vince: there we go. Nice. Kaitlin: I'm trying to make the best of a situation. Vince: Toco, is that a hyphen or is they just Kaitlin: Oh, yeah. Vince: Is it all [00:04:00] one word or Daniel: curses? Kaitlin: That's, is that like a soda? Like a Sprite. Have Daniel: you ever had Kaitlin: Sprite? Daniel: You've never had Topo Chico? Kaitlin: No, I haven't. It's Daniel: Oh, okay. I think it's Vince: Mexican. Daniel: We'll have to take a note for the next one. Sprite. We'll bring some, uh, we'll bring, we'll make Chris's favorite drink for the next one. I think Kaitlin: that's a good idea. That's a Daniel: great idea. Kaitlin: Each person could pick the, there you Sarah: go. Kaitlin: Cocktail. Vince: Yeah. Daniel: There we go. There we, I like it. I like it. So that Sarah: what we, Kaitlin: no gin. Daniel: So no gin. That's fine. Got it. That what we brought Sarah: you guys didn't like Kaitlin: today. Yeah. We'll have to get it organized. That's okay. Next time. Daniel: Yeah, that's okay. Well, we'll, we'll share notes after this one to make sure that we're on the same page going forward. That'll be perfect Kaitlin: deal. Daniel: Awesome. Vince: Get beverage preferences. Daniel: Yep. What is everyone? So we know Chris's favorite is wine. What is this Vince: podcast about? A Daniel: it, it's cold open. This is the drunk open. Kaitlin: Okay. A good transition. I just watched a video on a white, uh, like a Christmas claw margarita. Daniel: Oh, okay. Kaitlin: Like a white margarita. So it's tequila, coconut milk, coconut water, lime [00:05:00] juice. Something orangey, some kind of orange liqueur. Okay. And that's it. And then you shake it up and it looked delicious. And then he had like the little cranberries and the, Sarah: you got me at Daniel: milk. Sarah: Okay. A Kaitlin: milk. It's coconut milk. Coconut milk. Daniel: Okay. No, no. Coconut milk. Kaitlin: We'll leave the coconut milk. Daniel: Okay. So a, Kaitlin: I love a margarita. Daniel: Margarita. Kaitlin: A good, not overly sweet. Daniel: Yeah. Kaitlin: Margarita. Daniel: So have you ever done ranch water before? Kaitlin: Mm. No. Daniel: Just kind of similar to Margarita. You just don't add in like the sour sauce or whatever. Is your mic on? I don't know if it is. There you go. Is it better now? Yeah, I need to talk closer. Um, so you just, it's like, like something like carbonated water topo chico or something along those lines. Tequila and then just fresh squeezed lime. Kaitlin: Oh, sounds good. No, Daniel: sweet and sour. The other. Kaitlin: Oh, that Daniel: stuff. Stuff like that. Kaitlin: Yeah. Like I don't like the real sugary stuff. Yeah. So just like light and refreshing. Daniel: Yep. Yep, Kaitlin: that's my jam. Daniel: Ranch water. Should try that one out. Vince: Okay. That's yours. While you guys are drinking the tequila based drinks, I'll just [00:06:00] consume the chips and salsa. We Daniel: just won't open it. Vince: That's fine. Kaitlin: That sounds amazing. That sounds like a great time. Vince: So. Kaitlin: Mm-hmm. Vince: Okay. Daniel: There are so many things we can make happen. There's La Hacienda right across right the door. Vince: Yes, it's true. That's, that's an option. Uh, but I'm a Chewy's fan, which unfortunately there's not that many around Indy, but there's one of Noblesville, Daniel: there's one in Michigan, off Michigan, right? Sarah: Yeah. I was gonna, Vince: yes, correct. Mm-hmm. The salsa is phenomenal. They have a ranch with like blended jalapeno in it. Mm. Daniel: Pretty solid. Vince: Yeah. Daniel: Anyway. Sorry. Sarah: It does sound good. Vince: You're up. Daniel: What's your, uh, what's your go-to? Sarah: Dirty martini. Daniel: Okay. Shaken, stir, Vince: sophisticated Sarah: dirty martini, shaken blue cheese, olives. Daniel: Okay. Hard talking. Vince: Wow. I feel like I'm talking to my dad. That's, my dad's Daniel: go-to. Vince: I mean, it's not a negative. I'm, she's an old soul. That's what my dad likes. Like, well, okay. Sweet. Sarah: She's a classy lady. Vince: A guy. I don't know what it is about. Sarah: No, Vince: I'm not sure what it is about 'em, but, but I'm, I'll drink olive oil, but I don't like olives. I'm like [00:07:00] one of those guys who, or one of those people who Daniel: you drink? Vince: They ketchup. Olive. I cook. I would, I like olive oil. Like especially on bread or whatever. Oh, sure. And cooking. But I don't like olives. It's like my wife will eat ketchup. She doesn't like tomatoes. I'm like, what the fuck's wrong with you? Daniel: The texture thing. Kaitlin: Yeah. And yours Vince: anyway. Yeah. Daniel: What's your go-to Vince: drink? Daniel: Yeah. Vince: Gin and tonic or, well, beer or wine, but, or seltzer, Kaitlin: but not pinot. Um. Vince: Some. Kaitlin: Oh, just not our, Vince: well, I haven't, I haven't. Have Daniel: you heard of Opus one? There's a, that's Vince: not Daniel: whatever. I know nothing Vince: about Daniel: wine, Vince: so not, I just, I don't typically, I mean more, I'm more heavier dry wine, like more of a cab. Kaitlin: Oh, sure. Vince: Yeah. Um, you know, bru, Daniel: I was encouraged to buy an Opus One. Bordeaux. So Kaitlin: Bordeauxs. Vince: Yeah. Daniel: Well, Vince: so Daniel: I haven't Vince: know yet. Okay. Now that we're actually getting back to where this is supposed to go, the An Evening with [00:08:00] Heroes, which are our big annual gala, we're going to do a wine Wine wall. Daniel: A wine Vince: wall. A wine wall. Daniel: Yeah. Vince: Yeah. And so let's say there's, I don't know. Yeah, 25 bottles of wine, minimum value of 50, probably 50 to 150 bucks. And you basically buy almost like a raffle ticket to have a chance to, and whoever, oh, that's, this pool gets the whole, the Daniel: whole Vince: wall? Daniel: Yep. Vince: The whole wall. Daniel: The whole wall. Vince: So if there's 20, was it, I say 25 miles. I we're Daniel: going 25. Yeah. 25. 25 bottles. $50 minimum bottle. Vince: Yeah. Let's say it's a hundred bucks a ticket. You buy one ticket. Name goes in the thing, you pull it out, you get all 25 bottles. Oh my God. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: We need to enter. Vince: Yeah, it'll be fun. Well, you guys have you guys, you guys will be there. You guys will be there. Daniel: Yeah. Vince: It's gonna be a good time. Are Daniel: what was you guys are attending an evening? Sarah: I said I was gonna buy a table. Yeah. I just realized that Vince: I, I actually, you know what, I think you did to, for Sarah: it, Daniel: if you had, I have the, the stripe machine over here somewhere. I can, uh, Sarah: I'll get my wallet out Vince: regardless. Sarah: Yeah. Vince: Yeah. It or, uh, Dana was like, well, so I need some [00:09:00] recommendations for what wine I should get. I'm like, I'm not Daniel: a wine Vince: person. So I immediately emailed him like, yeah, multiple options. Daniel: Yeah. There were, there was, there was one more zero on that 50 than I was expecting. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It'd be, it would, I don't know how that happened. It'd be very enticing for someone to buy that a hundred dollars ticket at that point though. Vince: Yes. Well, yeah. Anyway. Daniel: Yeah. Is this thing going? Vince: Hey guys. Welcome back to another episode of the Summit's podcast. Thank all you guys for joining us from wherever you get your podcast or for you joining us on the Heroes Foundation YouTube channel. Thank you for tuning in. Uh, sit back, grab yourself your favorite cocktail. This is gonna be a fun one as it goes on. It could get more fun. We'll see what happens. Um, alright, two special guests. Today, not just one, but two. [00:10:00] Uh, miss Caitlyn Pennington and Sarah Blo. Sarah Caitlyn, welcome to the Summits podcast. Kaitlin: Thank, thank you. Thank you. Thank you for having us. You Daniel: welcome. Thanks Vince: for being Daniel: here. For having us. Vince: You guys look so excited to be here. We Kaitlin: are. Vince: Come on. Kaitlin: We just didn't know we'd be on camera. Vince: Well that's okay. We, we let to hide that from people. Kaitlin: Yeah. But you're letting us, you know, Vince: hey, whatever. It takes Kaitlin: partake so it's fair. Correct. Vince: Whatever it takes. Yep. We're just having conversation. It's just four people at a table having a conversation. Daniel: Yeah, Kaitlin: that's Daniel: great. Vince: Camera. Alright, let's kick things off and why don't you guys do a little background intro on yourselves for our listeners and viewers. Daniel: Sarah, you wanna go first? Vince: I Daniel: would love to. There's a quick deflection there. Thank you. Kaitlin: Um, my name is Sarah Blunt. I am a physical therapist. I have been a PT for 15 years, uh, specializing in oncology care for the last decade. Most of that was spent at Community MD Anderson Cancer Center here in Indianapolis. And then recently. [00:11:00] I am transitioned to Cancer Rehab group where I am working with my professional partner in crime, um, to provide oncology rehabilitation in the private practice setting. Daniel: Where'd you grow up, Sarah? Kaitlin: Um, mostly here, mostly here in Indy. Daniel: Mostly here. North side of Indy or Kaitlin: warehouse? Um, yeah, the Geist area. Okay. Daniel: Where'd you go to high school? Kaitlin: So I went to Lawrence Central. Daniel: LC Kaitlin: Yeah. Yeah. LC Elsie Bears. Daniel: Yep. Kaitlin: My kids are gonna go to ln. So that's a little bit of a Daniel: Right. Competition. Kaitlin: Con conflict. Yeah. Vince: Yeah. Kaitlin: Uh, working through that. And then I went to Hanover College. Yep. And then. The University of Dayton for PT school. Daniel: Okay. Okay. So Vince: a bear and a flyer. What's Hanover? His mask. Kaitlin: Panther. Vince: Panther, okay. Kaitlin: Bear Panther and Flyer. Vince: Yeah. Daniel: So do you, I know that there's an employee of mine that is working with you all. Did you know? Jason before he worked [00:12:00] with you or anything like that? Kaitlin: Well, I must have like crossed paths. Um, so we went to high school and college together. That's Which is wild. Yeah. I'm sorry. Well, no, he was my sister's age, who I love, but. Um, Vince: I say for the bus, Kaitlin: but I may have said sorry to him when Daniel: Got it. Okay. Kaitlin: That's fair. Daniel: Saying sorry to Jason is a, is a feat. So Kaitlin: sorry, Chelsea. Daniel: Yeah. Kaitlin: Um, but no, I think they, I think they knew each other. Daniel: Okay. Kaitlin: Um, but he and I. You know, we just must have crossed paths at some point. Yeah. Um, because Hanover's half the size of lc. Yeah. So Daniel: yeah, Kaitlin: very small school and great school, small school. Daniel: Good follow up guest that we should have on here soon. There's that. Jason. Jason? Well, yeah, Vince: well, he, Daniel: we'll have to have censor some things, but Kaitlin: maybe he could make a guest appearance during one of our Daniel: series. Oh, that'd Kaitlin: be fun Daniel: there. Vince: Well, you actually, you know [00:13:00] what, that's, no, that's a great idea. Yeah. Um, note that mentally I'll write it down. Yep. But, um, we had talked to him about being on here and I think part of his answer, if I remember correctly, was gimme a little bit of time and I think you guys are, what you guys are doing with him will help with this. Daniel: Yep, yep, Sarah: yep. Vince: All right. Um, okay. Sarah: Yeah. Love that. Daniel: Awesome, awesome, Sarah: great idea. Thank you. Vince: All right. Caitlyn, you're up. Sarah: I'm Caitlyn. Caitlyn Pennington. Um, I'm a speech pathologist and I've been practicing for the last 12 years. Um, in the last 10 of those 12 years I've been focusing in head and neck cancer. I was at Community MD Anderson for majority of that time as well. Okay. Where I met Sarah. Daniel: Okay. Sarah: My professional partner in crime. I resigned in May, um, to start practicing on, on this side and, [00:14:00] um, explore what we could do for patients outside of an organization and looking into more non-traditional models of patient care. Vince: Mm-hmm. Sarah: Um, and trying to see how we could fill in those gaps. Vince: Nice. I think I asked you this the other day when we first chatted. Um, where'd you grow up? Sarah: Munster Vince: Munster up. That's right. Sarah: Munster, Indiana. Vince: Region. Sarah: Yep, region. Vince: Um, and then you went where again? For undergrad. Sarah: Sorry, not sorry, Purdue. Vince: That's fine. I mean you can keep that Sarah: connection. I'm not sorry at all. Vince: Yep. Sarah: Purdue, you shouldn't Vince: be sorry. It's fine. Sarah: I'm a boiler maker graduate school and undergrad. Vince: Don't have Daniel: our Sarah: handicaps. Daniel: It's Vince: cool. Um, it was Sarah: the best education I could have ever had. Vince: There you go. Sarah: Wouldn't be here today without it. Vince: There. You haven't, folks, Sarah: did you watch their basketball game last night? Vince: No, I didn't. Sarah: Oh, Vince: I'm sorry. Sarah: It's okay. Vince: Yeah. Are you going? Won the open and bucket game. Sarah: No, Vince: I don't know. This will, this may or may not. This probably it kind of come out after the fact, so, yeah. [00:15:00] Well hopefully the Hoosiers will be 12 and oh when this comes out. Sarah: Mm. Vince: We'll see, I dunno, Daniel: it would be shocking if it was otherwise, Vince: this is the first time I can actually talk crap about IU football because it's been decades since. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Vince: Been able to do that, so. Mm-hmm. Take me one chance. Daniel: Yeah. I mean, cool. You should take it. Vince: Alright. Um, good. Back Daniel: to back. Yep. Got it. Vince: Let's go. Chris, you can edit that part out if you'd like or Daniel: not. No, it's fine. It's fine. Vince: Um, Daniel: when, uh, so I was gonna ask, so one thing, when you said you resigned in May, uh, when you resigned, did you have a plan or did you just say, I'm gonna just figure this out. Sarah: Great question. Daniel: I'm gonna go with You had such a detailed plan, that was why you did Sarah: I did not. Daniel: Oh, okay. I Sarah: did not Daniel: would've lost that bet. Kaitlin: That's not true. She had already started a whole business when she resigned. Sarah: I just didn't think it would be oncology focused. Daniel: Okay. Okay. Sarah: Which was silly of me to think that, because that's my passion and that's what I've been doing and love doing [00:16:00] for, yeah. The last decade. Um, but I thought, why not recreate a model of care similar to what we had at MD Anderson Cancer Center, um, for community. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: And, you know, offer a comprehensive multidisciplinary model that really addresses the whole person. Mm-hmm. Daniel: Which Sarah: is. A great way to receive care really in a lot of other aspects too. It doesn't have to be cancer. So that's how I went about it. And then it wasn't long before I had some patients reaching out and um, somebody that I had worked with for a while reached out and said Help was needed in Las Vegas and would I go travel there to help some people? And I said yes. So, um. Kaitlin: She got sucked back in. Sarah: I got sucked back in. But it's great. This is where I'm meant to be and Kaitlin: yeah. Sarah: Um, I just needed a minute to recollect my thoughts Yeah. And figure out what chapter two was gonna look [00:17:00] like. But that's why, um, restorative health and wellness exists. That was my first endeavor. Endeavor before, um, I even resigned actually. Okay. So I opened the practice. Um, I had just hired some. Physical therapists and speech pathologists. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: And had a wellness aspect with, um, yoga, mental health, the dietician. And our, our medical director is the, um, former chief wellness officer for Vince: community, or was, Sarah: and he's our medical director now. Nice. So we were just trying to think of some creative ways to provide care outside the box in a comprehensive way. And then this kind of landed. Itself and here we are. Kaitlin: Yeah. Vince: Yeah. As fellow entrepreneurs, did you ever envision yourself doing this? Sarah: No. Okay. My mom Vince: has asked me. A lot of people say Sarah: that. Asked me, no. My mom has asked me since I was probably in high [00:18:00] school. She's like, what? Do you wanna be hairdresser? Okay, great. You're gonna own your own hair salon? Nah, no. So then when I said I was gonna be a speech pathologist, great. You're gonna own a private practice? No. So for the last decade she's been asking me when I was gonna do this and she finally stopped, um, asking because she realized I would probably retire in the position I was in. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: And then I came to her one day and said, mom, I think I'm gonna open private practice. And she said, you have to be kidding me. Daniel: She's like, yes, Sarah: but I'm here for it. Daniel: Yeah. Right. Kaitlin: Yeah. I would say a lot of the people around me. Had been encouraging me to do it for a long time, like my close friends. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Kaitlin: Um, but we had a great setup, um, and didn't feel the need to leave until we did. Daniel: Yeah. Right. Yeah. Kaitlin: Um, until we kind of got to a point where I think, you know, we had grown as much as we could [00:19:00] and, and then we're ready for a new chapter. Vince: Yeah. I think when I spoke with you guys the other week, um, I. You came in after the fact, but what was the trigger for you? I, or what was, yeah. I guess what was the trigger for you to finally say, okay, you what I'm, I'm ready to, I'm, I'm in. Kaitlin: I would say, um, I don't know how to describe this, but I have this. I think it's like part of my biological clock where like every five years, like literally every five years, I need to add something different to my skillset. I need to make a change. Mm-hmm. Um. Career rise in, in like whether it's expanding my patient population in some way, picking up a new skill set, doing something. And 2024 would've been that five year mark and there was nowhere for me to go Vince: Okay. Kaitlin: Where I was at. Vince: Sure. Kaitlin: And that was really hard. It just started feeling like I wasn't in the right place anymore. [00:20:00] And, um, I don't know. I have a pretty strong sense of. You know where I need to be and what feels right and what feels wrong, and it all of a sudden it just didn't feel right anymore. And then this opportunity came along to quit my, you know, job and go on this adventure with Caitlin and really like follow our dreams of expanding access to excellent care for people. And I mean, it got to a point where I'd be crazy. Not to do it. Not to. Vince: Yeah. Kaitlin: Yeah. So, Vince: so why don't you guys do us a favor and, and you talk about what kind of care, um, or talk about providing care. What kind of services do you guys offer? What are, what are your core competencies? Kaitlin: So, um, from a physical therapy standpoint, I am a certified lymphedema therapist. So that's kind of what brought me into cancer care. Actually, I got my lymphedema certification about five years into my career and. For [00:21:00] people who don't know what lymphedema is, it's a certain type of swelling. It's different than just like holding extra water. It's water, but also cellular waste products and it can be a result of, um, a. You know, deconditioning or people who are getting older, and so their circulation isn't as effective as it used to be, and so they can start to get fluid pooling in their legs. But it's also a very common side effect of cancer care. So when you have lymph nodes that are surgically removed, or if you have radiation, uh, to your lymph nodes, then your lymphatic system becomes less efficient. At moving fluid and you can get fluid back up in certain areas. So for example, a breast cancer patient might get lymphedema in the arm on the affected side, um, or in their breast or chest, um, where their cancer was. And so that's [00:22:00] something that was in need where I was working at the time, someone to manage, um, those patients. And I was ready. It was that five year mark and I was ready for a new challenge and I said, let's. Do this. Um, so I got certified and, and that was my intro to oncology. And then, um. Once I saw how men, how cancer heavy that population was, I took more and more courses in oncology. So then I could not just address the lymphedema aspect of patients, but also like the whole host of side effects that come along with their treatments. Mm-hmm. So post-surgical side effects, post-radiation, side effects, side effects associated with chemotherapy. Um, I wanted to be able to take care of the patient in any way they needed in terms of. Oncology support and, and recovery. And then again, five years later, I decided to, um, take on pelvic health because working in the cancer [00:23:00] center, there was a gynecologic oncology population that I wasn't able to support in all the ways that I wanted to, um, as well as prostate cancer patients. And. And again, just, you know, the goal of being able to provide whole person, whole body support for patients going through cancer care. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Kaitlin: So, um. It took several, several courses, um, to be able to add that to my skillset. And, and so I would say oncology, lymphedema and pelvic health would be the skill sets that I bring. Daniel: Hmm. Vince: You know, I found most interesting, um, after our first conversation was looking at the services you guys provide. There's certainly, the market's clearly there for it, but it's not just those that are going through treatments now. Certainly a needed market, but if they had treatment five years ago or 10 years ago Oh, yeah. Or 15 years ago or whatever, and I mean, [00:24:00] I can speak to this, like there are things that will start showing up later. Kaitlin: Absolutely. Vince: May happen and may not. But things pop up and, and there's, they're already so far removed from that initial treatment that they, they need you guys. Okay. Yes. Sarah: And I don't think some even realize that they have issues that are coming up because of their treatment. They might think I'm getting a little bit older or I had treatment and well, this is kind of to be expected. Mm-hmm. And they don't know that there's help out there. Yeah. Um, that can specifically address what changes are coming on. Mm-hmm. So part of it I would add to your realm would be education. That you can provide. Kaitlin: Sure, yeah. Sarah: Um, Kaitlin: educating them on what to watch for. Mm-hmm. Long term. Sarah: Yes. Kaitlin: In terms of potential long-term side effects and Yeah. Management Sarah: awareness, advocacy Kaitlin: awareness, yeah. Daniel: Over the years, so what has been the split [00:25:00] of patients that. Um, sought care with you immediately after their treatment had com or, or, um, finished versus how many people came back years later to have assistance with things? Yeah, Kaitlin: I mean. It's, it's hard to really quantify that. I would say unfortunately, the vast majority of the time we're still working in a triage based model of care. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Kaitlin: Where we are reactive versus proactive in terms of being able to address these things with people. Um, and that's. Because of a variety of different issues in the current healthcare system. But I can't tell you how many people I've had who told me, I wish I would've known you sooner. Daniel: Yeah. Kaitlin: I mean, that overwhelmingly has been the case. Why didn't anyone tell me about this? Mm-hmm. Why didn't anyone send me to you? Last year. Yeah. Or years ago. Why, why, why, why, why? Yeah. And I, you know, can just tell them that [00:26:00] we're, I mean, I guess relatively kind of a new subspecialty, but not really. But we're, we're very much continuing to push for education and advocacy amongst providers, physicians, apps, on how to best utilize supportive care services. Mm-hmm. Vince: Mm-hmm. Kaitlin: For their patients. Yeah, Vince: a hundred percent. Kaitlin: So do you wanna talk about your specialties, your, your skillset? Sarah: I was thinking about that. Great. Be glad to please share. So this brings me back to when, um, I met my husband's family for the first time we've been married. 10 years this year. And um, I sat down and I'm sitting next to his sister, who's an attorney and his other sister who was pretty young still at that time. And then his parents across from me, actually he was next to me and his attorney sister was across from me. And they're all looking dead in my [00:27:00] eyes. And his sister goes. So Caitlyn, like, what are you passionate about? What do you like to do as a speech pathologist? And I said, swallowing. Daniel: Oh, Sarah: I love swallowing. Oh Daniel: God. Sarah: So my realm is, I'm Kaitlin: so glad that you Sarah: shared that and that my Kaitlin: husband. Sarah: And so we got in the car and he goes. Did you realize? Really? Just Daniel: say that Sarah: and his sister never blinked. I mean, I dunno Vince: what you mean. Sarah: Yeah, exactly. Nobody blinked. That's probably how my husband sat there. Vince: I'm writing that down. I'm really glad that you Sarah: chose to share that Vince: right now. Sarah: Thank you. Kaitlin: I had to break the ice, Vince: so that's, I will, I will say inside, that's our, our viewership and ratings just went up. Yeah. Anyway, Kaitlin: so are you including swallowing in your skillset? No. Or lemme make that clear. No, but I'll help you swallow. Daniel: Wow. Okay. Kaitlin: All Daniel: right. Sarah: I didn't [00:28:00] mean that. So did stop it. Daniel: The algorithm you get it is going nuts. That's right. It's okay. We're past the first 10 minutes that Chris says we have to be past for my mom Kaitlin: was wanting Daniel: for it to not listen, we're about clean it up. Sarah: Healthcare. Daniel: Healthcare. Yeah, exactly. Healthcare. Sarah: So that's how my journey started and I, I really am passionate about swallowing. I mean it from the bottom of my heart. Vince: God bless her dad. Sarah: Um, Kaitlin: still going. Sarah: Yes, that came up at my wedding, um, by this man in front of, you know, as you Daniel: should everybody else. Yep. Yep. Sarah: Um, Daniel: thank you. Sarah: Anyway, I have really enjoyed learning various aspects of people that are going through specifically head and neck cancer. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: Um, what. Aspects of of care they need to maximize their quality of life. Yeah. Because when cancer affects any part of the body, it takes a [00:29:00] toll. Right? I mean, you hear the word and your mind is, IM immediately affected in most cases. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: Um, and when it comes to head and neck cancer, you're talking about someone's ability to communicate Daniel: mm-hmm. Sarah: And eat and drink. Mm-hmm. And talk, right? Mm-hmm. And so it takes. It takes more than just the mindset to get over this diagnosis. And I realized off the bat that what I thought I had really good training in at one of the top speech pathology graduate programs in the nation. Um, I didn't have all of the aspects that it took to manage everything Vince: mm-hmm. Sarah: In, in this patient's care. And so I started. Studying what was under my umbrella and what wasn't. Yeah. Um, and that's where Sarah and I really started to collaborate closely because [00:30:00] I would ask her, who is she, who she was seeing? And I would ask her to see a patient with me. Mm-hmm. And we would start. I going back and forth on how to divide and conquer this patient's complexities. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: Um, and with head and neck cancer, the research shows that if you have prophylactic pre-treatment intervention, the prognosis long-term is much better to be able to sustain, especially your swallow function. Daniel: Yep. Sarah: Ability to eat and drink. Daniel: Yeah. Yeah. Sarah: So, um, as I started in my career, I started adding additional, um, courses and trainings and certifications. Um, everything from certain, uh, swallowing protocols like the McNeil Dysphagia Swallowing Program, which is a bootcamp at MD Anderson. Mm-hmm. Um, type program. [00:31:00] To manual therapy and then learning more about lymphedema and, and how to educate patients about it, even when they didn't have lymphedema. Because from the start I realized one thing, patients are overwhelmed with appointments. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: And when I went to our radiation oncologist about starting a program for head and neck cancer patients and asking him to send the patients, he said. Caitlin, I am tired of tracking patients down and telling them to go to speech therapy. Huh? He said I'll send you the patients, but. Uh, that's about it. Daniel: Yeah. It's on you at that point. Sarah: I said. Great. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: Send them. So I called every single patient once I realized that the patients weren't coming to their appointments. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: And the reason was they didn't know why. Mm-hmm. They have all these appointments that they have to do. Why in the world would they go to therapy when they're not having any trouble yet? Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: Most of the time. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: So I started calling every [00:32:00] patient to schedule 'em myself. Um, and I made sure they realized. Right. What the appointment was for. Mm-hmm. What we'd be doing and why it was important that we did it. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: Before treatment and nine times outta 10 they would come. Daniel: Yeah. Sarah: If not 10, outta 10. Daniel: How of those meetings when they, when they did show up, how surprised were they to realize that they had. Either limitations or things that they didn't realize that they had after that first initial consult with you? Sarah: What percentage? Daniel: Well, it just is, it often is there? Yeah. Kaitlin: I would say often, Daniel: like Kaitlin: people Sarah: all the time Daniel: don't realize how different it is Kaitlin: after people acclimate. Yeah. I mean they, they, they will compensate and acclimate to these, you know, new levels of function quickly and then when we help show them how good. Things could and should be. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Kaitlin: Um, then they understand mm-hmm. You know, kind of the disparities that are existing in their current [00:33:00] Daniel: mm-hmm. Kaitlin: State and, and see kind of hope then for where we can get them. Daniel: Got it Kaitlin: together. Daniel: Yeah. Yeah. Kaitlin: But back to the original question of what your specialties are. About how you help people open their mouth after head and neck cancer. Also, she takes care of laryngectomy patients and started a whole laryngectomy support group. Like she literally works in people's holes, in their necks Daniel: Oh. Kaitlin: And changes out voice prostheses and, and all kinds of stuff. I mean, it's wild work. Daniel: Wow. Yeah. Kaitlin: Um, and helps people swallow again and not need a feeding tube. Yeah. And. Does really, really great, important work. Daniel: Yeah. Yeah. Sarah: Yeah. So trismus or difficulties with the jaw. Daniel: Okay. Kaitlin: Like some of our head and neck patients after radiation and surgery, like they literally can't open their mouth. Vince: Oh really? Kaitlin: Which is wild and dangerous. Vince: Yeah. Sarah: Very dangerous. Kaitlin: Um, if you can't open your mouth at all, like, Vince: yeah. Kaitlin: [00:34:00] So, um. So, yeah, she specializes in that. Vince: Yeah. Kaitlin: Um, so it's really, really important work that she does. Sarah: The population of patients going to community, um, with head and neck cancer that were going to speech therapy or not. Mm-hmm. Increased by 7000% when I was there, and it's because I made sure that every single patient that was discussed on tumor board mm-hmm. That was seen in radiation oncology and that went through our clinic with our surgeon, was sent for a consultation before any treatment started and they knew what their risks were and they knew anything that they could do to prevent decline. Daniel: Wow. Vince: So if you guys are, give or take six months in. And crystal ball's difficult. What else do you think? Where, where do you think this can evolve into Kaitlin: world domination. Vince: That's fair. Sarah: Yeah. Don't actually, it's a Kaitlin: minor Vince: goal. Let's set the bar high. Sarah: I know we've had some big [00:35:00] conversations lately. Kaitlin: Um, national reach, uh, for patient care and support. Sarah: Like Kaitlin: we don't want your folks Vince: on, on the services you're doing now. Yeah. Or do you think there's some logical. Additional ones without getting too far outside your box, so to speak? Um, Sarah: mental health? Kaitlin: Well, yes, but like for, for us specifically, I would say, I mean definitely, you know, some physical touch points around the country, but, um, also expanding our virtual reach to patients around the country. Mm-hmm. We just don't want, um, your recovery to depend on where you live. Right, Vince: right. Yeah. Kaitlin: We don't want that. We want every cancer patient to have access to the skills and support they need to make a as full of a recovery as possible no matter where you live. Sarah: And I think a common misconception [00:36:00] is that if you have a hospital that has a PT and rehab department, or you have nearby rehab locations, that there's the support you need if you need it. Mm-hmm. Um. And we've both seen from different aspects. Me personally, when I first started this work that I didn't know all that it took even when I thought I had a great background and skillset. Um, this is not a training that everybody just has coming outta school as a speech pathologist or a physical therapist. Mm-hmm. Cancer rehab is a subspecialty that takes. Further education, dedication, um, Kaitlin: mentorship, Sarah: mentorship Kaitlin: experience, Sarah: all Yes. And we've experienced it ourselves. We've seen the implications. Mm-hmm. When you don't have that to speak to the value of it. And so our [00:37:00] hope is that we can raise awareness to the fact that we need to separate the existence of rehab facilities. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: And cancer rehab, which should be in a must. It should be, yes. Kaitlin: It should be part of the Sarah: treatment. Part of the treatment plan. Yeah. Kaitlin: Yeah. Sarah: When you are undergoing treatment. Vince: Yeah. Sarah: It should be a necessity, not, um, a luxury. Vince: Mm-hmm. There you go. Agreed. All right. Um, what else do we not know about you guys? Sarah: Pretty much everything now. I Vince: mean, I think Sarah: I regret that. Vince: Well, alright. Sarah: I told you Vince: we have some ideas for future episodes now. Yeah. Um, we'll have to chat with legal and hr, but that's okay. Yeah, that's all good. Kaitlin: Same. Um, we'll have to get an HR person. [00:38:00] No, sorry. Vince: Let it, let it be. It's better. Um. Maybe not too, I dunno. Kaitlin: Oh, Sarah: what do you not know about us? We really value, um, quality care, accessible Kaitlin: care. They may know that, they may know that part. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: But also work-life balance clearly. Kaitlin: We support women in the workplace. Yes. Mm-hmm. I think both of us have unfortunately experienced, um, challenges, professional challenges associated with trying to be a working woman mom in the workplace. Mm-hmm. And, um, it's really hard sometimes, um, when you're trying to raise your children, have children, raise children, and also. Be a leader in your field. Um, and so we, we want to support women and work life [00:39:00] balance and working moms. Daniel: Yep. Sarah: Yeah. Kaitlin: Um, I think that, you know, we have the potential to put together, I mean, we have an incredible team and multiple members of our team are moms who struggled with, you know, walking that line of you can't miss more than, you know, five or six days a year. Mm-hmm. But also have kids and raise kids and take care of them when they're sick, but also don't ever miss work or get sick yourself. Mm-hmm. Vince: Right. Yeah. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Kaitlin: But also come to work and take care of everyone else at your own expense. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Kaitlin: And. You know, it's tough. Yeah. And so I think something that we feel passionate about is, is supporting women in the workplace. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: And I'll add to that, that it was part of me opening restorative health and wellness because I wanted to set a new standard for especially the ancillary service care. Mm-hmm. Um, when you're not a physician or an a PP, you're [00:40:00] just a therapist. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: Um. But you have high demands when it comes to direct care. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: Direct patient care. But there can be a balance and you shouldn't be punished for having children or a life outside of work. And so part of me opening restorative health and wellness was truly to show, um, people that there can be a balance. You know, you can, you can have that and achieve that and, um, you can have autonomy too. Daniel: Mm-hmm. Sarah: And that's what I really am very passionate about in instilling in my employees, is that you work hard and you see the benefits. Your patients know you, you establish really good rapport with them, and they understand when things happen, things happen. Mm-hmm. You know, and, and. When you hire good people, um, and you have good people on your side that have like-minded values [00:41:00] at the end of the day, and you're all in it for the same reasons. Kaitlin: Yeah. Sarah: You can, you can achieve that. Kaitlin: We don't want our employees to worry about losing their job if they get sick. Mm-hmm. Or if their child, child gets sick. Daniel: Yeah. Kaitlin: Yeah. I mean, just really simple stuff. Daniel: Fair enough. Daniel: Yeah. Kaitlin: So, Daniel: yeah. Vince: Well, kudos to you guys for taking the leap. Mm-hmm. Vince: Um, a lot of people are not, they, they have the idea, they have the vision, but they're, they're too afraid to do so. I mean. We see it all the time. Daniel: Yeah. Vince: Uh, so kudos to you guys for doing that. We wish you much success. Mm-hmm. Thank you, you so much. Um, you are filling a much needed void. Daniel: Yep. Vince: Um, not just from personal experience, but I think, I think the sky's the limit for you guys. And I like the fact that you have a vision you like, we just don't wanna. Come out here and do this on the north side of Indianapolis and whatever happens, happens like you Oh no. You have a vision, which we have Kaitlin: plans Vince: is key. I like it. I like it. So we look forward to talking about that in future episodes. Guys, this is gonna be a multi, uh, a multi episode series, multi part series, if you [00:42:00] will. Yeah. Should get interesting. I, this first one, start off with a bang, right? Yeah, Daniel: yeah. Vince: We'll, we will make sure we do all future tapings of this on Friday afternoons. Yep. And, um, Daniel: mandatory. Vince: I don't know whether to say you're welcome or I'm sorry. Oh, Daniel: I don't know. That'll be for legal to decide later. Vince: Yeah. Daniel: All Vince: right. Daniel: Great. Vince: Well, thank you guys for tuning to this episode of the Summits podcast. We appreciate you guys taking the time out of your day to, uh. Take a listen, uh, laugh at us as well. Uh, we appreciate it. And don't forget all this is the name of Beat Cancer.