Seas 2 ep 4 Maurice Morgan === Jean Greene: [00:00:00] I want to welcome to the program today a gospel legend. Mr. Maurice Morgan is with us to discuss gospel music and his experiences in it and his thoughts on it. Mr. Maurice, welcome. Maurice Morgan: Good to be here. Thanks for having me. Jean Greene: I am so honored that you're here. I guess I want to start with how you came to be in Utica. Maurice Morgan: I came here in 2004. Came to Jackson, first of all Jean Greene: Okay. Maurice Morgan: Playing for the Canton Spirituals. Jean Greene: Okay. Maurice Morgan: And one Sunday evening, I went to play for a group called Young Men in Christ. And their cousin sing in a group called the James Family. Jean Greene: Okay. Maurice Morgan: When I got there, I saw her Uhhuh, and so later on we talked, and I got hooked up with her Uhhuh and I never left. Jackson. So [00:01:00] then, she's from Utica. And I actually, I met most of the people from her church before I met her. Jean Greene: Oh. How does that happen? Maurice Morgan: Because I met her cousins first. Jean Greene: Okay. Maurice Morgan: Had ever seen her. I met her cousins Uhhuh. And so when I finally saw her one of the guys Ralph Nelson. That's my cousin. Yeah. Yeah. want to meet her? Yeah. I guess so. But, and on that, the rest is history. We've been married now 13 years. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. And now prior to that I come, like I said, came here with. To play for the Canton Spirituals. That's, that was my main goal to come here and I didn't expect to come here and get hooked up. Yeah. And be here forever. But here I am. Jean Greene: The life. Life is life. Yes, ma'am. you were playing for the Canton Spirituals. What instruments do you play? Maurice Morgan: Lead guitar, I play bass and I play a little keyboard. But my main instruments, guitar, lead guitar. Okay. Yes, ma'am. So you come to Mississippi from North Carolina, not ever thinking that you was gonna make Mississippi your home. Never thought that because prior to that [00:02:00] 1986, I came here to play for a gentleman that, that reside in Raymond Willie Banks. Jean Greene: Oh, okay. Maurice Morgan: I played Willie Banks in 1986. Wow. And I always wanted. Because back where we were from, we always hear about the Mississippi groups, the Jackson Southern Airs the Williams brothers. Of course, Willie Banks and the Messengers. And they were really big in our eyesight, so and to come here. In 1986, playing for Willie Banks was a big thing for a little country boy like me from Wilson, North Carolina. Jean Greene: So, the fame or the information about these Mississippi groups went beyond Mississippi. Maurice Morgan: Yes. Yes. Yeah. They, it's a thing that says that a prophet's not honoring his own country. Jean Greene: Mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: But man we thought those guys were stars. And to me, they still are, uhhuh because they they played a real important role in, in our lives. I, my grandfather was a he was a farmer. And he on the tractor, sometimes you could hear the radio playing and just, he would play stuff like, the CBS Trumpeters. Yeah. Of [00:03:00] course you hear the Jackson Southernairs. You Uhhuh and Willie Banks and his Jackson Southernairs before he came Willie Banks in the Messengers. The history of Mississippi was already. embedded before I got here. Uhhuh yeah. Jean Greene: Yeah. Uhhuh. So prior to the eighties, Maurice Morgan: right? Jean Greene: Yes. Yes. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Prior to the eighties. Jean Greene: It's really interesting what you said about a prophet's not honored in its own land. That's one reason that I wanted to do this program? Maurice Morgan: Yes, ma'am. Jean Greene: Is let people know locally and nationally, globally. Yes, ma'am. That there is a vital influence, right? That that's exerted through the groups here. Talk about. Once you got to Mississippi and decided that your life and your wife were gonna be here. Maurice Morgan: I uh, like I said the day I met them, I saw her, she was seen with her group. The James Family Uhhuh, and you, I'm sitting here looking at all these pretty girls, and, but I, I remember when [00:04:00] I. Down here they do a little thing. If it's three or four groups traveling together, they convoy to the programs. Jean Greene: Oh, wow. Maurice Morgan: At that time, yeah. I think it was like two or three groups following each other. They was meeting up at the, I think it was the, it was a McDonald's in, in Canton. And so she pulled up on a little white Jeep. Pulled out, started walking. I said, Hey man. I said, who was that? He said, so Ralph Nelson? That's my cousin, man you want, you want to meet there? I said. She would like to, I said that like wife material, so I guess I spoke it, yeah. I said like wife material, so you know. Jean Greene: Oh Maurice Morgan: good. And so a, after being here for a while, and they had a couple rehearsals. And she said one night she said, why don't you come go with me to my rehearsal? And so I went there and started working with them. And. The rest is history. 'cause I've done two CDs on them. Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: since we've been together, I sure have. Oh, Jean Greene: that's, that is awesome. Yeah. That's awesome. Your cd, you b before we get further into it you have how many CDs for yourself? Maurice Morgan: This is my first one. [00:05:00] Jean Greene: Okay. Maurice Morgan: This is my first one. I've helped a whole lot of different, like I said, different groups let me say it like this. Okay. It was a group back home. I don't know if this song got here or not, about Lord keeps sending lessons my way. Okay. They also wrote, I Want to Go Where A Thunder Don't Row Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: but but that's when the Thunder Don't Roar Rather. And the Jackson Southernaires, they heard them sing it and they were influenced though. They recorded also. Jean Greene: Oh, wow. Maurice Morgan: And so it was a group called Willis Pitman and the bird of this, they were from Richmond, Virginia. I started with them and then I went from there to Willie Banks. I. From Willie Banks message to a group called the Fantastic Violinaires. Wow. From the Violinaires I went to let me see, lemme get it right. A group from Ohio called the Pilgrim Wonders. From the pilgrim wonders to the gospel keynotes. Wow. Jean Greene: From Maurice Morgan: the gospel keynotes to the five blind boys, Alabama. And my last stop was no, I'm sorry. It was another gentleman that sang with a group called The Sensational Nightingale. His name was Charles Johnson Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: He done what they call Southern Gospel. And so I was at Charles Johnson a few years, but my last stop was the Canton [00:06:00] Spirituals. Jean Greene: Wow. Wow. Talk to me about Rightful Heir, your CD that you've just released. Maurice Morgan: That Rightful Heir was something that like I said, I was talking with Charles Johnson. He's the guy that wrote, it's gonna rain. I want to be at the meeting. Jean Greene: Mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: And we were sitting there talking one day and he had a song that says, my father owns a cattle on a thousand heels. I believe I own just one. And in other words, when I, when I think of his face and I see I how do they put that? But anyway, it ended up saying that I'm rich in faith. And love and joy. I got more than my share uhhuh. And I'm, one day I'll be moving to my mansion where I'm a rightful heir. Jean Greene: Wow. Yes. Yes. Maurice Morgan: Where I'm a rightful heir. Everything that God's has given to me and has granted to me. I think I deserve it. 'cause I'm a rightful heir. I'm his. Jean Greene: Alright. your album has 12 different songs on it. Yes. I'm really excited about hearing this Maurice Morgan: Yes, ma'am. Jean Greene: And adding this to the museum [00:07:00] collection. But I want to talk some more about this in a little bit. Okay. But let's talk a little about what gospel music is to you and what it's done for you. Can you take us there? Maurice Morgan: Yes ma'am. Because I was, I was born before my mom and dad got married. Lived with my grandparents, Jean Greene: Uhhuh Maurice Morgan: and they had a group at that time called the Lucas Family. Okay. And that was my grandmother, granddad. And my uncle played guitar and I had a cousin that played bass. And so that's what I was raised upon then. And grandma take us up to church. And at that time, when we go to church, once you learn how to read, there was always a red hymnal. In the back of the pew. So when the choir sing, if you didn't know the words, the thing was to don't look at the choir, get the hymnal and sing along with everybody. Join in and sing along. And and though the words that I would read sometime, it took me a long time when I got older, I said, oh. That's what that meant, blessed quietness, holy [00:08:00] quietness. What assurance in my soul on a stormy sea, speak to me and to be little cease to row and know? I came, A young man said, oh, now I see. But it was just stuff that grandma was trying to teach us at the time. Ain't no, and she would say I can't give it to you. He said, but just pray and give, let God give you understanding, Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: And so the music that they sang, and I saw the way they reacted. And some of the stuff I didn't understand 'cause I was so young. But, I saw the way it would move her and I saw the way it would move my granddaddy, to the point that she would what they call back in the day, they call it shouting. Right. It was a foot praise, and and she would just sometime be in the kitchen, she'll hum along or some song and it would get so down in her until she'll just stop for a minute. We'll go in there and see what's going on with her. Go back in there and do what you're doing. I'm just having time. Me and the Lord Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: So the music that she would let us hear, she had a album. It was a record player. And at that time it was like, I think that the speed of was 16. Jean Greene: Oh, okay. [00:09:00] Yeah. Maurice Morgan: 16. And they were real thick. Thick, yes. Yeah. Yeah. And so she would play those songs like, the pews what was it? The consolers waiting for my child to come home. Jean Greene: Oh Maurice Morgan: yeah. And all that kind of stuff, man. Made it work out. Done speak for me. So this is songs. We hear it all. Every day. Really? Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: and when they go in the field, the work granddaddy had a old radio that sometimes the static, comes up. Right. But as long as there was some gospel music, he would play it. But during that time, gospel music only was played for a short length of time. It's not like it is now. It's plentiful now. You can hear it every day. Jean Greene: Mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: But you know, When we did hear it, it was as far as short. Period of time, maybe an hour. Jean Greene: Uhhuh Maurice Morgan: Saturday you're here for an hour. But Sunday. Jean Greene: Oh, yes. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. They had a big radio and they just blasted Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: And what you getting ready to do then is getting washed up, getting ready, come eat, and then it's time to go to church. And, and we'll pull up in the, the church yard sometime when I could hear them singing there, having testimony Uhhuh. And you knew who [00:10:00] was singing what because you knew their voices. But everybody had their way of expressing what they felt. And, and I think that's part I'm gonna go up to now. I think sometimes that's what we have a issue with. Everybody. Don't express theirself the way when they sing. Everybody express self a different way. Yes. When they sing and, and that's why you got the different artists, because everybody brings something different, Jean Greene: right? Maurice Morgan: If we all sound the same, wouldn't be no need for exactly. A Willie Banks or a Mississippi Mass or what's it? Whatever, you know? but like I said, when I was small that, those songs I would hear 'em and they would come down in me, and I didn't really realize that sometime it gave me this feeling that I didn't, I couldn't understand as a young boy. But. When I would hear Michael Jackson. I liked Michael Jackson 'cause he, we were around us. He was a couple years older than me. But you only saw that only shortly at the time too. 'cause we only had about three channels. But uh, what I'm trying to say about it was at that time. That was the devil's music, Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: So [00:11:00] we, we had to stick with the gospel music. Jean Greene: That's right. Maurice Morgan: And if you're gonna listen to it, you couldn't listen to it in my, in grandma's house. That's right. Or my parents' house. You had to there was something that had to be done away from the house, but it was something that was instilled in me gospel music. And it seems like now there is that same feeling I get when I can tell when somebody's singing it from their heart. Jean Greene: Yes, exactly. Exactly. Maurice Morgan: And I can tell when somebody's just saying words. And the words might be true, but you can tell when they're just singing words instead of feeling it. It's a difference. Jean Greene: You're talking about the you mentioned at one point the the songs we heard in the sixties. And the way that was distributed to us. So that really resonates because, yeah. People forget now when we have all of this access that at one time there was no access. That's right. That's right. And if we could hear it, if we heard it through the week, it was really rare. And [00:12:00] es especially. on like Saturdays. You might hear it like you said, for an hour. But it seemed like us all that played all day Sunday. Maurice Morgan: That's right. Jean Greene: You heard it on the radio. There might not have been a television program with Maurice Morgan: the, I can't recall that. I only thing I recall was in his seventies. There was of course it was Southern gospel then. It was a group called, I'm trying to think of their names right now, but they came on every Sunday morning. Jubilee, you in entire, you are invited to this gospel jubilee. But was, I remember that, yes, it was white groups, but we sit there and listen to that because that's the only thing you're going to see on TV at that time. And it was some of the, I can't think of the name of groups right now. But the Happy Goodmans, Jean Greene: the Maurice Morgan: happy Goodmans. I remember them. And it was the Florida Boys. Matter of fact, the Florida boys are the one who really hosted the Gospel, Jubilee. Jean Greene: As Maurice Morgan: well. Yeah. Jean Greene: And it's interesting that you mentioned that because those were white groups. Maurice Morgan: White groups. That's right. Jean Greene: And so you would see them but you might not see [00:13:00] us. Maurice Morgan: That's right. Jean Greene: That's right. That's right. So, The Southern gospel Maurice Morgan: That's right. Is. Jean Greene: Just a little bit different from the gospel music of Black folks at the time. That's right. And now, because there are Christian artists as opposed to gospel. That's right. Artists. Talk about you mentioned you can tell when somebody is just singing the words and when somebody is singing from the spirit. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Jean Greene: I'm not gonna ask artists because that, that that's not helpful. But can we talk about, you mentioned how when you were a young boy and they were words but you could tell that there was something going on with the older folks. Maurice Morgan: Right. Jean Greene: Talk about how that translates down through time. Now Maurice Morgan: I, at that time when I was a little boy, we were talking about, the difference between the black groups and the white groups and everything. Mm-hmm. Like you said, we didn't have the access to things like the white people did at that point in time. And so they were like I said, my [00:14:00] granddad was a farmer and everything, and we worked hard during the week, but when you get to church and you hear them sing one of the guys, her songs said, I got just a little while to stay here. Jean Greene: Mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: And I'll be leaving through those pearly gates uh, words, you know, and once one guy said it, it won't always be like this. I hope it won't be this way. Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: And that was a song by a black group that time called the Angelic Gospel Singers. Jean Greene: Yes. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. They under bound for Mount Zions and stuff. Uhhuh. Uhhuh. But those Mahalia Jackson and all those people were really strong in the late sixties and early seventies. And so when we go to church, man, we would hear if somebody was singing, I ain't got long to stay here. You can tell, man, it, it came from all that hard work and Jean Greene: Yes. Maurice Morgan: What they've been going through, they were singing about what they went through. And knowing that someday it's gonna be a change, and I just, I would hear some people come to church and sing, had nice voices. And it, it excites you because the voice was nice, but it's something different when they start singing from the gut. From the [00:15:00] soul. And it was a guy that recently passed not too long ago, didn't have a great voice, but when he sang he meant every word that, and that was Lee Williams. Jean Greene: Yes. Maurice Morgan: Yes. And we had those people back in our church like that. They didn't have great voices that go way up in the air and come back down and do all these floats. But they were singing from experience. A Reverend FC Barnes, I remember that was a little boy. He used to come around and sing. Jean Greene: Oh, okay. Maurice Morgan: And that was way before Rough Side Mountain, because Uhhuh, he done Rough Side of the Mountain. That was in the eighties. But we're talking about like in the seventies. And he had this black, continental and he'll be the only man Uhhuh he'll get out. And when he opened that door, it seemed like 15 women would get outta the car, because you could pack a whole lot of folks in cars then Uhhuh. But they'd come in there, man, and they would sing from their heart. They weren't looking for money, Uhhuh, but they had, they were singing about, and they said why you always singing about hard times? He would say. I write about what I knew about. Jean Greene: Oh yeah. Yeah. Maurice Morgan: And so a lot of times when I was listening to [00:16:00] them, church, sing their songs, man. And, and they, you see the tears flowing. You knew it was coming from the heart. And other than somebody just getting there singing. A selection. We're gonna have a little song about Brother Maurice. Yeah. You might Brother Ma. Always get there, sing, got these all pretty runs. Give my hand. Jean Greene: Yeah. Maurice Morgan: But you can tell something different when. The next gentleman gets up and sing and he sing it from his heart and from his soul. It leaves a different kind of impression on him. It Jean Greene: does. Maurice Morgan: Yes, it Jean Greene: does. It does. That is so true. Maurice Morgan: Yes, Jean Greene: ma'am. That's so true. I really am enjoying hearing you talk about the Times I remember. Maurice Morgan: Yes, ma'am. Jean Greene: And I want you to I, I had a thought right when we were talking about that, about these songs that we heard. When the old folks, the old deacon would get up and do his hymn, Maurice Morgan: right? Jean Greene: It, they all seemed the same. The same seemed to sing the same one. I love the Lord. He heard my cry. That's right. And then the church would take up. And that, I remember when me being a young person I was like, what are they talking about? And then as I [00:17:00] got older, I was like, oh, okay. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Jean Greene: I know what you're saying. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Yeah. Jean Greene: So it was a way of, as you said, teaching us Maurice Morgan: That's right. Jean Greene: And preparing us. For where we needed to go. Maurice Morgan: Yes, ma'am. Jean Greene: Talk about the importance of, the way gospel has evolved over the years. I'm talking Black Gospel has evolved over the years. especially from your experience of playing it and singing it, Maurice Morgan: I mentioned a few earlier, what I was raised up on. Angelic gospel singers. Jean Greene: Yes. Maurice Morgan: The Consolers. Mm-hmm. And, it was a group called the CBS Trumpeters the Dixie Hummingbirds. And those guys like Pilgrim Jubilees. It was it was, you could tell then that it was real gospel. It was something that, when you heard it, you knew it was gospel music. Jean Greene: Yes. Maurice Morgan: And, so we talking about, to me, I'm talking about maybe the latter part of sixties, seventies. And I saw it when it. Started to [00:18:00] change when they started talking about contemporary, and at that time, Andre Crouch was considered, the Hawkins was considered contemporary, but they had, they saw him. When you listen to it still, you can listen to it and tell that it was gospel music, but as time went on and you start getting toward the nineties, I had to start listening real good. Jean Greene: That's Maurice Morgan: right. Because they would even, they say, you are so good to me. I I can feel you from the crown of my head to the sole of my feet, but they would never say Jesus. Jean Greene: Mm-hmm. That's Maurice Morgan: right. You know, It's like they were kind to the point where they didn't want you to say the Lord's name. And I saw that from from the sixties up until I, I'm gonna say around the eighties. And I saw when it started to change as a little boy, they didn't want you to even say God's name, yeah. And 'cause like I said, going to school, we used to sing songs in school. They allowed us to sing songs in school. Uhhuh got to a certain point, we couldn't sing or pray in school. And I think all that made a drastic change toward even the music. Because no prayer, which, [00:19:00] you're taking Jesus out everything. Really, what do you have to sing about? Jean Greene: What do you have to Maurice Morgan: sing about when it comes down to gospel music? Mm-hmm. What you're calling real gospel music. And I saw that change and I saw it. It started taking effect. So now not calling any names, you hear certain things and and certain music. You sit there and you say, I wonder is God pleased? I wonder is he really satisfied where we have taken to this? And a lot of matters? I don't believe he really is, but that's just the way I feel about. Mm-hmm. It's just I think that, if you say you are driving, there's a difference between a Chevrolet and a Cadillac. Jean Greene: That's true. Maurice Morgan: It's just a difference, and there's a difference between when you say God and when you say the devil. Mm-hmm. And sometimes, people say there's such thing as, going too far and, but we are living into a place now that we can just about to do what we want to do. And that. The music, even though it's changing tremendously however they want to do it. It goes along with the flow. [00:20:00] But I say it like this and I'm not going to downgrade anybody that. They want to do it to me, and for me, it's a certain way I gotta do it Jean Greene: uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: or to me, it's not gospel music. Jean Greene: I got you. You mentioned that sometimes it's, you have to listen carefully to see what they were singing about. And I really I can't give an example of it 'cause I can't think of one right now, but I've heard songs and I go that's, wait, is that a guy what they, is that supposed to be a praise song? Maurice Morgan: Right, right. Jean Greene: Because it's secular. To, and there's nothing wrong with the ones that, that uh, that's that's right. I'm not trying to Maurice Morgan: That's right. Jean Greene: To say that's quote unquote bad. But when you talk about the genre the gospel music, the genre and you hear some of the things that are trying to fit every genre. What. Purpose do you have in trying to fit every [00:21:00] genre except trying to sell as much as you can. Right, So then is that your ministry or is that your business? Maurice Morgan: I think it's end up turn to a business. I think that's what happened. We, it becomes a business, and don't get me wrong, everything you do. You need to have some sort of, yeah. You need to have some sort of business with it. But don't forget what you're doing, it's just years ago when I was a little boy, when my mom and dad took us to town and they, they got married. We moved this time around five o'clock in the evening. You could smell the food because everybody was cooking. About the same time you could smell the food, and then you hear somebody say, all right, y'all come eat. And everybody was going to a different house or Jean Greene: mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: even if you're a friend's house, they said, come on in, eat. But you could smell the food. Jean Greene: That's right. Maurice Morgan: And you knew that, and know somebody was cooking some greens or or whatever it might be. You could smell it. But now. You can be right at a restaurant, and things have changed so much. You can't hardly [00:22:00] smell fool anymore. Jean Greene: That's right. ' Maurice Morgan: cause things have changed so much. And that's what I feel about gospel music. I used to hear from all the way down the street. And I can say, oh man, that's that's the caravans Jean Greene: uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: that's Shirley Caesar. Now you gotta listen. Say, who was that? 'Cause you sometimes it's hard to distinguish where it is. Yes, ma'am. I, i'm glad you mentioned that because that commonality, that neighborhood feel of being in the neighborhood and you knew everybody was cooking. Somebody, miss so and so got her chicken on us. Somebody cooking, salmon croquettes has, do I smell? That was a, that's a part of our village, right? Jean Greene: That we have. Allowed to leave us. And that is sorely missed. Yes. It's, and it's not just the food cooking, it was that everybody knew who, Maurice is over at so-and-so's them house. And he knows he had to get home before such and such time before he get dark because, you know, we are missing a lot of [00:23:00] that. And I think the gospel music that we have now. And I'm not talking about all of it because there are groups and there, there are artists that still, even though they're singing in a genre that's not quite gospel. Some of them, as you said before, you can still hear when they're singing from their soul Maurice Morgan: that. That's right. Jean Greene: Even though it may be a praise break kinda song if that's coming from their soul, you can still feel that. I think of a song by, I'm gonna mention this one artist uh, Liandra Johnson. Mm-hmm. And another one, oh Lord, I can't think of what the girl's name, one of those sister groups. Maurice Morgan: Clark sisters? Jean Greene: Yes. Maurice Morgan: Okay. Jean Greene: Yes. The Clark sisters. Sometimes you can hear in their voices, oh yeah. That, that, that's from their soul. Yeah. So would you say reaching into the soul is the soul of gospel [00:24:00] music? Maurice Morgan: It is. It is. You just said when you talked about the Clark sisters, I didn't really, when I started traveling, I didn't see them that much. Because we were, what they would call, we were considered quartet. And they were considered, it was contemporary. Jean Greene: Ah, yeah. Maurice Morgan: But when you saw them get to the stage, you could hear the upbringing. You could hear that, that, that somebody knew something about the Lord, and when they start singing, man, you could feel what they were doing. And uh, there were people that, I watched Kirk Franklin one night which is totally different from anything I ever seen in my life. But he started singing, someone asked the question why do we sing? Jean Greene: Yes. Maurice Morgan: And I was sitting, listening to him and I'm like, man, he comes from Stomp. And then he comes back and starts singing. The reason why I sing Uhhuh Silver and Gold, I'd rather have Jesus silver gold. My thing is. I can tell when the tide change. Yes. I think there, there's some artists that knows that, like you said, they do it for the reason. They do it for, okay. They want to please [00:25:00] the young people. They want to please that one. But it comes down to it. They know where to go to. Jean Greene: They Maurice Morgan: know where to, Jean Greene: exactly that song, that Kirk Franklin song. The reason why we sing, the first time I heard it the Utica Jubilee Singers under Dr. Bobby Cooper. Maurice Morgan: Okay. I heard my white over. Jean Greene: Were in the Shirley Hopkins Davis Amphitheater now and, I had gone in to, listen, I'm working up in the library and they said the Jubilees are singing. I'm, oh, okay, fine. So I go over to just be present. So they have an audience. I didn't expect to be touched by a song. Maurice Morgan: Okay. Jean Greene: And they would, they had done some of the songs and I was like, yeah, that's not that's good baby. That's, and one of them got up to lead. The reason why we sang. And that just, I stopped. I was like what you, so I'm gonna ask a question. I can't sing. I will sing, but I can't sing. Why do we sing? And I was, I got so moved by that. I went down and talked to them [00:26:00] and said, can y'all s sing it one more time for Maurice Morgan: Yes ma'am. Yes ma'am. Yeah. Jean Greene: And I know when the, the Utica Southerners were here. The sisters were harmonizing. Just in, in pieces. And I was sitting there going, you can't shout at this microphone Jean Green. You can, you can't do it. You gonna have to get, keep that professional. Where has music taken you? You were in North Carolina? Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Jean Greene: Yeah. How has it moved you around the country and around the world? Maurice Morgan: I actually, when I was living with my grandparents, I, having the time of my life my mom was the only girl out of four. Jean Greene: Wow. Maurice Morgan: And so I was my mom's first born little nephew run around there. Sisters little boy. So I'm spoiled rotten. All my uncles play guitar. Jean Greene: Okay. Maurice Morgan: All my grandmothers brothers play guitar. They had aunties that played guitar. So by me being living with them, [00:27:00] there's always a guitar around they didn't want you messing with if you didn't know what you're doing. So they finally gave me a chance to, I started messing around with it. I watched them. So when my parents got married and we moved to town what we said. Jean Greene: Mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: I was standing on the um, a potato basket one day. I did a middle of the yard plan and the kids started coming around looking. And so I was, trying to figure out why are they standing here looking at me like this Jean Greene: Uhhuh? Maurice Morgan: I said here, you do it. He said, oh, I can't do that. And that's when, by me being in a rural area I thought that's what everybody did they said, I, we can't do that. So I was like, oh. So I started singing and it was a lady that lived across the street named Ms. Loce Best. At the time my mom and dad wasn't really in church. Fully uhhuh. My dad would I wouldn't see him after Friday. I'd probably see him again Sunday morning, Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: but he'll come in and say, all right. Let's go to Church Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: he'd been out drinking. But Uhhuh, we started to go to church, and if he didn't go, there was a church next door and a church down the street. He sent us to church. And uh, the lady across the street, miss Lord be said, I want you to sing in my [00:28:00] junior choir little church called St. Paul in Wilson, North Carolina. Started singing with them, man. And we started singing and they started taking us around, like maybe in. Like 30 mile radius, we go Jean Greene: Oh wow. Maurice Morgan: Places called Goldsboro, North Carolina. Fayetteville, we were getting around, and so this little guy that's singing, yes, Jesus loves me, they would say, when they see me, you gonna sing your song tonight? And I was singing, yes, Jesus loves me. And miss Loyce Best started me singing. And uh, we was coming back from church one night and it's, three women were in the car and I was sitting in the back seat. One of the ladies was dressed ar and said, you know what, baby? You going to go a long way. Said, God's going bless you. My baby gonna be a singer. And I'm saying and at that time I had a little high voice, you know, and it, I guess it was cute to people. 'cause you get a certain age and if your voice is not really that great, it ain't cute no more. So I started playing guitar. And so my family had, we had a family group called the Morgan Family. So later God touched my dad's heart, my dad became a minister. Jean Greene: Wow. Maurice Morgan: [00:29:00] And so we he pastor the church. And as I was growing up, say it just like it is, if you play piano, you was considered a sissy. Uhhuh. So he said, I want you to start playing piano. I was like, he said, yeah, man, I'm gonna, I'm gonna need a piano player at my church. Man. Said, and man, I did not want to do that, but I learned how to play, and he he would say, some Sunday mornings out, I would grab a guitar thing. I'm gonna play guitar. No, I need you to play piano. And it just it just took all the wind outta me, man. Because I wanted to be a quartet. Gospel guitarist. That's what I wanted to be Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: But I it the Bible says your gift will make room for you. Jean Greene: Yeah. Maurice Morgan: And it did because leaving in 1983, I was going to technical college. And my mind just wasn't on doing no working a job. Uhhuh man, every time I saw or listened to one of the groups on the radio. Man, I gotta get me with a group. I gotta get with a group. And I gotta travel, and being around listening to the the groups on the radio, like I said, you had, [00:30:00] at the time, you had the Mightly Cloths of Joy. The Dix Hum, the soul stars. The caravans, and I didn't really care. What group I was going get with. I just wanted to get with a group and I wanted to travel. Jean Greene: Yeah. Maurice Morgan: That's what I wanted to do. And sometime, man, we live not far from the interstate, you'll see the buses come by. That's why the bus might say the mighty Cloud Joy. Jean Greene: Yeah. Maurice Morgan: Wow, man. See, that's what I want to do. That's what I want to do. Yeah. James Cleveland. And, you know, and and that's what I wanted to do. And so once I started hanging around different quartet, local quartets groups. They'll sometimes be on what they call, they shared the stage with the big groups. Like the Soul Stirs and d Right. and so I was out one day playing for one of the small groups. Little group called the Sunset Spirituals back home. And one of the guys said, Hey man, that little guy play Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: one before developed yet, but they saw the potential. And I really wasn't ready, but one of the guitar players, Kevin Wilson, said, Hey, we're gonna give him a shot. And that's where it started with like I said, with the group called The Burden Start. The Burden Lifters started there. But they were [00:31:00] considered as a group that wasn't growing. It's like a regional thing. They were Jean Greene: Oh, I see. Maurice Morgan: Up and down 95 where I lived at. They, what Jean Greene: was that group name again? Maurice Morgan: Willis Pittman and the Burden Lifters. Jean Greene: Okay. Okay. Maurice Morgan: They, the one to record it. I want to go where the thunder don't roar. Jean Greene: Oh, yes. Okay. Maurice Morgan: And after that the man said. I know I know what I'm gonna do with you. I'm gonna get you hooked to Willie Banks. And so when they saw me play and like I said, I wasn't fully developed, but they took me and they started telling me the do's and the don'ts and what not to do. And I was like, man, I didn't, I thought I was gonna be, I was having fun. I didn't know it was going to end up being work, and that's what it ended up being. It ended up being I started seeing what it took to be a gospel singer. A musician, and when you look at the, at this time, you look at the quartet groups. We were called the Chitlin Circuit. Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Yeah. Maurice Morgan: Yes. We weren't making the big money as as the groups like the Mighty Clouds of Joy, Uhhuh, they were, and they were considered the top dogs at tiny mighty clouds of joy. And the soul Stirrers, of course, the Soul Stirrers only went so far because Sam Cook left. [00:32:00] Jean Greene: That's right. Maurice Morgan: No, he left, that's right. And he kinda stagnated them because. After he left, they were still singing, Lord remember me, if I could only touch the hem of his garment. Because those songs that he did, they left such an impact, that they had to sing those songs because they left such an impact. But it was just one of those things that when I started Listen and song, how the industry was, I wanted to be a part of it. I wanted to be a part of it. One of the guys, slim Supreme said one day, he said, Hey man, you play. All right. You do, but you got a long way to go. And it. It just took all the wind under me. Jean Greene: Oh, no. Maurice Morgan: And I thought it was being cruel, Jean Greene: uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: but what they were trying in everything it takes time. It takes, and even preaching, you know that, that's right. You start pastoring, yeah. Sometimes you do things, sometimes that seems so close to be the spirit. Sometimes it's your own Jean Greene: uhhuh own Maurice Morgan: thought, and so it's the same thing, everything you do. But gospel music at that time when they started telling me the dos and don'ts. I didn't understand it. Because I just thought everybody came out just can just praise [00:33:00] the Lord and just that's what it was. But man, it, they wanted to understand that each group had its signature sound. Oh. See, everybody had a signature sound. When you hear Jane Cleaver, you knew it's Jane Cleaver. Jean Greene: That's right. Maurice Morgan: When you hear Edna Tina Walker, you knew it was her. Everybody had their, and so that's what they taught me when I came not knowing that a little guy from the projects. I would soon travel all across the world and even took me overseas. Jean Greene: Oh, wow. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Five Blind Boys took me overseas and Jean Greene: Oh. Talk about you, you mentioned the Five Blind Boys earlier, and I was like, Ooh, I know that group. Maurice Morgan: Yes, ma'am. Jean Greene: When did you play with that, when did you make it to Alabama to play with The Five Blind? Maurice Morgan: I was playing for a group called the Gospel Keynotes. Jean Greene: Okay. Yes. Maurice Morgan: And Clarence Fountain man, he was Jean Greene: Oh, Clarence Fountain. Yeah. Maurice Morgan: Clarence Fountain. I was always, I was a I'm a jokester. I love to play, and I'll be, give mimicking what they'll say and stuff. And he said, is that Maurice? I said, yeah, tell him. I said, come here. He said, you want to go with the blind boys? I said, I don't [00:34:00] know. He said, we go everywhere. He said, we stay across the water. And so I said man, maybe so, you know, I said well, you know, I was nervous because I had never been Uhhuh, and man, I, that's when I was over in, I want to say I was in Frankfurt, Germany. And I was like, man, a little boy from Wilson, North Carolina. Jean Greene: There you go. Maurice Morgan: From the projects, we didn't have that much, didn't have money. Mm-hmm. And, I tell him, I get emotional about it, it's just God took me. Everywhere I could think about, I wanted to go overseas and I was, I said, here I am in Switzerland. And I remember one Christmas morning I said this ain't gonna happen no more. Lord, I can't. I called back home and my mom was cooking and then, and so when I looked out the window. A group of people got there, they started singing Silent Night and I said, oh God, what have I done? But that group, the the Five Blind Boys, they were reason why I was able to go a lot of places overseas, Uhhuh that had, I never thought that I would be able to do that Uhhuh, but it's, that's what the Five Blind Boys, they were [00:35:00] different. Clarence Fountain, he's deceased now. Jean Greene: Mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: A lot of the guys, but I got the guys that I got a chance to sing were with were the guys that I used to. Looking on album covers, when I was a little boy Jean Greene: Uhhuh Maurice Morgan: and I was like, man, you know, and Mr. Archie Brown lead, I never got a chance to meet. But I heard so much talk about and they always say he was part of the Blind Boys and they were, really excited about Archie Brown lead, being a part of Five Blind Boys. I say, so you are a part of legacy, so you know That's right. Hey man and I got a chance to, and doing that, the Dixon Hummingbirds were also traveling, doing, traveling overseas. And so I got know those guys personally, man. But out here I am saying, everybody was on the radio and I was a little boy. I learning them on first name basis, Jean Greene: isn't it? Something? Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Jean Greene: Yeah. Isn't that is so exciting though. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Yeah. Jean Greene: You still travel with different groups now, right? Maurice Morgan: Yes, ma'am. Jean Greene: Not just the James family, not just your home family. Maurice Morgan: Right. Right. Jean Greene: Talk about some of the things that you are doing, some of the places you are going, and I was lucky to be able to get you to come [00:36:00] down and sit down and talk to us. I understand that, and I appreciate that because I know your schedule is also. Always full and cramped, and I'm excited that you were able to carve out this little bit of time Maurice Morgan: Yes, ma'am. Jean Greene: To come to the museum and talk about gospel music with us. But tell us a little bit about what you're doing these days. Maurice Morgan: These days I and Angela, Angela James. From here in Utica, we have, we uh, got married. And we have two children. I have a stepdaughter, Uhhuh, and I have a son who's 12 years old. Jean Greene: Oh, wow. Maurice Morgan: So Jean Greene: get right on the cusp with those teens. I, Maurice Morgan: and I'm 59 at this point in time. But coming here, it it done a lot for me. I was able to slow down. Jean Greene: Mm. Maurice Morgan: And understand I was moving so fast at one time that I didn't really. I was just singing and playing and I, and one day I just got a chance to sit down and said, God, Lord, you've done a lot for me. You've done a lot for me. A lot of these groups that I used to [00:37:00] dream that I was playing with now Malaco Studios, which is in Jackson. There's not too many artists that haven't played for. Wow. You talk about the angelic gospel singer. Yes. The gospel keynotes. The Soul Stars. The Highway QCs. Oh man. The Ever Readys, so whenever they got something going over there they'll see how my schedule is and and uh, that was one of the highlights of my life, because I was a little boy back at at home. The records would come by, like I said, the Jackson s William Brothers, and I look at the back of the album, it says Jean Greene: Malico. That's right. Maurice Morgan: Malico Man. I was like, man. I read the names who done this, who done that. And then, you know, one day I was sitting at the house, and I was sitting there thinking, I looked at a few covers and there's Maurice Morgan's name, and there it is. Yeah. I'm back up playing guitar. Mm-hmm. Or wrote the song. Or or something like that, and, this is what I'm doing now. Right now I try to reach out to upcoming groups or people that Jean Greene: mm-hmm. Maurice Morgan: choirs and that's something different for me. But I'm enjoying the trip. Jean Greene: That's Maurice Morgan: good. I'm enjoying the trip. 'cause I want everybody to be [00:38:00] good. And if, if your group's not, you think it's at the park, if I can do anything to help i, I want do what I gotta do to help. And that's what I'm doing. I love the area that we're in because we got so many upcoming groups, and so that's my that's my desire to help. The upcoming groups in the area. Yeah. Jean Greene: That's excellent. That's excellent. Thank you so much for that. You mentioned you're a songwriter. I didn't realize that. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Rights. I write. Jean Greene: Did you write these songs? Maurice Morgan: I wrote. I see, lemme see. I wrote about maybe five of those songs because I'm gonna tell you, why am I writing? Sometimes when you start hearing yourself, see it start writing, you start hearing it. Everything started to sound like you uhhuh. So therefore, I reached out to some people matter of fact. Now one of the songs called A, man of His Word. I wrote that. I actually wrote it for Huey Williams, the Jackson Southernaires. That's who I wrote it for. Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: But, his time, his schedule is kinda hectic, the guy I played four years ago, Willie Banks. He has a son called, he called himself Willie Banks Jr. So he's singing that for me. He sounds just like his dad. Jean Greene: Oh, wow. Maurice Morgan: [00:39:00] And of course there's a lady that's singing a song on on that to be like Jesus Livian Lily. She sings with a Mississippi Mass. Jean Greene: Uhhuh. Maurice Morgan: Yes. She s seen the song. Oh man. I reached out and got a few different people that um, Paul Porter Uhhuh, Paul Porter is singing a song. It was just, it was just a joy of trying to reach out and see could I wanted to, if I write this song, it's song sound like him. Jean Greene: Yeah. Maurice Morgan: And the thing was, most of the time it cost a lot of money to get these people Jean Greene: Right. Maurice Morgan: But by me playing for different groups they say, man, can you come play for me? And so a lot of those things were favors, people returned favors. Jean Greene: Wow. Because I'm looking on here, and I was like, Ooh. Okay. Yes, Maurice Morgan: ma'am. Jean Greene: Oh, all Maurice Morgan: yes, ma'am. Yes ma'am. Yeah. Jean Greene: Is there anything that I missed that we need to talk about? Maurice Morgan: I don't think so. I just, like I said, we've Jean Greene: been all over the Maurice Morgan: place yeah. Yeah. And when you start, when I start talking about this it goes so many different ways. My mind start going sometime. I know. It's, I'll get off subject because everything starts to run in together, Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: but you would asked me, how I got here. Yes. But, man [00:40:00] from Wilson, North Carolina to North Carolina, to Jackson, Mississippi, and from Jackson down here in Utica now. You would think that most of my friends. Really back in North Carolina. A lot of 'em are. But man I came here, man, and created and so many friends. Learned so many people. Yeah. And I got sick back here in February. Jean Greene: Oh. Maurice Morgan: And they gave me a benefit program and the cars that I saw, the people that I saw. And I have a friend, he's a blues artist. Castro Coleman. And he's getting around now. And he said he was walking up from, he had to park a long way down the road to get to me. He said, man, this is a beautiful thing. We doing a benefit for Maurice, and all these cars out in this yard. And he get a chance to see it. He's not dead. Jean Greene: Uhhuh, Maurice Morgan: he get a chance to see Jean Greene: Yeah. Maurice Morgan: How much people really love him. And so I was really amazed of moving here. [00:41:00] And how people just, how they responded to coming to be, to come to my aid Uhhuh, and I'm really, I'm proud of that. I'm proud of that. Jean Greene: You should be. Yeah. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. I'm proud of that, yeah. And like I said gospel music is what brought me here. Jean Greene: There's a phrase that, that I say, and I'm, serious about it, that all roads lead to Utica. The road of your life brought you to Utica. Maurice Morgan: Yeah. Jean Greene: And by being here, you are able to reach out and touch up and coming artists. Yes, Maurice Morgan: ma'am. Jean Greene: I am excited that we are able to show that a little bitty town. Maurice Morgan: That's right. Jean Greene: With just a few people in, it has this far reaching touch that has transcended time. Really? So I want to thank you. I'm not gonna keep you all day. I know you, you've got things to do, but I thank you for agreeing to come and talk to us. Yes, ma'am. About this subject and how it has affected your life and how it brought you to Utica. Yes, ma'am. And I [00:42:00] want to tell our listeners that Maurice Morgan seniors. Album Rightful Heir is available now. That's Maurice Morgan: right. Jean Greene: And where did they get a copy of? Of Maurice Morgan: all digital outlets? Jean Greene: All digital outlets. Y'all hear that? Maurice Morgan Sr. Rightful Heir. Maurice, thank you for coming today. Thank Maurice Morgan: you so much. I'm glad you asked me to come. There's so much talent here in this little town. You it's really mind blowing the talent that. Utica has. It has a lot of talent, a lot of good singers. Jean Greene: That's awesome. Maurice Morgan: Yes. Musicians. Yes. Jean Greene: So thank you so much and tune in to our next podcast where we'll be talking more about gospel music. Maurice Morgan: Thank you, Maurice. Thank you so much.