[00:00:00] Han: We are unique gentlemen in that we create ourselves through long years of rigorous training, sacrifice, denial, pain. We forge our bodies in the fire of our will, [00:00:23] Williams: man, you come right out of a comic book. [00:00:35] Matthew: We forge our podcast in the fires of our will. And welcome to another episode of the IMMP, the Inter Millennium Media Project podcast. My name is Matthew Porter, [00:00:46] Ian: and I am Ian Porter. [00:00:49] Matthew: I'm his dad. He's my son, and I make him watch movies. [00:00:56] Ian: Oh boy. Yeah. [00:00:58] Matthew: For every episode of the IMMP, I make Ian watch a movie or a TV show, or listen to a record or something from my youth. So we find out what he thinks of it. Maybe for the first time, what I think of it sometimes coming back to it after decades, and it was a very special one. , This week. [00:01:14] Ian: Yeah. I have known of these films. I've known of this actor for all of my life. I have thanks to the, thanks to a board game. I have a miniature of this man, but I have never seen any of his films until now. We finally watched Enter the Dragon starring Bruce Lee [00:01:34] Matthew: and it's interesting to think about how we finally got to this movie. Yes, because it started with, uh, your lovely bride. Jen introduced us to Lizzie McGuire, which we talked about a few episodes ago. We had, neither of us had ever seen that. Yeah. And there was an episode in of Lizzie McGuire that had a guest starring role for David Carradine. Pretty much in his role of K Chang came from Kung Fu. So last time we talked about the series, Kung Fu. But we couldn't then leave that, so we had to continue with the martial arts direction. So that from Lizzie McGuire that led us to enter the dragon, [00:02:16] Ian: which is definitely an odd circuitous route to get here. My goodness. [00:02:24] Matthew: But I knew we would have to see this at some point. And this is the. This is the one Bruce Lee movie that I saw when I was in college. So it's inbounds for the podcast. [00:02:38] Ian: Okay. So this is the only of the stuff that's inbounds. [00:02:41] Matthew: Yeah, I, I watched a lot of Bruce Lee movies later on, but this is the one that I saw on television when I was in college. And that also means that the version I saw was edited substantially from the version that we saw from the DVD. [00:02:56] Ian: I am just going to, because sometimes people join our podcast at whatever episode that's part of the wonders of the IMMP. When we say inbounds, we've got a hard limit here on the Inter Millennium Media Project where anything my dad brings to show me has to be something he watched before he graduated college. It has to be during that influential younger time in his life in order to count, and the same time, if I ever do a takeover. It doesn't pass when I graduated. Those are our hard lines. So the idea of this being the only thing in bounds, because you saw it on tv, it's like, it doesn't matter when it was filmed, it's just when it was presented. Right. So that, that's an interesting piece in terms of how far af out after it came out. 'cause this was from 73, but when were you saying you saw this? [00:03:46] Matthew: I probably saw it mid eighties. [00:03:49] Ian: Okay. So it was. It had been a decade for this movie being out before it landed into your, your pool to watch. Okay. It just tells you how long of a tale this had. [00:04:02] Matthew: Yes, it is. It is such an, an influential movie. It is such a, it is a movie that. It's pointed to as the Bruce Lee movie in many ways. Although he made many movies. This is the one that had the, the strongest connection to Hollywood was the one that was really supposed to make him a, an international star and bring him to the attention of moviegoers in the West. And, uh, that that did not pan out, sadly, because he died so young. But it was compared to a lot of the movies he made in Hong Kong. It was such a big production. And got so much marketing and publicity behind it. And in some ways it's, it's as often happens, uh, charismatic star dies young and suddenly they, they have even more cachet. And they were even more charismatic. Posthumously. [00:04:52] Ian: Oh yeah. There's a mythologizing element when an actor, any, when any kind of performer dies before a career. Narratively has its standard arc that momentum turns into something else. That doesn't mean they aren't skilled, but it just means you've gotta filter through what you're gonna hear. 'cause it's going to change quite sharply. And I'm, I'm gonna just say this now, he is excellent. His fighting in this is amazing. And the physicality of how he, of how he moves is great. [00:05:28] Matthew: He was a remarkable, remarkable martial artist, of course, and that includes a lot of innovation in martial arts. He started out in Wing Chun and then learned from as many different martial arts as he could draw from, and took what was interesting and built his own style. Jeet Kun Do. Based upon, uh, a lot of that philosophy. And his original goal before he got into essentially movies and show business was to popularize the teaching of martial arts. , But he also had and or developed this great sense of showmanship and how to make this exciting and how to help put it on film that is really showcased so well in Enter the Dragon. [00:06:09] Ian: Yes. . [00:06:10] Matthew: Now, apart from his athleticism and physicality and martial arts skill, there's also the rest of the movie to contend with. [00:06:18] Ian: There's also the rest of the movie, and I'm just gonna put this in here first. [00:06:22] Matthew: Yeah. [00:06:22] Ian: This is a movie whose story is about a skilled martial artist being asked to go to a shady martial arts tournament in order to help. So, let me rephrase this another way. This is the best college production of a James Bond film I've ever seen, and somehow the only person who seems more upset of having to be on screen sometimes than Bruce Lee is Bruce Lee's character. [00:06:56] Matthew: Yeah, he's a character who is, is sort of just persuaded to, to be where he is and, and do what he does and we, we can talk about some of the motivations that give they character as well. But, but yeah, I, I talk a, a lot, probably too much about how everything is in some way a James Bond movie or maybe that means that a James Bond movie is everything. This is clearly, this was early 1970s. James Bond was still the hottest thing in movies. So they essentially constructed a James Bond movie in which they could insert Bruce Lee. [00:07:31] Ian: This came out the same year as Live and Let Die, so literally we'd just gone. From Connery into Lazenby to, wait a minute, nevermind Connery. And then right when he Connery is leaving again. It's, do you want to go Roger Moore or, we do have Bruce Lee over here as an option. It, it feels like a backdoor pilot to that, which isn't a bad idea. It's kind of cool. [00:08:05] Matthew: Oh yeah. [00:08:06] Ian: The problem is Bruce Lee is amazing at fighting, but I, he plays a strong silent type because he doesn't seem to be very comfortable reading lines, [00:08:20] Matthew: and they deal with that fairly well by putting him in the company of some, some very good actors who can handle more of the plot and the story and the dialogue parts of the movie, because we have John Saxon. We've got Jim Kelly, who was a martial artist, turned to actor, but has a different kind of presence on screen than Bruce Lee and is so much better with the dialogue and with operating opposite other actors in scenes that don't involve fighting. [00:08:51] Ian: Yes. [00:08:52] Matthew: In addition to just being such a cool guy, Jim Kelly is so cool, [00:08:56] Ian: Okay. I'm gonna just be very honest. I confused the heck at myself for a graphic design reason. Okay. The start of this film when they're putting up the actors. [00:09:04] Matthew: Yeah. [00:09:05] Ian: I first, for a moment, read it as starring Bruce John and Lee Saxon. Confused myself very, very deeply. [00:09:15] Matthew: That's [00:09:15] Ian: Unparallel [00:09:16] Matthew: Universe version of this movie. [00:09:17] Ian: Absolutely. You read it horizontally instead of vertically, you get something else. But honestly, Jim Kelly. John Saxon are all putting in so much to make this work. Every other main actor that gets that starring role, they, they have more presence than I expected. [00:09:40] Matthew: And uh, and while we're talking about the cast, we also have to mention Han, who's the bad guy He is the person with his private island. Yes. In which he, uh, he had, yeah, sorry. Private island on which he has his fortress and from which he is running his international drug and prostitution ring. And Han is played by, uh, Shih Kien. [00:10:10] Ian: Yes. [00:10:10] Matthew: Not his voice, [00:10:13] Ian: not his voice. That wasn't his voice. Oh. [00:10:16] Matthew: Han's voice was done uncredited, but dubbed by Keye Luke. [00:10:24] Ian: Okay. [00:10:25] Matthew: Who we spoke about very recently because he plays Po in Kung Fu. [00:10:31] Ian: That's him. [00:10:32] Matthew: Yes. Oh, [00:10:33] Ian: goodness. [00:10:33] Matthew: He, and he's had such a long career and was such a talented actor, and , Shih Kien has the, uh. The, the presence and the physicality perfect for Han. But to add that to, to Keye Luke's voice, it was a, a well done bad guy. [00:10:48] Ian: Oh yeah. That's, that's one of those tricks where it's like a lot of films in the past would do, you know, overdubbing an actor with a different voice in order to get. An actor who's having trouble with lines or for, retakes and everything else changes in the story and such. But there is, that is a tool that can be used to create this unreal presence. [00:11:16] Matthew: It is. [00:11:17] Ian: And the moment, the moment you say that, I'm like, yeah, his physicality and his vocals don't match up, but that makes him scary and disturbing. In a, in a specific way. I don't know if that's why they were using it here, but it's a fine example of how you can use that as a cinematic technique. [00:11:37] Matthew: Yes. It, it makes the character seem like something that was intentionally constructed, which is kind of. One of, uh, the, the points that Han makes in that speech we used at the beginning of the, the episode here about he, [00:11:50] Ian: yeah. [00:11:51] Matthew: Built himself and we all build ourselves in the fires of our will. Now, it's a technique that was used out of necessity a lot in, in Hong Kong and in Italy and other places where the movie studios were in the middle of a city and you couldn't get a quiet sound stage. So we would shoot, uh, and then in a recording booth, we would do the dialogue when we could, uh, control the audio. [00:12:13] Ian: Yes. But if you're going to, to look at like, how do I get this character to get that weird presence? You can cast two people to play one guy just in the future. Credit them both. [00:12:27] Matthew: And this predates video games, of course, but from our point of view, there is something very video gaming about this, movie. Oh, it sets absolutely artificial circumstances just to get all of these people onto the island. Participating in this martial arts tournament and infiltrating Han's enterprise because Han has every few years, has this invitation only martial arts tournament on his island. And it turns out this is how he recruits people to be his enforcers and to be the people who help operate and expand. And he, at one point later in the movie, he's trying to. Recruit John Saxon to help expand his drugs and prostitution enterprise into America. [00:13:17] Ian: Yeah. Thi this is like, I have played some Tekken in my day and I'm just like, I know this narrative. [00:13:25] Matthew: Yes. [00:13:26] Ian: Oh, absolutely. [00:13:29] Matthew: But before we even get to Han though, we, we first see Bruce Lee. At the Shaolin Temple where he is, uh, training and where he is as the, the top student slash teacher and Interesting. We see him in a training bout against another student. We also see him teaching a young student and expressing and conveying some of his philosophy. [00:13:55] Ian: Yes. [00:13:56] Matthew: And those are kind of cool scenes to establish this character we also established that he received an invitation to this tournament that ha's putting on and had no interest in attending until he is per persuaded to do so. [00:14:07] Ian: It's like, uh, it is very, very funny. It's the moment that it's like, oh, this is gonna be a James Bond film when the, I'm not with the British Agency. British agent wanders in. [00:14:19] Matthew: Yes. [00:14:19] Ian: It's like, let's have tea. I need you to go fight in that tournament. Oh yeah, I heard of that one. Well, will you fight in it? Maybe one moment. Let me go teach a guy. [00:14:30] Matthew: Right? [00:14:32] Ian: Like, huh. [00:14:34] Matthew: I'm from mi, the number doesn't matter, and we would like you to attend this tournament. [00:14:39] Ian: MI pound? [00:14:42] Matthew: And we also learn that, uh, that uh, Lee Bruce Lee's character [00:14:49] Ian: Yep. [00:14:50] Matthew: Has a, a personal reason, a personal vendetta against Han. So we've got some Fridging going on here. [00:14:58] Ian: Yes. Oh, [00:14:59] Matthew: sadly. Commonly, but sadly, [00:15:01] Ian: yeah. You ever had a tabletop group who decides that they're gonna just ignore the plot line that you were setting up early, so you have to throw in an extra set of stakes to get them to at least start the campaign. [00:15:14] Matthew: Right. [00:15:15] Ian: It very much had that. It's like, oh no, I don't, we don't wanna do a tournament arc. Uh uh. Your character does have a sister and she is kidnapped. Ah, fine. [00:15:25] Matthew: Yeah. Or in this case, Lee's sister was, was killed by, some of Han's Enforcers. [00:15:33] Ian: Yeah. [00:15:34] Matthew: And therefore he has a, a personal vendetta and a mission of vengeance in addition to wanting to bring down Han's criminal enterprise. [00:15:43] Ian: I do also like the, . The explanation of you, oh yeah, you need to get rid of this guy. Why not go in with there with a gun? It's like, we can't, there's law problems [00:15:55] Matthew: and not, yeah, there's, there's law problems. I would imagine there are security problems too. Hans Island seems to be very well fortified and there are a lot of security measures, but, uh, he routinely brings to his island people who are very good at fighting without weapons. Exactly. So let's get a few of them on our side and send them to the island. And that's what the British authorities do. [00:16:16] Ian: But it's, it, it is fun in a martial arts movie to have someone else being like, it's the first solution to punch them. That it's very, it's very smart. It's very, you know, understandable for this narrative and they actually deal with that. Plenty of stories just skip right past. So I'm like, yeah. Hey. Actually, they actually discussed why this has to be within its own genre [00:16:42] Matthew: and the motivations for, , Roper John Saxon's character and Williams John Kelly's character. They seem a little more straightforward. They, they came to this of their own free will. They got their invitations. Apparently they were sufficiently noteworthy martial artists in their own right to get invitations. Mm-hmm. Roper is. He likes to live well and has tremendous gambling debts. He's never met a bet he doesn't. He, uh, he wouldn't, [00:17:11] Ian: yeah, [00:17:12] Matthew: so he gambles a lot, is greatly in debt, and I guess he's here for the prize money and Williams just seems to be there for the fun of it. He likes the fight, he likes the competition and the winning. [00:17:27] Ian: Yeah. Jim Kelly is a man who is like. I need a larger stage. [00:17:36] Matthew: Right? ' [00:17:36] Ian: cause I am good And it must be acknowledged. [00:17:40] Matthew: There's a, a discussion between him and Han where Han is saying, you're here for the fight and Williams points out, well I'm here for the win. Exactly. And Han, when Han says that, , it's defeat that you must learn to deal with William's response to that is. It's just not even on my radar. When it, whenever it comes, I am not even gonna notice 'cause I'm gonna be looking so good. [00:18:05] Ian: Exactly. [00:18:06] Matthew: And he's got that great seventies look, he's, he's, he's terrific fashion sense. He's tall and lean and he's got the amazing Afro. [00:18:14] Ian: Oh yes. Uh, okay. If you've, it's a current meme, so I'm gonna slightly date our episode , by doing this. But there's a meme going around with artists of a fight in which someone stop like pauses and brushes their own hair as they're punching and kicking. And I'm like, of all of the people in this j Jim Kelly as Williams, he could have pulled that off in this film. Yes. Just throw a punch and fit and like, you know, style his hair. At the same time he's, he's got that swagger. [00:18:47] Matthew: Yeah. While he's defending himself, he's also checking himself out in the reflection of the bad guy's sword. Exactly. That's the kind of thing [00:18:55] Ian: Exactly. [00:18:58] Matthew: So we've got these two characters who are in many ways more interesting because there's more happening with them. And yet it's a Bruce Lee movie and he is the star and he's the one who's gone to the island and, uh, with this mission of more than just winning the tournament. So we get a lot of him. Ninja ing around the island to scope it out and find information about Han's, , operation that he can then pass back to the British authorities and give them, , the ability to come in and do something about it. [00:19:34] Ian: Once again, very video game-y of a movie. There is fighting tournament sections and then there's stealth action. Yes. And you go back and forth between those levels. [00:19:43] Matthew: And some of those kind of stealth set pieces were pretty good. We get to see him moving around the island at night when everybody's supposed to be in their quarters. So he's dodging guards and fighting guards and uh, finding secret passages and climbing down ropes and all this stuff, but. It's kind of start and stop because he'll get partway into this and then he'll have to back out because there are too many guards and he has to go back the next night. And meanwhile, Han is getting wind of the fact that somebody's doing all this and he doesn't know who. So he starts punishing the guards in public, maybe trying to bring out somebody who's, uh, uh, ethics won't allow this to continue. [00:20:25] Ian: I mean, Han rules his island with an iron fist. Literally, he has a prosthetic iron left hand [00:20:32] Matthew: yes, onto which he can snap various weapons and tools and versions of a hand. [00:20:39] Ian: Okay, I need to know. I need to know, did people make a Han action figure with the swappable hands? [00:20:50] Matthew: They did not to my knowledge because, this was before that was such a big business and this was definitely not marketed to kids. This is a very violent movie today. You'd probably re-edit it and release it as PG 13 if you could. [00:21:06] Ian: you would, and in 2000 you would in fact release the, there is in fact a Bruce Lee collection Han action figure with, with four different hands you can attach on. [00:21:21] Matthew: I spoke too soon. I should have known. [00:21:24] Ian: He's an action figure. Yes. Okay. That's pretty good. That is the most accurate action figure I've ever seen. 'cause the guy literally had that feature. But yeah, it did. That didn't come out until the two thousands, is that [00:21:39] Matthew: Yeah. Yeah. That was to, uh, to get our, our respective generations, I guess, discovering his movie later. And the first fight that we see Han involved in is the one where he takes out Williams. Yes, because Williams is the only person that was seen outside of his quarters at night. , Although he just wanted to enjoy the moonlight. Yeah. But because of that, he was the one who was the, the prime suspect for whoever is snooping around. There's big knockdown, drag out fight between Han and Williams, and later on we see Williams and they in prison. And a lot of guards. And a lot of guards. That's right. And Williams takes out all the guards, which is when Han steps in and proves himself, himself to be the, the match to any of the competitors in the tournament. [00:22:25] Ian: Mm-hmm. Because Han has this entire facility set up as he runs his tournaments, he makes his drugs. He tests his drugs on a variety of ladies there, and he trains a bunch of private military. Do I take it, go out in groups to go sell the drugs? [00:22:46] Matthew: I guess so. Right. And he wanted to, he was doing this all over Asia and I gather big parts of Europe and wanted to move into the Americas and that's why he wanted John Saxon as his guy. [00:22:58] Ian: He wants a roper to be his, his Americas man. I don't know what he wanted Williams to do. He's just a good fighter. He thought he could get him on his team. [00:23:07] Matthew: Yeah. I don't know that he needed, he wanted him for a specific role or just, oh, if he does well in the tournament, I'll offer him a job as, , one of my, , soldiers. [00:23:15] Ian: And, he's got his right hand man, but I'm trying to think of some of the other like. Combatants we see for only a little bit, like everyone's got an extra opponent at some point. There's multiple good fights. I'd say [00:23:29] Matthew: there are. We've got, uh, Bob Wall as O'Hara, who's Han's primary bodyguard, and he's the one we see in the flashback is most directly responsible for the, the death of Lee's sister. So he is, yes, as much as Han he's the person against whom, uh, Lee has a reason for this, vendetta. There are also other fighters we see in the tournament because we do see the first rounds of the tournament. We get to see,, Roper and Williams and Lee have these fights. Oh, and Samo hung early role. First Samo hung as one of Lee's opponents in the tournament. [00:24:04] Ian: Yeah. [00:24:05] Matthew: Or was that, was he his opponent in the tournament or at the Shaolin tempo? I forget. I can't see. Can't remember. I think he, Sam hung fight against Bruce Lee. Very cool. [00:24:13] Ian: Yeah, that's, it's pretty good., I do know that, , one of the henchmen in their masks and everything else [00:24:20] Matthew: Yeah. [00:24:20] Ian: Is an uncredited role for a young Jackie Chan. [00:24:23] Matthew: Yes. There's so many martial artists in this movie and so many people too. This, this is one of those movies that, I don't know if it's the first, but it's the iconic scenes of these big aerial shots of the fortress and the multiple courtyards and the ranks and ranks of martial artists practicing their techniques as they're training and getting ready for the tournament and getting ready to do Han's bidding. It's, he really, it makes it clear. This guy has an army and it is a well-trained army. [00:24:57] Ian: There's this weird mix. We were, I was calling it a college production of a bond film earlier, and that's because there's this, this slight flimsiness to the sets and design sometimes. Part of that is because everyone gets thrown through things and so seeing everything get broken and have to be made. In a breakaway style sometimes adds a slight level of artifice. [00:25:20] Matthew: Yeah. [00:25:21] Ian: But it's also because so much of their budget, their budget was not that that much. It was 800. 850,000. [00:25:30] Matthew: Yeah. [00:25:31] Ian: But a lot of that went into just people, the number of people, which meant that the environments of a sets were a little less, the environments that they had, like outdoor stuff. And the people are all fantastic when they're using those. [00:25:48] Matthew: Yes. [00:25:48] Ian: We've talked about movies where you can see the budget on the screen. The budget is in the crowds, the budget is in the, the gardens and the stepped, uh, the stepped risers that, uh, everyone sits at stone walls to, to watch these fights. [00:26:06] Matthew: Yeah. They, they establish the scale and the scope of Han's Fortress and Han's operation. So that we always have that in the back of our minds when we're seeing the set pieces on sound stages, which are small and sometimes claustrophobic. So while we've got Williams and Roper and Han kind of driving the plot. We then have almost in a separate movie, apart from the tournament scenes, Bruce Lee doing his spy infiltration stuff. And that's where it is extremely video gamey in that they'll make a point of he finds something because he's got a specific use for it later. [00:26:46] Ian: Yes. [00:26:47] Matthew: And Bruce Lee in this, in these scenes, he has this pretty good way of. Of portraying a character who, you know, I'm so much more clever than all these people around, and I'm, I'm kind of bored by all of this, he goes back to the secret passage he found earlier, and there's a snake. So he doesn't just get rid of the snake, he gathers it up and puts it in a bag and it's a very much, oh, I've added snake to my inventory. Exactly. [00:27:14] Ian: Thank you. [00:27:16] Matthew: So later on, when he has to infiltrate , the radio room, which is manned by two of Han's people, he just opens the door crack and puts the snake in, and then sits on the steps looking really bored and waits for them to break out through the windows and run away. [00:27:33] Ian: There, there's a specific kind of emotional, uh, like boredom, but engaged boredom that comes from trying a level in a game a couple of times and failing. So you go back through and follow the steps to get back to where you ran into that challenge. [00:27:52] Matthew: Right, [00:27:53] Ian: and it's, there's something about this like, no, no, no, no, no. You know, Bruce Lee. Has Bruce Lee here has absolutely played this level before, and he's not thinking about how to get rid of these guards. He's thinking about two rooms from now dealing with that problem because he's just getting back through this from the last save point at this moment. [00:28:16] Matthew: But eventually he fails a stealth check at some point. And the guards, absolutely guards are, are aware of him. And this sets up one of the main sequences in the movie, which is this. Uh, this fight in the, the dungeons underneath Han's Fortress, where it's Bruce Lee against wave after wave of guards. And that is so well designed to show off so many different aspects of Bruce Lee's martial arts ability because we see a lot of hand-to-hand fighting with him against. Groups of guards as they rush him, and then he winds up in possession of various weapons. He takes a staff from one of them and then is fighting with a staff, and he takes nunchuck. So we get to see how good he is with nunchucks. [00:28:59] Ian: Mm-hmm. [00:29:00] Matthew: It keeps building , but they compress it all into this one long sequence, which is fascinating. And it gets us the ability to see things we don't see in the purely unarmed hand-to-hand combat of the tournament. [00:29:13] Ian: It really helps add to the, the exhibition of skill that is this movie at various points. [00:29:22] Matthew: Mm-hmm. [00:29:24] Ian: Uh, I will say I loved that scene, but I had to watch it a couple of times. [00:29:29] Matthew: Yeah. [00:29:30] Ian: Because there is one combatant in this entire film that is stronger than anyone else. They know a technique that is instantly dangerous to me, and that is Lao Schiffrin, who I'm absolutely certain is the person who taught John Carpenter how to make a soundtrack that knocks me unconscious in one blow. [00:29:54] Matthew: The [00:29:54] Ian: soundtrack, I don't know what it is. [00:29:56] Matthew: It knocked you out and entered the dragon? [00:29:58] Ian: Yes. I don't know why, but I had to rewatch that fight scene a couple of times 'cause I'm there like, oh, this is engaging. What is happening? Me mutes it. Oh, I can watch. Now. Why is that doing? Why is the music do that? To me, [00:30:18] Matthew: this isn't, it's an early seventies movie. There are some very funky parts of this soundtrack that I love. Yeah. But yeah, it does have kind of that even steady bass line that might be part of what gets you in those John Carpenter scores. [00:30:32] Ian: Yeah. But I will say it's like. The, the music is designed to not get in the way. Mm-hmm. Because there's all this action and presence. Yeah. But if you're just left with the music every once in a while, it's not, not bad, but it's just not my thing. I can like a funky track, but I, I was very amused. And if we were talking about that fight scene, I, I re-watched it, but not for the reason you'd think, oh boy. but yeah, the fight scene is excellent. He proves himself against all of the different, hench people. He knocks them out one after another, I think. Doesn't one fall into the toxic acid? [00:31:11] Matthew: I think so. [00:31:12] Ian: Pit, [00:31:12] Matthew: yes. [00:31:13] Ian: Yeah, because of course there's a toxic acid pit, right. [00:31:16] Matthew: and that's used later on by Han as he's trying to persuade John Saxon's Roper to join him because that, uh, he, he makes sure that Roper sees what happened to Williams and that ends in the toxic acid pit as well. [00:31:29] Ian: Yeah. It's interesting that, during the big fights and such, there is a lot of Han like respecting how good a fighter Lee is. It's not, oh, deal with him, it's a, oh, he's good. Don't, don't get killed. Don't get killed against this guy. Just, just get him outta here [00:31:50] Matthew: because there is something we learned about Han early on in that he trained at the same Shaolin temple. Yes. As Lee, but he went on to become a criminal and to dishonor the art and the temple and it, and its heritage. And, and that's another of the motivations for dealing with him. [00:32:10] Ian: Yes. I forget by the point that they had the underground fight, had Lee already gotten to kill Han's Bodyguard. [00:32:20] Matthew: Um, I don't think so. I think that is a, is a bit later. He does eventually kill O'Hara because there's a big fight towards the end in which, uh, and it's in, in the tournament ostensibly. Yeah. But it's, or it starts out as part of the tournament, but then I think O'Hara like pulls a weapon in the middle of this, um. Because he's humiliated by Lee. He's using a weapon or a broken bottle, and suddenly all bets are off. And Lee kills , O'Hara. [00:32:55] Ian: He, he, yeah. It's, it's a broken, it's a broken bottle and it's, it's the one time we get to see Lee, like really get angry where he does this, like double foot, like this double leg stomp. [00:33:10] Matthew: Yes. [00:33:11] Ian: Onto him and just. We don't get to see how, we don't get to see the impact. We just get to see Lee's face, [00:33:18] Matthew: right [00:33:18] Ian: as he goes, like wild with anger, getting this vengeance. [00:33:22] Matthew: And it's an example [00:33:23] Ian: of that which is honestly creepier. [00:33:24] Matthew: Yeah. The expressiveness on Lee's face in shots like that, you, you don't have to see what's happening below the frame. 'cause you can tell from a little bit of sound design and a lot of expressive acting on, uh, Bruce Lee's part. [00:33:36] Ian: Bruce Lee has one of those like rubber faces in terms of extreme gesturing. [00:33:42] Matthew: Yeah. [00:33:43] Ian: That like he's using it in a martial arts action, but actors like Jim Carrey use it in comedic for the same way. They've got a similar like amount of like intensity to face. [00:33:56] Matthew: That is a comparison I never would've thought of is Bruce Lee to Jim Carrey. But you're right. [00:34:02] Ian: Oh, [00:34:02] Matthew: thank you. Okay. It's a certain kind of, the, the dial is set way up there at the same kind of place. It's just, uh, used in different ways. [00:34:11] Ian: Yeah. [00:34:13] Matthew: and we've also learned that Han has slave labor on the island because they just, Shanghai, drunkards and people no one's going to miss from, waterfront bars all over Asia and bring them. And so he's got cells. Filled with them until he needs them to do something. [00:34:29] Ian: Mm-hmm. [00:34:30] Matthew: And also, there's a contact that Lee has on the island. This mysterious British intelligence agency he's working on has had a woman who was able to infiltrate the island previously, but they haven't gotten any communication from her. He was supposed to make contact with her, , which he does. So he does have an ally who knows a little more about the island and who can move around in different ways than himself. [00:34:51] Ian: Yeah, that's played by Betty Chung, and this was one of her, like last films. Oh. Because she's a major recording artist and apparently was a musical talent who also did some acting, [00:35:04] Matthew: and eventually after Lee kills O'Hara in what remains of the tournament. All, all pretense of it being a tournament are off and Han just keeps telling more and more people to go attack Lee and Roper and it becomes this free for all in which, it's the two of them taking out scores and scores of bad guys. [00:35:28] Ian: I, I do love the shots though of Han then trying to run away. Yes. In the chaos and it just like, it, it looks a little, a little silly. Okay. While they're distracted, I'm the bad guy. Running away. Running away. [00:35:46] Matthew: Yeah. It's, it's a little bit of the body language of a professor fate from, uh, the great race. Like, ah, now's my chance. Absolutely swirl my cloak and exit through my secret passage. [00:35:59] Ian: Oh goodness. [00:36:02] Matthew: So Han because, because Han, because Han is Lee's target, Lee kind of leaves roper to deal with the hoards of, uh, of, of bad guy Martial artists on his own. Although he does get help because, uh, the undercover operative, she goes down and frees all the slaves who have a vested interest in coming and joining the fight against all of Han's soldiers. [00:36:27] Ian: Exactly. So, [00:36:28] Matthew: but meanwhile, Lee is pursuing Han and then we, that, that brings us to the long final sequence of this movie, of this kind of running fight, which through Han's museums and offices and things. [00:36:40] Ian: I, I'd, I'd say that there's a distinct two parts to that fight. [00:36:44] Matthew: Yeah. [00:36:45] Ian: Very understandably. There's the main like running fight, but then there's also the mirror scene we get this fight. It runs into Han's Museum of Weaponry, which is such a fun environment for a fight like this, [00:37:02] Matthew: which includes one of his old spare claws that he winds up, uh, attaching. [00:37:06] Ian: Yeah. Which very much looks like an old prototype 'cause it's a block of iron with five kitchen knives. Like embedded into it, like, discount Wolverine [00:37:18] Matthew: and that leads to some of the iconic, superficial wounds that Lee gets with the stripes across his torso and all that. [00:37:26] Ian: Yeah. Very, very much mauled by a tiger. scratches. [00:37:29] Matthew: Yep. [00:37:30] Ian: But then that leads into Han trying to escape through a secret passage into his mirror room or mirror closet. I don't what [00:37:42] Matthew: I, it's, it's unclear. Is this just a very peculiar dressing room? Is this a special training room? And I don't know if it's the first instance of anything like this in a movie. It is certainly, I'd say the most iconic and the most influential this. Slow creepy pursuit through mirrors and you don't know what's a real image and what's a reflection. And when you're seeing who. [00:38:07] Ian: This episode of this old evil lair, we'll be refurbishing, uh, giant confusing mirror. maze. These were very popular in the seventies. And to see one intact like this is, oh dang it. There's a guy stabbed through the heart on the wall. That's going to take a lot to clean up. [00:38:25] Matthew: Well, now that you've been getting your older, uh, Lego and 3D printing equipment outta the basement, I know what to do with that space. [00:38:32] Ian: Yeah, [00:38:32] Matthew: it's time to build our, our, our mirror maze. [00:38:35] Ian: That's where you put it. Absolutely. You gotta have one of those. [00:38:38] Matthew: Yeah. It's Why wouldn't you? [00:38:41] Ian: I don't know why this is here other than being really cool, but it is really cool with this like, stalking across each other and, punching at mirrors and the guy's not actually there and. I Googled it and people have, people have drawn up, uh, maps to try to figure out that environment. Oh, cool. To figure out what the layout was. [00:39:04] Matthew: Do they agree or is there a lot of, uh, dispute as to the actual [00:39:08] Ian: layout? I found two different versions and an entire thread arguing which one was better for setting up this exact environment in a tabletop game. [00:39:17] Matthew: Oh, nice. [00:39:18] Ian: Which is good. [00:39:20] Matthew: And it leads directly to the kinds of things that we saw in Conan The Destroyer. Yes. And in, the mirror funhouse maze in Something Wicked This Way Comes. [00:39:31] Ian: That was not the reference I was expecting, but it's like, that's what, like, no, no. It's like the moment I saw that I'm like, oh, hey, you know, I know this. Han's gonna come out. He is withered with no, with all his life force drained, doesn't he? Nah. I guess kind of. [00:39:48] Matthew: Yeah. It seemed like Han had everything but a carousel. He could have used that. [00:39:53] Ian: He kind of did have a carousel with that spinning entrance door he winds up on at the end. [00:40:00] Matthew: That's true. That's true. [00:40:03] Ian: Sorry, they're a little bit dark there, but I do love the, uh, the whole setup of, you know, during the armory fight, uh, I forget who threw the spear, but it was put through the wall and that meant that there's this spear sticking outta the other side of that wall. [00:40:20] Matthew: Yeah. [00:40:20] Ian: Which is what finally does Han in. [00:40:23] Matthew: Right. He gets kicked into his own spear protruding from the other chamber. Mm-hmm. [00:40:28] Ian: Environmental hazard. [00:40:31] Matthew: So, in the end, Han has been, killed in this final showdown between him and Lee. Most of Han's army has been destroyed because Lee and Roper took out their, their main enforcers and the big fight, including all of the enslaved people from the basement. Helped take out many of the others and bodyguard [00:40:49] Ian: got killed. Yeah. [00:40:50] Matthew: Han also had a secretary who was this tall, beautiful, blonde woman who, um, made a connection, let's say with, uh, with Roper, but she winds up dead by the end of this, so there's not much left. When finally the British authorities received the radio message that Lee had sent earlier and send helicopters to the island. [00:41:16] Ian: It's just, it's just Lee and Roper like giving each other a thumbs up as the military comes to clean the place up. [00:41:22] Matthew: Yeah, [00:41:22] Ian: which is delightfully like aggressive in terms of it's like, oh, movie's over. But also, [00:41:30] Matthew: yes, [00:41:31] Ian: it also has this element of silliness. [00:41:33] Matthew: We also get one of those final exasperated expressions from Lee as he sees the helicopters. Okay, now you show up. Thanks guys. [00:41:41] Ian: Yeah, exactly. Like, oh, thanks. It makes me wonder if this movie was going like, because he died in 73, the year this movie came out. [00:41:55] Matthew: Yeah. [00:41:57] Ian: There's an element here that almost feels like, Lee and Roper were supposed to be a duo that would do other things together. Now that they had this bonding experience. There's an element to it all. [00:42:10] Matthew: That must have been in the back of somebody's mind at MGM or somewhere, uh, about making this a franchise because of course, the James Bond franchise and others were so popular and I could see that having happened, , certainly, following Lee and having John Saxon to carry some of the other parts of the movie. It, it's interesting to think of what might've, might've happened there. Of course, you'd have to give Lee. More reasons to go off in these adventures because what we've seen of the characters so far, he would've been more likely than anything else just to go back to the Shaolin Temple to be a student and a teacher. Oh, did you know you had another sister? [00:42:49] Ian: Yeah. I mean, you, you get, honestly, that's part of what the funniness is for. And we're gonna get in, I, I kind of wanna get into that later, but that's an element of the, of the video gaminess to this movie. Yeah. In a weird way. Which is the fact that a lot of the things that got inspired by this started from that more grounded nature. [00:43:12] Matthew: Huh. [00:43:13] Ian: And are only the chaotic, weird stories they are now, after having gotten. Dozens of entries. Huh. And so I look at this, I'm like, enter the dragon. If it had become a franchise, could have gotten really weird. [00:43:28] Matthew: Right? But I think we might be heading towards our final questions as we talk about this movie and what might have come. Come after. [00:43:35] Ian: I think we are. [00:43:36] Matthew: Alright. Well please do stay tuned as we talk about whether we recommend this movie for viewing. What we think would be interesting to see develop from this, be it sequels or, or reboots or whatnot. But first, in the meantime, if you're enjoying the Inter Millennium Media Project, , podcast, please go to IMMProject.com because that's where you'll find all of our back episodes. About 200 of them. Now we're, we're in our, we're heading towards episode 200 plus. There are bonuses there. Also, if you go to IMMProject.com, you'll find ways to contact us. We would love to hear from you by email, by US Mail at our post office box, on our discord, you can also find us on Blue Sky and on Mastodon. And if you want more of the IMMP beyond our back episodes and you wanna support the show, if you go to our Patreon, which is linked from that website, you will be able to join us and get bonus audio content you can follow, uh, free of charge. You can join starting at $3 a month to get bonus audio content. And if you join at the movie club level, you'll also get a mysterious DVD in the mail periodically. [00:44:44] Ian: It's a fun time. Get to see films that you didn't expect. Find connections, maybe find new favorites. It's a great way to do this. [00:44:53] Matthew: And Ian, where can people find you? [00:44:55] Ian: It can be found online as ItemCrafting. Most places be that ItemCrafting.com or ItemCraftingLive on Twitch. I've been streaming a bunch of fun games, painting a bunch of minis. Feel free to join. It's an excellent time. I. And how about you, dad? [00:45:12] Matthew: Well, you can find me. Go to ByMatthewPorter.com and you'll find links to all the things I'm doing, which include my YouTube channel where I do movie reviews and movie theater reviews and some, , travel destinations. And you'll also find at ByMatthewPorter.com. News about my book that is coming out in May. It's currently available for pre-order, uh, in ebook and paperback. There's an audio book plan for later this year. The title is Questions for the Dead, and it is a modern day paranormal detective story. [00:45:45] Ian: I think it's really fun. It's got an interesting world and. An interesting take on our world in that sense. So I really like it. [00:45:52] Matthew: It's, uh, it's, it's a little bit of the Rockford files meets the X-Men. [00:45:56] Ian: Yes. Very much X-Men in there. [00:45:59] Matthew: So our final questions, first one, it's a movie, so screen or no screen. [00:46:11] Ian: This is not, this is a really good film, and I'm gonna say screen, but I'm, it's, I feel weirdly hesitant to say that just because it's plodding, it's, it's a little rough around the edges in a way that usually I wouldn't give a screen to, but it feels. So earnest and it's so influential that it's getting a screen from me overcoming some of those problems, I'm noting. [00:46:42] Matthew: Yeah, I would say screen, be aware of some of its, limitations. It's rough spots based upon when it was made and how it was made and being an international production of the sort that it was. But I would say screen both because it is a fun movie and has a lot of interesting scenes, and also because of how influential it was and just how amazing Bruce Lee is in it. But, uh, but yeah, it, it does have, its, its rough spots. And I'll say that this, when I first saw it, I saw it on television, so I was watching the broadcast TV edit. So the version that we saw from the, the DVD or the Blu-ray. Was was more violent than the TV edit and also had nudity in things that were taken out of the TV edit that I saw decades ago. So it was a different movie in that sense. In some ways it was a smoother cut than the, the choppier version I had seen on tv, but it, it still has its rough spots. [00:47:38] Ian: Yeah. [00:47:39] Matthew: So the next question then is. Revive, reboot, or rest in peace. [00:47:48] Ian: That's so hard because this movie kind of influenced everything after it for being so influential. [00:47:57] Matthew: I don't, there's a [00:47:58] Ian: lot of things that are spiritual successors. [00:48:00] Matthew: There are, and I don't think we could have a revival. We can't, I don't think we could make another movie involving the character of Lee or the character of Roper. Uh, maybe a sequel about the rise of Han. That is in the same continuity as this movie. But apart from that, I don't know. [00:48:17] Ian: You see, that's the thing. I don't think you can have an a different person play Lee, but I feel like you could do a story of Roper. [00:48:26] Matthew: Oh, that's true. [00:48:27] Ian: Or I feel like you could do a story of like an older roper who right when he'd made this bond with this, fellow martial artist. His friend also didn't make it. [00:48:41] Matthew: Yeah. [00:48:43] Ian: And there's this element of like, I'm picking up what needs to get done. I was a man, not in a good place. I was targeted as a person who could have been corrupted by this. Hmm. I was shown a better path by a friend who is now gone and now I'm being a man of vengeance. Into there. You'd get a very modern, you know, action movie take, but I think it could work. It could, if you wanted to do that as a sequel, [00:49:12] Matthew: it could. And he had a very close bond with, with Williams. We learned that they, the two of them fought together in Vietnam. In the sixties mm-hmm. And maintained that bond, so you conceivably could do a prequel involving Roper and Williams. But yeah, an interesting question of what's new for Roper Lee has , the temple to go back to, what does Roper have now that his best friend is dead and he, uh, presumably isn't getting his debts paid off Exactly. But uh, but yet now he has a different kind of motivation. [00:49:45] Ian: A man wandering into the end of the seventies, started the eighties , with debts on his back and ghosts in his head. It, it kind of works. [00:49:53] Matthew: It could, I'm inclined to say rest in peace. Let this movie be what it is. Go ahead and watch it, but if you're gonna do anything else with it, the idea of the, the Future Adventures of Roper is probably the most interesting idea. [00:50:06] Ian: Yeah, I honestly, the rest in peace is the right thing for it. If you want more of this movie. There are so many other things that are love letters to this film. [00:50:19] Matthew: And of course there are other Bruce Lee movies, movies he made in Hong Kong. Yes. Prior to this movies that he had shot. Most of that were released after this. And they kind of edited around the fact that they didn't have Lee anymore. [00:50:32] Ian: Exactly. So, [00:50:32] Matthew: and those are worth seeing as well. [00:50:35] Ian: I mean, uh, game of Death came out. Five years later. [00:50:41] Matthew: Yep. [00:50:42] Ian: With, uh, with editing to make it work. [00:50:46] Matthew: Yeah. It's, it's rough as a movie, but it has some very good scenes. [00:50:50] Ian: That's what I have heard. but yeah, I think, I think it's a rest in peace. I'm with you. [00:50:55] Matthew: Yep. [00:50:55] Ian: It's just, it's, it was interesting. It was fascinating. It was, I'm glad I wound up watching it more than once in the way I did, because I got to enjoy it more than once. [00:51:09] Matthew: Great. [00:51:11] Ian: I kind of wish I'd realized how rough it was before I'd gone in. [00:51:15] Matthew: Ah. [00:51:15] Ian: Which is part of why I'm glad I'm getting to say this now, like mm-hmm. You know, this is completely worth it, but don't expect. High Polish like you'd expect nowadays, [00:51:25] Matthew: yeah. Be aware of what [00:51:26] Ian: be [00:51:26] Matthew: getting into. [00:51:27] Ian: Yeah. This wasn't even a high polish film for when it was coming out, but it's a really good film [00:51:33] Matthew: and there are a lot of reasons for that. Between budget and the, the, the various influences it had and the various organizations and countries involved in production, it has to be challenging to take, those different sensibilities to filmmaking and acting and film release. And try to put those into one movie. Given all of that, it's, it is an achievement. [00:51:53] Ian: Oh, absolutely. [00:51:56] Matthew: And it was fun getting a, getting a chance to see this again. It was fun getting to, to show this, to you because it is such an influential martial arts movie, it's not the only influential martial arts movie and there are others. There's a very, very different. Perhaps equally influential martial arts movie from about a decade later that I think we're going to have to talk about soon. [00:52:21] Ian: Yeah. I gotta say, one of the thugs on the golf course. [00:52:25] Matthew: Yeah, [00:52:26] Ian: looked really familiar to me actually, but I really expected him to see, to see him in a red shirt that said referee. So we'll have to find out why a bit later. [00:52:37] Matthew: But with that, uh, we, we will be back. In a couple of weeks with more tales of media from the 20th century. [00:52:46] Ian: In the meantime, go find something new to watch.